Newbie Modification Information - Page 3

tc · 10-31-2008, 05:19 PM

How much does what cost?

Locking hubs? About $100 and 1/2 hr if you have a preTaco. About $1000 and days of professional labor if you have a 1996+ ADD rig.

Locking diffs?
Anywhere from free (welded spider gears) to about $850 (ARB)

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kennyboy019 · 10-31-2008, 08:16 PM

Yes, the locking diff was what I wanted. I have 87 so I have the manual locking hubs.

dud122 · 11-04-2008, 06:01 PM

hi all
very informative thread here, answered a lot of questions for me. I just bought an 02 tacoma double cab, 4x4 - stock. going with your priority list of mods i decided to hold off on the lift. 1. drivetrain - since it came with the rear locker i'll move on to saving up for some armor (smart?) 2. armor - probably sliders then front bumper then rear. 3. i will need to get new tires before i get too far down the list of armor so here are the questions...

can i fit 33's on this truck without lifting it?

what is a good mud and rock tire that will spend most of its time on pavement?

would 33's cause me to modify anything other than a possible lift?

what would be the best way to lift it 1-2" without having to do too many other mods and extensions?

thanks a lot

AxleIke · 11-05-2008, 12:20 AM

A good mud and rock tire is not going to be an ideal choice for a "most of the time on pavement" tire.

First question is: Where are you located? The type of terrain is going to be the most important factor in determining a tire. For example, if you live out west, and see a lot of dirt and rock, and once and a while some mud, an all terrain would work well for you. But if you live out east or in the PNW, you will need a pretty serious mud tire.

Before the 33 question can be answered, we'll need to figure out the type of tire.

The rest of your questions can be answered in the 1995.5-2004 taco section. Lots of good info there.

dud122 · 11-05-2008, 04:11 AM

i'm in watkins glen, ny. i guess i would see more dirt than mud.

thanks

JustAnotherJ · 01-03-2009, 07:46 PM

This is why I joined this site. Professionalism. I have not seen any disrespect after 2 hours of reading and I'm thoroughly impressed. As a new '06 4runner 4x4 sport owner, i look forward to learning from you all.

FirstYota86 · 01-06-2009, 06:38 PM

.....

walkdog0530 · 01-10-2009, 03:25 PM

(deleted)

first_toyo_owner · 01-14-2009, 10:28 PM

hey i have a 90 4runner 2 door now I have been looking to make it more trail worthy after I pay off the loan heh. but as it sits right now i still use it as a day to day vehicle. Should I just focus on tires and armor. I got new shocks in it but its stock and I don't want it huge due to what everyone has said in this post. it can go over most stuff I want it to. But with rubbing all you need is a sawsall and a hammer? sounds easy enough i guess but i take it you need to cover up the cut marks as well? sorry if these questions are dumb lol I am still learning

AxleIke · 01-14-2009, 11:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by first_toyo_owner

hey i have a 90 4runner 2 door now I have been looking to make it more trail worthy after I pay off the loan heh. but as it sits right now i still use it as a day to day vehicle. Should I just focus on tires and armor. I got new shocks in it but its stock and I don't want it huge due to what everyone has said in this post. it can go over most stuff I want it to. But with rubbing all you need is a sawsall and a hammer? sounds easy enough i guess but i take it you need to cover up the cut marks as well? sorry if these questions are dumb lol I am still learning

This post was made for a set of guidelines to make people think before blowing money on their rigs, so that they can blow money in an effective manner

Some recommendations I'd have are:

Get a set of stock sized tires, but in a more aggressive tread. I wouldn't jump up in tire size until you've gotten out on the trail for a while

Get armor as you can afford it. Wheel it.

Then regear with a locker for the rear.

Keep in mind the following:

Internet boards like this one can be a great resource for finding information, and tips/tricks. Unfortunately, they also lead people to believe that a truck needs to be made "trail worthy". This is not the case.

Your truck, with a decent set of tires, is already quite trail worthy. Some recovery/safety gear IS necessary, as it could save your life if you get stuck. Other than that, wheel your truck. Nothing more than that.

