Question re: 3.4 swap, JDM, and Califoring rules
10-11-2016, 11:55 AM
#1
Question re: 3.4 swap, JDM, and Califoring rules
Greetings all,
I have a potential opportunity to purchase a 1989 4runner in a great condition except non-functioning 3.0l V6 engine for a vary reasonable price. Having researched the different opinions regarding repair or swap, I am currently leaning towards the latter. My friend, an auto-mechanic, have reviewed all the swap related documents I have collected and believes that we can do the swap, considering that we will have an access to his friend's shop with lift and all the tools. However, herein lies the rub.
The shop is located in San Diego, and the owner will not allow to have a donor vehicle on the premises, and since I live about 60 miles away (Palomar Mountain), it would not be very convenient to have the donor vehicle here, in addition, my landlord has not approved of me having the donor vehicle here either. So, I have been considering purchase of a JDM, and buying the components missing on the engine from junk yards. Perusing this forum, I have found several topic regarding JDM, but the one here https://www.yotatech.com/forums/f160...rences-294232/, gave me pause by indicating that there is a difference between an engine from Japan and the U.S. counterpart. At the same time, it has been my understanding that the Japanese engines are routinely imported and installed.
Based on the foregoing, before I make a serious mistake, I wanted to ask the following:
1. Can somebody explain the legality and changes needed to be made to the JDM to comply with California's laws?
2. Can someone in the area of San Diego, Escondido, Temecula, recommend a junk yard, to potentially pull and engine and related components?
3. If someone in this area has done the swap and would be willing to answer some questions/help for a reasonable compensation, I would appreciate it.
Thank you very much for your time in this manner.
Kindest regards,
M
I have a potential opportunity to purchase a 1989 4runner in a great condition except non-functioning 3.0l V6 engine for a vary reasonable price. Having researched the different opinions regarding repair or swap, I am currently leaning towards the latter. My friend, an auto-mechanic, have reviewed all the swap related documents I have collected and believes that we can do the swap, considering that we will have an access to his friend's shop with lift and all the tools. However, herein lies the rub.
The shop is located in San Diego, and the owner will not allow to have a donor vehicle on the premises, and since I live about 60 miles away (Palomar Mountain), it would not be very convenient to have the donor vehicle here, in addition, my landlord has not approved of me having the donor vehicle here either. So, I have been considering purchase of a JDM, and buying the components missing on the engine from junk yards. Perusing this forum, I have found several topic regarding JDM, but the one here https://www.yotatech.com/forums/f160...rences-294232/, gave me pause by indicating that there is a difference between an engine from Japan and the U.S. counterpart. At the same time, it has been my understanding that the Japanese engines are routinely imported and installed.
Based on the foregoing, before I make a serious mistake, I wanted to ask the following:
1. Can somebody explain the legality and changes needed to be made to the JDM to comply with California's laws?
2. Can someone in the area of San Diego, Escondido, Temecula, recommend a junk yard, to potentially pull and engine and related components?
3. If someone in this area has done the swap and would be willing to answer some questions/help for a reasonable compensation, I would appreciate it.
Thank you very much for your time in this manner.
Kindest regards,
M
10-13-2016, 10:06 AM
#2
Registered User
Since no one has responded, I'll chime in; everything I said in the thread that you linked is still applicable.
Basically, in California when performing an "engine change" ("change" referring to swapping a 3.0 for a 3.4 whereas a "swap" refers to replacing a 3.0 with another 3.0) you are transforming your car/truck into a new vehicle in the eyes of CARB and the SMOG Check program. Typically, the new vehicle is identified by the ECU that is used in the swap.
For your application, if you buy a JDM motor, you will still need an ECU from a vehicle that was sold in the US; if your motor comes with an ECU from a Japanese only vehicle (say a HiAce van), you will never be able to SMOG it in CA. This means that at a minimum you will need to buy a new ECU for any 5VZ application: 1995.5 - 2004; Tacoma, 4Runner, T100, Tundra; 4x4, 4x2; A/T, M/T; etc. From there, you will need to buy all the intake, exhaust, emissions, etc. related components that came from the factory for THAT specific application (the SMOG ref will check the part numbers of everything you used and if those numbers aren't applicable to the ECU you choose, you will fail the visual and have to replace those parts; luckily a lot of the parts were used across a range of years and applications.
As for a JDM engine vs a US engine, they're basically the same. I've seen some pictures of JDM motors that have the oil filter mounted in the rear hole on the engine (where the oil cooler is mounted in the US) and a block off plate installed on the front hole (where the US engines have their oil filter). I can't imagine that these differences would be difficult to account for, but they are things that need to be taken into consideration.
Now, there's the issue of gathering all of the other parts that you'll need, you'll wind up spending a small fortune at junkyards trying to find all the bits and pieces that you'll need (hence the advice that you try to find a donor vehicle), or you could get lucky (I did) and find someone parting out a 4Runner/Tacoma/T100/Tundra where you could get most of the "extras" that you'd need.
Hope this helps, and unfortunately I can't comment on anything San Diego specific. Good luck.
