250000_yota

Hey dr, not to shoot a hole in your theory, but the reason they recommend that you not gap iridium or platinum plugs is because gaping them cracks the iridium or platinum, severely limiting the life of the plug. Also, as far as you previous set of plugs, you said that they only lasted 71k. When I worked at Toyota, we recommended replacing the plugs every 30k, and personally, the max I'd do is 50k. After that, you get exactly what your showing. Severe ground and center electrode deterioration...

DRCOFFEE

That's why I don't open the gap by prying against the electrode. The ground electrode is not platinum. Its a standard alloy and opening the gap wont break a thing. The twin tips "are" platinum and you wont touch them if you do it correctly, as mentioned above.

Those plugs that are melted at 71k miles arent mine. But they didnt just widen the gap between 50k and 71k miles. From the moment you install them copper plugs the gap begins to errode. Double platinums dont. At least not for 100k miles.

What theory are you trying to shoot a hole through? I guess I don't understand your point. I'm getting better acceration, although I cant quantify it for you other than to say, it feels like it pulls stronger. I have increased my mpg which is a positive. and they will last way longer than those double prong copper plugs it came with 12 years ago (no longer cutting edge tech).

I'm sure back in the day, double ground plugs were revolutionary. A certain "wow" factor when the customer sees them for the very first time. Today, not so much.

In fairness, what I may do as a placebo is to buy some OEM plugs and run 3 tanks through them and compare. If it gives me 20mpg it would be worth sticking with OEM.

250000_yota

What I was trying to point out is that both denso and NGK platinum and iridium plugs use their perspective metals in the ground electrodes, hence my point of accelerated wear.

I'm sorry if you took my post offensively. I was simply trying to help you see an error. I wasnt knocking your new plugs at all. I'm a firm believer in extended life plugs. I just choose to run the stock denso k16's.

DRCOFFEE

I think you may not understand the use of platinum in spark plugs. The entire ground electrode is not platinum. You couldnt afford the spark plug with that much of this precious metal. They only use a very small disc on the ground and the tip on the center electrode. I pulled this from the NGK site:

"Nearly all spark plug manufacturers use platinum in one form or another on their long life or performance spark plugs. This is because of platinum’s high melting point, which makes it useful in two ways. On long life spark plugs a thin wafer of platinum is bonded at the firing point to the center electrode (and possibly ground electrode) solely so they don’t wear as fast as a traditional plug."

So if you dont disturb the actual platinum tips, there's no harm to the plug. I didn't mean to be combative but I needed to clarify why you can gap these plugs if done correctly. If you press against the center electrode, the welded Platinum tip can fracture off. Just don't do that.

You can see the small wafer on the ground. That's all the platinum it has on the ground.

TheOriginal

Hi.

The part # for the Denso TT platinum plugs is 4503 or PK16TT?


thanks,
TheOriginal

DRCOFFEE

Yes. both numbers are on the box. The model # is PK16TT and the part number is #4503

Give me a few weeks to continue testing before you take the plunge. I'll update this thread with each fillup.

TheOriginal

Thanks DRCOFFEE! I just ordered these right now from RockAuto, $20.78 including the shipping.

Thanks again.
The Original

250000_yota

Ok. Now, point out where, in my post, I stated that the entire electrode, is platinum. Obviously, you are taking the portion of my posts that are most convenient to you, and pulling the maximum truth that helps your argument. Again, I was only trying to point out an error in your statement, to help others. I understand perfectly how platinum is used in spark plugs. What I have been stating is that, disturbing the ground, which is where the platinum is placed, can cause small fractures in the platinum, causing premature wear of the spark plug in itself. Gapping these plugs, as you've stated, can disturb the ground base, thus, disturbing the platinum "bonded" to the ground tip,allowing it to become brittle, fracturing that bond. This is why it doesn't just take disturbing the actual platinum. Simply dropping a platinum or iridium tipped plug can ruin it.

I believe that you aren't trying to be combative, but that is the way you are coming off, by pulling apart someone's point. I was simply trying to clarify for people who might not have the same experience.

DRCOFFEE

Gapping platinum plugs per NGK.com
"In most cases the factory set gap should conform to your vehicle specifications. However if it is necessary to widen the gap, do so with a tool that only pulls back on the ground electrode without touching the center electrode or the porcelain. To close the gap on a plug, gently tap the plug, electrode first on a hard surface."

Source:
http://www.ngk.com/glossary.asp?kw=Proper+Gapping

Per Denso
"Generally, no. The DENSO Iridium Power plug comes pre-set with a protective sleeve over the firing end, to protect the gap from accidental alteration. DENSO Iridium Power?s ultra-efficient firing power compensates for normally recommended gap settings that are smaller than the pre-set value. In the cases of vehicle modifications (nitrous, turbo-chargers, super-chargers, high power ignition systems, etc.), some adjustments may be desired. Or, if you prefer to remain consistent with factory specifications, you may adjust. However, please be careful not to place any stress on the fine center electrode during adjustment. You could accidentally break off the very hard, and therefore brittle, tip."

http://www.densoiridium.com/faq.php

I thought these Two videos were interesting on multi ground plugs vs new iridium plugs.