If you do it that way, your own experiences will teach you two things: 1. How to drive offroad. Probably the most valuable thing you can put in your truck for offroading is a good driver. You don't get good without practice. 2. How to mod your truck for the wheeling that YOU enjoy. Everyone will tell you how THEY think you should build the rig. After you've been out on a few roads/trails, you'll start to see areas where your truck can improve. Those are the areas you should hit first.

Generally, people find that open diffs are a drag. Lockers fix that. Tons of info available at this site to help you out when you feel ready to make some purchases.

PaulCA · 01-16-2009, 07:24 PM

Thanks for this informative, great thread. New T4R owner as of last week - got a 2006 V8 Ltd. with automatic transmission. I've searched the forums and internet and can't seem to answer what I'm sure is an inept question - if my truck has an electronic locking differential switch, wouldn't lockers be redundant? I'm not sure I understand the difference between the manufacturer's "differential lock" function and "lockers" people talk about in these forums.
Here's my rough plans for mods to my T4R - appreciate any comments:
1) New tires/wheels - downsizing to 17" rims from 18" and getting the BF Goodrich 265/70/17 AT KO's. I understand these are about as big as I can go w/o trimming and/or lifting.
2) Replace running boards with sliders
3) Shockworks front bumper
4) Undercarriage skid plates/armor
5) Add a rear bumper replacement
6) If I get to six anytime soon I'll be surprised! At that point its a wish list of driving lights, safari carrier, winch, and as I learn more I'd imagine drivetrain+gearing.

DC.Woods · 01-16-2009, 07:40 PM

(deleted)

PaulCA · 01-16-2009, 07:48 PM

Didn't realize the stock locking diff was only on the rear...would it be a big improvement to get front lockers then?

BLKNBLU · 01-16-2009, 08:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DC.Woods

Yep you have a selectable electronic locking rear diff. AKA rear locker. It should serve you well. Enjoy your 4RNR!

Hold on there. I don't think that is right. First let me say that this generation of 4Runner is not my strong point so lets get a definitive answer from someone with more expertise, but I believe there are no true rear diff lockers after the 2000 model, although the 2009 "Trail Edition" now offers one again. I think what Toyota called a "center diff lock" is in actuality more of a t case device that transfers power front to rear or some such. Somebody can straighten me out on the details , but that is my understanding of it. To PaulCA, I don't think you have a locking rear diff. I believe your center diff lock is generally helpful for bad road conditions but of minimal or marginal help off road.

tc · 01-16-2009, 08:49 PM

On a 2006 V8, the locking is for the center differential - essentially making it a "normal" 4WD vehicle with the tcase "locked" - otherwise there's a limited slip action in the center diff, meaning it's really only one wheel drive - although that wheel could be on the front or rear axle. Locking the center diff ensures that you have at least one wheel on each axle spinning.

AxleIke · 01-16-2009, 09:38 PM

Yeah, this sounds like a locking center diff. I'm betting this truck has full time 4wd. If so, when you push the diff lock button, you get a normal transfer case. Essentially, you get what a part time 4wd has. You still have open diffs.

So no, a locker in either diff would not be redundant. You have to lock the center to get what the rest of us have stock. You would add lockers from there.

PaulCA · 01-16-2009, 10:06 PM

Correct - it is full time 4WD. Thanks for all the help, seems like I've got some homework to do.

BLKNBLU · 01-16-2009, 10:17 PM

Also this forum

http://www.toyota120.com/forum/index.php

may be helpful to you. It is specifically for your generation rig. I haven't noodled around there much yet, so I don't know what the general character of the board is like. I found it while looking into the 2009 4Runner as I'm intrigued by the locking diff. It looks however, like that is more of a pipedream for me right now though.

skibum707 · 01-17-2009, 06:50 PM

So ya im completely new at this whole thing and this looked like a good place to start with my potentially dumb questions so im just gonna lay um out and see if anyone can help me.

I just inherited my 98 4runner and ive been takin it wheelin around my town of santa rosa and im looking to fix it up for some real trails.

First dumb question is does the RR diferential lock have anything to do w/ lockers?

BLKNBLU · 01-17-2009, 07:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by skibum707

First dumb question is does the RR diferential lock have anything to do w/ lockers?

