Getting reallllllllllll close to getting my frame painted and ready for assembly

Right now I have a few ideas I think I've narrowed my choices down to just from hearing different things from different people who's opinions I trust and have seen some of their work.

For my frame (boxed frame rails suck, was originally considering dip stripping and painting or galvanizing but think I've ultimately decided that its not worth it for the effort let me know if you think I should go with my gut and go that hardcore and what your reasoning is)

BUT BACK TO PAINT....For my frame right now my thought is
-blast outside clean and blast inside best I can
-Epoxy prime outside (maybe inside over rust too? Necessary?) someone recommended I buy the primer and have them mix it as I need it and brush it on where applicable
-then por15 or Imron inside and out
-Internal frame rail coating on top of that
-and get building

Also: Ive read enough on POR15 but particular paints I'm curious if anyone has experience with....IMRON in general(different colors different sheens, how it compares to others) DUPONT INDUSTRIAL 3.5 HG? (not sure what this is but someone mentioned how much they loved it, and DUPONT EPOXY PRIMER 2.1? (supposedly a very cost effective quality primer)

ALMOST FORGOT TO MENTION: Im a little ways out from getting around to it but body paint will be my next thought. Right now I am thinking I want to just do a quality simple Gloss One Part Enamel. I don't have any experience with particular brands or anything so any input is appreciated. pros/cons of 2 Part vs One part and all that junk

 

I didn’t know Imron was still available. I painted a Willy’s with it years ago. Great paint, but pricey.

 

I did a complete frame off resto on my 91 Ext Cab and hear you about not being able to get the inside of boxed frames. In my case I had the frame sand blasted and epoxy coated. After that I put on 2 coats of Tremclad enamel paint. It's been about 6-7 years and the frame is still good but I don't drive it in the salt.

Looked into galvanizing but couldn't find a place that would take it and was somewhat worried about warpage.

If I had to do it again I would probably do either of the 2 things.
1) - See if I could get someone to hot tank it (hard because of size)

OR

2) - Stand it on end
- Beat it with a hammer to knock the inside rust loose
- Try to get a wire brush through the frame (kinda like some kind of chimney sweep)
- Seal the holes in the frame and pour in either phosphoric acid or just go straight to something like Por-15
(If Phosphoric acid then flush till clean and treat with Epoxy primer and top with Tremclad Enamel)

In the end I'd still blast the outside, Epoxy, and Tremclad.

 

InnocentFool thanks for the input. Sounds like you had a lot of the same thoughts running through your head as I do now. Havent heard of Tremclad so I will be checking that out. I think I made a final decision of stayimg away from galvanizing because of a few things. Warpage being the main reason but also a coracopia of other reasons including needing completely clean metal to adhere to properly mainly inside boxed rails, diffixulty of succesfully painting, no familiar with it in general, having to tap and ream holes after, having to grind back down to steel if ever need to weld, etc.

I did find a place in PA that wilm hot dip strip the frame (i think they said around 350 degrees so much less/no chance of warpage like galvanizing temps. They will however still need to pressure wash inside frame rails. No as tough as media blasting but still dampered by box frame rails. I think this will still be a better option than not getting rid of any rust. The place is called MEC Chemicals in Nanty-Glo PA and their rate is $25 per foot in length(about the sqme as galvanizing) if anyone has ever used or heard of this place im all ears on what you have to say about them and their work.

I was even going to skip this and go straight for rust ecapsulating inside and still blast outside like you said. Now that I am typing this I am leaning towards having this place strip it thwn proceed with said steps above. Glad to hear someone had the same thought process im having. Keep the info comin boys and gals!!

 

From what I understand it is still available might be a little hard to find or need to be bought through a professional shop though. How did the Willy's you painted hold up to the test of time? Do you still have it. I am leaning heavily towards Imron for my frame and chassis parts right now unless someone recommends something that changes my mind in the next month.

 

POR-15 is CRAP! I will not work without Rust... its a converter. if you blast and it paint it with por15 it will just fail and fall off. Ive had customers cars with it and I could take it off with my finger nail.

I use and recommend RM's EP589 (or 569d epends on color)... Great epoxy primer!
I also personally like BASFs Limco Line of urethane single stage paint. good and not to pricey.

 

It was a 1962 Willy’s 4wd Wagon. I painted it the dark gray metallic that Toyota used on the 1983 4wd. Imron was a thick paint, which made it a little tough to shoot, but produced a durable coat the had a really deep look, and held a shine well. I sold the Willy’s maybe 10 years later. (Mpg was horrendous.)
the only other drawback to Imron at the time besides cost was the fumes. Just gnarly. I didn’t have the best breathing equipment and I had a pretty wicked headache after an hour. The paint was popular on RVs and big rigs, I imagine because the paint held up well to rock chips and such. I don’t what it’s like today, but if you can find someone to shoot it it might be worth a look.

 

If your frame is that bad, why spend all that time and money and labor and traveling to try and save it when you can just go get a clean one? Then put a fresh coat of paint on the outside and spray some cavity wax on the inside or use some oil and call it good? seems like MASSIVE overkill what you are trying to do. Unless of course you are insane like me and want everything to be orginal to the truck. Then i get it. but if not. get a clean frame and dont look back.