Copper plug vs Iridium plug Multi ground spark plugs by NGK

TheOriginal

Hi,

I just changed these 4503 plugs last week since my 4RUNNER started to fail when I taken a clog. The fail was terrible and the 4Runner was off. I installed the dual-Platinum NGK BKR5EKPB-11 (#4302) and now feel the difference.


Please check this before change your plugs: http://www.ngk.com/sparkplug411.asp?...gnition&mfid=1

MudHippy

Like that makes any sense...AT ALL!

Try again. IN ENGLISH this time.

DRCOFFEE

I would bet you didnt gap the plugs. Mine came gapped at .036 and I opened them up to .044.

DRCOFFEE

So far my mpg has jumped from 17 to 18.6 and ive been very satisfied with these Denso TT plugs. They have improved my mileage by 10% with no other mods since installing the plugs. But the gap has to be correct to get the best performance.

TheOriginal

Hi, Drcoffee! well, set my Denso TT just now at .044 as you recommended, I will put these tomorrow and will let you know how works. Then I will to perform the seamfoam treatment process.

Thanks

DRCOFFEE

You are better off doing the sea foam first otherwise you risk damaging the new plugs.

TheOriginal

Ok, thank you very much! This is the first time that I will to realise or perform this process, did you recommend it? I actually have less MPG since I changed by original ones the spark plugs, the fuelfilter, the air filter, cleaned the MAF sensor and the trotlel body. I will appreciate your help.
Thanks,

TheOriginal

Well, just putting the Denso TT after set these at .044 as recommended, the start was much faster and feels more power. I just made a run test going through highway and a hill road and all I will say is that my 4runner has now more strongly than before when had the double spark. Nothing, I will wait two to three weeks and I will post results. I inspected the oil cap, the MAF sensor and the intake and all was observed clean, due to this I decided to postpone the seafoam treatment or process by now.

mtvp

I put the NGK's Iridiums back in my 98 4R V6. I am getting 21 highway if I stay at 70 mph or below. I can say they are much better than the Bosch plugs that where in there for awhile. It just has more response and seems smoother. That was with summer gas ,now with the winter gas . The choke being on more ,I just don't check it that much in the winter months.

Plug wires are the OEM. I have never replaced them and they are still nice and rubbery to the touch. I have to think that after 16 seasons they must be bad. I look at them in the dark and I don't see any arcing wires or glowing carbon breaks. Still I feel the need to replace them.
Not unlike my OEM Fan, Alt. AC belts. I let the battery go for 13 years before it gave up the ghost.

Keith B.

On the spark plug wires, don't forget the Yazaki or Sumitomo OEM wires. They come with the date of manufacture printed on them. The wires in my '97 4Runner were dated 1997 when I acquired the vehicle in 2013. They were still working fine after 16 years, btw. They were a bit stiff.

Zealous

I think this is probably the right place to post this so I'll post again.

I'm looking to replace my OEM spark plug wires. I'm not concerned about getting OEM because I'm supercharged and interested in performance. I've looked on the web to no avail about the difference or compatibility of the NGK TE66 to NGK 4412 wires, especially for my specific application. I've read of gen 3ers using both, but nowhere can I find information about the difference between the two. Any input would be groovy.

Also, I just ordered some new plugs, after getting the NGK plug code manual, and the printout of the entire part number to stock number of the NGK catalog, here:

NGK Spark Plug Codes
http://www.ngksparkplugs.com/pdf/StocktoPart11x17.pdf

Question 2. For my supercharged application, I chose the NGK BKR6EKPB-11, part 3453. This is an international standard, resistor, one step colder, 19mm, 2 grounded electrode for certain Toyota's, platinum tipped, special construction plug with spark gap of 1.1mm/.044". It is also a fine wire core plug which is a performance plug, which will not last as long as an iridium plug (...EIX stock #).

When I went to advanceautoparts.com and other places to buy the plugs, they said that the plugs didn't fit my application. I bought them anyway. My question is will these plugs fit, and does anyone have any experience with these plugs with their supercharger?

Just for the sake of adding to the community's education, I will list the other NGK plug stock numbers which are relevant to this.

NKR6EIX-11 part 3764 Iridium, performance fine wire, rad plug but cannot be used because it is not double or more grounded which is required in 3rd gen Yotas.
BKR5EKB-11 probably best plug for stock app / non SC'd, but not Iridium
BKUR7ET performance fine wire, 3 ground, dbl. plat
BKR7EQUP part 4285, 4 ground, platinum, performance fine wire

I haven't seen the topic of the difference between the plug wires anywhere so fire away.

2001 Toyota 4Runner SR5 4X4 3.4L V6 Auto Supercharged