Yes! This should mean you have a Toyota factory electronic locking differential in the rear. (you lucky devil) You can read up more about your rig here on YT in the "knowledgebase section" here:

http://www.yotatech.com/~corey/4runner_faq.htm
especially scroll down to #9 on this one to learn about lockers

http://www.top4runners.com/ja/runhist.html
click on 3rd generation then 1998 to learn about your truck on this one

If you're still unsure look at your rear diff to see if it has an extra gizmo on it like this axle. I stole this pic off craigslist so it may not last forever.

AxleIke · 01-18-2009, 12:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by skibum707

does the RR diferential lock have anything to do w/ lockers?

x2 on BLKNBLU's post.

In short, yes, it does, as a RR differential lock IS a locker. One of the better ones out there. Yours came factory, which is awesome for you.

skibum707 · 01-19-2009, 11:42 AM

sweet news ill be more greatful of that from now on. However i have another question.. Ive been looking at some armor stuff and skidplates look like a good idea and ive notice some of the hardcore rigs have like arb or tjm bumpers on them but i cant afford one and im not sure that id really need it so a good grille guard looked like a better option any comments on that? or suggestions of brands?

BLKNBLU · 01-19-2009, 12:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by skibum707

sweet news ill be more greatful of that from now on. However i have another question.. Ive been looking at some armor stuff and skidplates look like a good idea and ive notice some of the hardcore rigs have like arb or tjm bumpers on them but i cant afford one and im not sure that id really need it so a good grille guard looked like a better option any comments on that? or suggestions of brands?

Your thinking is right on target. You have the drivetrain in good shape so it's time to move on to armor. Generally grill guards are flimsy and not particularly helpful IMO and might even cause damage that you might otherwise not have gotten. However I could see if you mostly traveled in brushy conditions there might be some use to one. But I'm biased against them so let me leave it at that and let others argue the pros of them. (if there are any)

I'd be more inclined to steer you to sliders and skid plates. For skid plates get Budbuilt. Period. End of discussion.
http://www.budbuilt.com/new/96-02%204Runner.html

For sliders, there are many good ones out there and you are lucky to have many of the manufacturers near you in Cali.

Marlin in Fresno
Trail Gear in Fresno
Richard Stubbs in Susanville (what I've got)
All Pro in Hemet
Demello in Corona

With any of those you could drive to them and save shipping and have them installed right there at the vendor.

And before I forget, I want to remind anyone reading the thread that TJM has gotten out of the North American market altogether so the only way to get their stuff now is used or maybe some old stock lying around a shop somewhere. (unlikely)

hoytyota84 · 03-03-2009, 09:52 PM

ok, im convinced, no lift. but is one set of lockers better than others. i called 4wheel parts and asked prices without installation, limited slip in front and i dont know what in back, $837. kinda expected them to cost more. did i get the price on a cheap set up. is the tru trac worth it? i have a '90 pick up ext cab. not sure if that helps or not. i also need some info on replacing my engine, have 4cyl, want V6 but i dont know if i can in Ca. with all the stupid smog laws?

e-hut7 · 03-11-2009, 02:18 PM

Great post! thanks! I have an 88 4runner 22re 5spd. i need to fix my leaking axle seals and when removing the axle(for the bearing press) i plan to use add-a-leafs to fix the rear sag(all my budget will get me), but you make sound like now would be the time to install gears and locker. im a poor college student so economy is key, what is the best bang for you buck in the locker and gear department. ive just been googling so far.. thanks! -e-hut7

11-04-2008, 06:01 PM	#53 (permalink)
dud122 Registered User Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 2	hi all very informative thread here, answered a lot of questions for me. I just bought an 02 tacoma double cab, 4x4 - stock. going with your priority list of mods i decided to hold off on the lift. 1. drivetrain - since it came with the rear locker i'll move on to saving up for some armor (smart?) 2. armor - probably sliders then front bumper then rear. 3. i will need to get new tires before i get too far down the list of armor so here are the questions... can i fit 33's on this truck without lifting it? what is a good mud and rock tire that will spend most of its time on pavement? would 33's cause me to modify anything other than a possible lift? what would be the best way to lift it 1-2" without having to do too many other mods and extensions? thanks a lot Last edited by dud122; 11-04-2008 at 06:07 PM.