 

Yeah im a little insane i guess. I tend to overthink things. Funny this is the first comment on this post in a while and you commented as I am watching overhaulin and bitchin rides and thinking to myself "just clean the inside of the frame rails the best you can and use the eastwood internal frame rail coating and maybe some cavity wax on top of that." Where would one source a clean frame? Does someone reproduce them or you just mean a used clean-er frame? Time to get this chassis put back together its been way too long.

 

POR is the BEST !! .. and those who say it is not .. did NOT read the instructions .

I have been using it for 10+ years , on customer vehicles and personal vehicles .. not 1 failure .. and to remove it , you need a grinder .
I use a pressure pot with a 90* wand for the inside , and a small brush for the outside ..
I have had excellent results .

washing and cleaning 8+ hrs just washing



acid etch

 

hmmm now you got me thinking of using it. I didnt know it would be sprayable. Was leaning towards using eastwoods internal frame coating with the tubes they supply. Are the pictures you poated of what you did before uaing POR? Im confused.

 

its kind of a time line of that particular frame I did .

on this unit we decided to spray the out side .. I didn't like it as much as brushing , the paint gun atomizes it to much (2.0 nozzle) , you have to spray it 3-4 times to get the optimal thickness




turned out great .. just was a lot more work



this is what I use for the inside


another , one I did was completely sand blasted .. same process

 

Okay gotchya so it seems like you have great results with POR even with bare metal am I understanding that right with the one you said was completely sandblasted? I guess a lot of people just dont read and understand the instructions thoroughly? I have ZERO experience with it. In your opinion should I have the frame dipped if I can? My only concern with dipping is neutralizing any residual acid properly and choosing a finish that willl adhere properly but If POR will work on bare metal the dipping will strip the frame and do the etching all in one. Are you saying POR should be okay on bare metal?

 

unless you are going to have your frame dipped in E-Coat, how are you going to cover every single nook and cranny that the acid dip hit? Once again, if your frame is so rusty that the inside is that much of a concern, get a new frame. other wise, blast it and hit it with something like PPG ST1202 chassis paint. or if you want something fancier, blast it and hit it with epoxy and then follow up with a high quality single stage gloss black.

POR15 on its own will do NOTHING to rust, it relies on an acid pretreatment to "neutralize" the rust and then the POR "encapsulates" it. IE: prevents moisture from getting to it again. There is no magic paint you can just "put on rust" and have your rust magically "fixed"

 

Well if I had it dipped. The place Im considering uses a muriatic "mix" they said, wouldn't that be a good way to get rid of as much rust as possible and will also etch the frame before I put POR or some other paint on it?

Or are you saying that's not a good idea because no matter what I paint it with the paint won't be as viscous as and reach as far as the acid so that's not a good idea?

I never said anything about putting POR on rust by itself? I realize that it encapsulates it?

 

This is my frame as it sits. The rear round cross member and the little regtangular patches (where the leaf spring bumpers caused excessive rust) next to it are rusted because they are all new metal was welded in and flash rusted. The hole you see in the side of the frame in the last picture is a part I cut out cuz it was getting thin from rusting and I have a patch that's ready to weld in place. The rest of the frame seems to be fine but I wanted to dip it if I could to get is as clean as possible before repainting it and instead of just treating the rusted areas and having to paint over any old paint or undercoat in other areas(obviously not a great idea) There is no need to get a new frame. I am merely considering dipping it because I thought that would be the best method to clean and etch the whole thing in one shot before repainting the entire thing and instead of just painting the rusted spots or over any old paint or undercoat (obviously not a good idea).
I dont want to just blast and paint the outside. I want to address the boxed frame rails at the same time. Why wouldn't I? And obviously you can not simply blast the INSIDE of the frame rails StarCity? not sure what youre getting at by saying "if not simply blast the outside and paint with chassis paint" my point of all this is to get the entire frame taken care of and make it last as long as possible. not just put a pretty coat of paint on the outside and let the inside keep rusting away without treating it? What type of acid is the pretreatment that POR sells?

 

Think about it. If you have the frame "dipped", the POINT of that is that it gets submerged and the "acid" gets literally EVERYWHERE, stripping the frame IN ITS ENTIRETY, EVERY NOOK,CRANNY,PINHOLE, WELD SEAM, EVERYTHING. ok great, now how are you going to COVER EVERY NOOK AND CRANNY AND PINHOLE AND WELD SEAM with something thats going to stop it from rusting AGAIN. because it has ZERO protection.

 

I see what you mean but its no different than the way it came from the factory dont you think? Frame is made with bare metal parts. Welded together. Then painted as best as possible. And the factory didnt even bother to paint inside the frame rails. Just a thought.

 

oh no, the factory dipped the frame and used electrostatic to make paint cling to everything. it just couldnt get in between overlapped areas and behind welds. And salt,sand, dirt,rocks.leaves,mud etc have a way of wearing away paint and allowing moisture to dwell on bare metal and voila! you have rust!

 

Fluid film every year and no worries.