Basically, in California when performing an "engine change" ("change" referring to swapping a 3.0 for a 3.4 whereas a "swap" refers to replacing a 3.0 with another 3.0) you are transforming your car/truck into a new vehicle in the eyes of CARB and the SMOG Check program. Typically, the new vehicle is identified by the ECU that is used in the swap.
For your application, if you buy a JDM motor, you will still need an ECU from a vehicle that was sold in the US; if your motor comes with an ECU from a Japanese only vehicle (say a HiAce van), you will never be able to SMOG it in CA. This means that at a minimum you will need to buy a new ECU for any 5VZ application: 1995.5 - 2004; Tacoma, 4Runner, T100, Tundra; 4x4, 4x2; A/T, M/T; etc. From there, you will need to buy all the intake, exhaust, emissions, etc. related components that came from the factory for THAT specific application (the SMOG ref will check the part numbers of everything you used and if those numbers aren't applicable to the ECU you choose, you will fail the visual and have to replace those parts; luckily a lot of the parts were used across a range of years and applications.
As for a JDM engine vs a US engine, they're basically the same. I've seen some pictures of JDM motors that have the oil filter mounted in the rear hole on the engine (where the oil cooler is mounted in the US) and a block off plate installed on the front hole (where the US engines have their oil filter). I can't imagine that these differences would be difficult to account for, but they are things that need to be taken into consideration.
Now, there's the issue of gathering all of the other parts that you'll need, you'll wind up spending a small fortune at junkyards trying to find all the bits and pieces that you'll need (hence the advice that you try to find a donor vehicle), or you could get lucky (I did) and find someone parting out a 4Runner/Tacoma/T100/Tundra where you could get most of the "extras" that you'd need.
Hope this helps, and unfortunately I can't comment on anything San Diego specific. Good luck.
10-13-2016, 11:04 AM
#3
Hi SacRunner,
thank you very much for your reply, I have a false impression that I understand the issue. Just one clarifying question, at least for now: If I can find an ECU, do all the additional parts, i.e., the intake, exhaust, emissions, have to come from the same car that was a donor for the ECU? If not, how do I, and later the referee, ascertain that the parts " ame from the factory for THAT specific application "? Are there part numbers on all the components? Is there a list enabling me to collect all the correct parts?
Unfortunately, as I explained, the donor vehicle path is closed for me.
Kindest regards,
M
thank you very much for your reply, I have a false impression that I understand the issue. Just one clarifying question, at least for now: If I can find an ECU, do all the additional parts, i.e., the intake, exhaust, emissions, have to come from the same car that was a donor for the ECU? If not, how do I, and later the referee, ascertain that the parts " ame from the factory for THAT specific application "? Are there part numbers on all the components? Is there a list enabling me to collect all the correct parts?
Unfortunately, as I explained, the donor vehicle path is closed for me.
Kindest regards,
M
10-13-2016, 11:42 AM
#4
Registered User
The various parts don't have to actually come from the same vehicle type as the ECU, but they have to have been used with that vehicle. So for example, Toyota used 2 different style MAF sensors over the life span of the 5VZ, the early ones were an in-line sensor (sometimes called a "bullet" style) while the later used a drop-in sensor. Lets say you used an ECU from a '97 4Runner (like I did), then you would need to use the same sensor as came with a 97 4Runner (the in-line style), but you could go to a junkyard and buy a sensor from a 1995.5 Tacoma and use it with the 97 4Runner ECU (because they are the same part number).
Just about all of Toyota's various parts have a part number molded into them, stamped onto them, or sticker applied to them that shows the part number. The ref would then gather all those part numbers, run them through their system (whatever that may be) and they will verify that those part numbers are applicable to your application (for me it was a 97 4Runner).
I haven't come across a list of all part numbers that are applicable for each vehicle application, but I would typically search ToyoDIY.com for the complete part number of a particular item, then lookup that part number online (I used to use ToyotaPartZone.com, now ToyotaPartsDeal.com) to find the various fitment applications that also used that part number, to help widen the places to look for a particular item.
http://www.toyodiy.com/parts/
http://www.toyotapartsdeal.com/
Just about all of Toyota's various parts have a part number molded into them, stamped onto them, or sticker applied to them that shows the part number. The ref would then gather all those part numbers, run them through their system (whatever that may be) and they will verify that those part numbers are applicable to your application (for me it was a 97 4Runner).
I haven't come across a list of all part numbers that are applicable for each vehicle application, but I would typically search ToyoDIY.com for the complete part number of a particular item, then lookup that part number online (I used to use ToyotaPartZone.com, now ToyotaPartsDeal.com) to find the various fitment applications that also used that part number, to help widen the places to look for a particular item.
http://www.toyodiy.com/parts/
http://www.toyotapartsdeal.com/
10-18-2016, 09:12 AM
#6
I'm in So Cal. north of you. I did it without a donor. I found an 95/96 T100 engine with less than 70K miles on it. Then looked for the rest at a few salvage yard near me. I ended up declaring it as a 95T100 engine so I don't have to use any of the new smog stuff. I sent in the original exhaust cross over to Toyonlyswaps.com and they swiched the output to the driver side. I kept my 5 spd trans.
https://www.yotatech.com/forums/f160...4-swap-237525/
https://www.yotatech.com/forums/f160...4-swap-237525/
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