11-05-2008, 12:20 AM	#54 (permalink)
AxleIke Contributing Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Boulder, Colorado Posts: 4,887	A good mud and rock tire is not going to be an ideal choice for a "most of the time on pavement" tire. First question is: Where are you located? The type of terrain is going to be the most important factor in determining a tire. For example, if you live out west, and see a lot of dirt and rock, and once and a while some mud, an all terrain would work well for you. But if you live out east or in the PNW, you will need a pretty serious mud tire. Before the 33 question can be answered, we'll need to figure out the type of tire. The rest of your questions can be answered in the 1995.5-2004 taco section. Lots of good info there. __________________ 1987 Mutant 4runner\|Slightly Modified\|Lacking general build direction -Lifts and Tires look cool at the Mall, Lockers and Gears look cool on the trail. -Internet Nice Guy

01-10-2009, 03:25 PM	#58 (permalink)
walkdog0530 Registered User Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 31	(deleted) Last edited by walkdog0530; 01-10-2009 at 04:17 PM.

01-16-2009, 07:24 PM	#61 (permalink)
PaulCA Registered User Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 3	Lockers vs. locking diff? Thanks for this informative, great thread. New T4R owner as of last week - got a 2006 V8 Ltd. with automatic transmission. I've searched the forums and internet and can't seem to answer what I'm sure is an inept question - if my truck has an electronic locking differential switch, wouldn't lockers be redundant? I'm not sure I understand the difference between the manufacturer's "differential lock" function and "lockers" people talk about in these forums. Here's my rough plans for mods to my T4R - appreciate any comments: 1) New tires/wheels - downsizing to 17" rims from 18" and getting the BF Goodrich 265/70/17 AT KO's. I understand these are about as big as I can go w/o trimming and/or lifting. 2) Replace running boards with sliders 3) Shockworks front bumper 4) Undercarriage skid plates/armor 5) Add a rear bumper replacement 6) If I get to six anytime soon I'll be surprised! At that point its a wish list of driving lights, safari carrier, winch, and as I learn more I'd imagine drivetrain+gearing.

01-16-2009, 07:40 PM	#62 (permalink)
DC.Woods Contributing Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Michigan Posts: 191	(deleted) Last edited by DC.Woods; 01-19-2009 at 11:50 AM.

10-31-2008, 08:16 PM	#52 (permalink)
kennyboy019 Registered User Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 38	Yes, the locking diff was what I wanted. I have 87 so I have the manual locking hubs.

11-05-2008, 04:11 AM	#55 (permalink)
dud122 Registered User Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 2	i'm in watkins glen, ny. i guess i would see more dirt than mud. thanks

01-03-2009, 07:46 PM	#56 (permalink)
JustAnotherJ Registered User Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Tucson, AZ Posts: 1	This is why I joined this site. Professionalism. I have not seen any disrespect after 2 hours of reading and I'm thoroughly impressed. As a new '06 4runner 4x4 sport owner, i look forward to learning from you all.

01-06-2009, 06:38 PM	#57 (permalink)
FirstYota86 Registered User Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 1	.....

01-14-2009, 10:28 PM	#59 (permalink)
first_toyo_owner Registered User Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Cranbrook BC Posts: 12	hey i have a 90 4runner 2 door now I have been looking to make it more trail worthy after I pay off the loan heh. but as it sits right now i still use it as a day to day vehicle. Should I just focus on tires and armor. I got new shocks in it but its stock and I don't want it huge due to what everyone has said in this post. it can go over most stuff I want it to. But with rubbing all you need is a sawsall and a hammer? sounds easy enough i guess but i take it you need to cover up the cut marks as well? sorry if these questions are dumb lol I am still learning

01-16-2009, 07:48 PM	#63 (permalink)
PaulCA Registered User Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 3	Didn't realize the stock locking diff was only on the rear...would it be a big improvement to get front lockers then?

01-16-2009, 08:49 PM	#65 (permalink)
tc Contributing Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Longmont, CO Posts: 8,375	On a 2006 V8, the locking is for the center differential - essentially making it a "normal" 4WD vehicle with the tcase "locked" - otherwise there's a limited slip action in the center diff, meaning it's really only one wheel drive - although that wheel could be on the front or rear axle. Locking the center diff ensures that you have at least one wheel on each axle spinning. __________________ Check out www.coTTORA.org to hook up with great Toyota 'wheelin' folks! Current - 93 4Runner: 3VZ 33"x10.50" no lift ARB F/R 96 Impala SS: My own personal cop car Previous - 89 2WD Pickup 22R, Fabtech "Ivan Dan" lift, 31x10.50, IASCA World Finals 4th Place Stop with the mods and get on the trail! Pix at www.4wheelingoh.shutterfly.com/action Last edited by tc; 01-16-2009 at 08:52 PM.

01-16-2009, 09:38 PM	#66 (permalink)
AxleIke Contributing Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Boulder, Colorado Posts: 4,887	Yeah, this sounds like a locking center diff. I'm betting this truck has full time 4wd. If so, when you push the diff lock button, you get a normal transfer case. Essentially, you get what a part time 4wd has. You still have open diffs. So no, a locker in either diff would not be redundant. You have to lock the center to get what the rest of us have stock. You would add lockers from there. __________________ 1987 Mutant 4runner\|Slightly Modified\|Lacking general build direction -Lifts and Tires look cool at the Mall, Lockers and Gears look cool on the trail. -Internet Nice Guy

01-16-2009, 10:06 PM	#67 (permalink)
PaulCA Registered User Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 3	Correct - it is full time 4WD. Thanks for all the help, seems like I've got some homework to do.

01-16-2009, 10:17 PM	#68 (permalink)
BLKNBLU Registered User Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Gilbert, Arizona Posts: 1,667	Also this forum http://www.toyota120.com/forum/index.php may be helpful to you. It is specifically for your generation rig. I haven't noodled around there much yet, so I don't know what the general character of the board is like. I found it while looking into the 2009 4Runner as I'm intrigued by the locking diff. It looks however, like that is more of a pipedream for me right now though. __________________ 86 4Runner, custom Sonoran Steel rear bumper, 4Crawler 1" body lift, rock sliders from Richard Stubbs, rear Lockright, SAS w/ARB My build thread. http://www.yotatech.com/f66/blknblu-s-sac-155872/

01-17-2009, 06:50 PM	#69 (permalink)
skibum707 Registered User Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Santa Rosa CA Posts: 89	So ya im completely new at this whole thing and this looked like a good place to start with my potentially dumb questions so im just gonna lay um out and see if anyone can help me. I just inherited my 98 4runner and ive been takin it wheelin around my town of santa rosa and im looking to fix it up for some real trails. First dumb question is does the RR diferential lock have anything to do w/ lockers?

01-19-2009, 11:42 AM	#72 (permalink)
skibum707 Registered User Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Santa Rosa CA Posts: 89	sweet news ill be more greatful of that from now on. However i have another question.. Ive been looking at some armor stuff and skidplates look like a good idea and ive notice some of the hardcore rigs have like arb or tjm bumpers on them but i cant afford one and im not sure that id really need it so a good grille guard looked like a better option any comments on that? or suggestions of brands?

03-03-2009, 09:52 PM	#74 (permalink)
hoytyota84 Registered User Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Madera, Ca Posts: 1	ok, im convinced, no lift. but is one set of lockers better than others. i called 4wheel parts and asked prices without installation, limited slip in front and i dont know what in back, $837. kinda expected them to cost more. did i get the price on a cheap set up. is the tru trac worth it? i have a '90 pick up ext cab. not sure if that helps or not. i also need some info on replacing my engine, have 4cyl, want V6 but i dont know if i can in Ca. with all the stupid smog laws? Last edited by hoytyota84; 03-03-2009 at 10:16 PM.

03-11-2009, 02:18 PM	#75 (permalink)
e-hut7 Registered User Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Texas Posts: 38	Great post! thanks! I have an 88 4runner 22re 5spd. i need to fix my leaking axle seals and when removing the axle(for the bearing press) i plan to use add-a-leafs to fix the rear sag(all my budget will get me), but you make sound like now would be the time to install gears and locker. im a poor college student so economy is key, what is the best bang for you buck in the locker and gear department. ive just been googling so far.. thanks! -e-hut7

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