The swampthing2 killed in action...
Mar 30, 2009 | 07:58 PM
#241
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From: South
I've actually had pretty good luck with that so far. My ex used do enduro motorcross races, and my current one I met at the san antonio raceway for a drag day. I love women who can drive the hell outta my trucks.
Mar 30, 2009 | 08:03 PM
#242
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Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 3,870
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From: Chico, California
Okay tell her.
See that left brake pedal....
Well lets lift that up super slowly until the truck starts to barley move or the rpms drop a little.
Then give it some gas slowely and then contnue to let off the clutch..
that seems to help people comprehend..
Idk it might be worth a shot..
See that left brake pedal....
Well lets lift that up super slowly until the truck starts to barley move or the rpms drop a little.
Then give it some gas slowely and then contnue to let off the clutch..
that seems to help people comprehend..
Idk it might be worth a shot..
Mar 30, 2009 | 09:11 PM
#244
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Joined: Oct 2007
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Yeah, I'll tell her to feel for the friction point... I realized I might have been neglecting my brotherly duties when I was telling her "The clutch disengages the transmission from the engine. We'll try it in 4lo so you can get the feel of the clutch." And she replied "What's a transmission, and why are there two brake pedals?"
Oh lordy... Had to stop myself from launching into the theory of mechanics. Was like there is nowhere NEAR the amount of time I'd need... "Just press the left brake pedal the the floor and move the stick left and up. Let go of the left brake pedal, and we'll go from there!"
Oh lordy... Had to stop myself from launching into the theory of mechanics. Was like there is nowhere NEAR the amount of time I'd need... "Just press the left brake pedal the the floor and move the stick left and up. Let go of the left brake pedal, and we'll go from there!"
I found it really helpful to take friends to a flat parking lot and have them slow let out the clutch (feeling for the friction point) with out touching the gas. Then practice getting the truck rolling with the clutch without using the gas. Once that was accomplished, we'd tried to do it faster, with the gas. The locker scared the living piss out of her whenever we turned a corner.
Whereas you and I probably had some idea how the clutch worked when we started to drive, there is a very good chance your sister doesn't know (and couldn't care less). Finding that friction point by feel with the left food is really key, and should be the first step.
After that, have her think about the gas. Clutch pedal goes in, gas pedal is let out. Clutch goes out, gas goes in.
Last edited by Matt16; Mar 30, 2009 at 09:17 PM.
Mar 31, 2009 | 03:13 AM
#246
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Joined: Oct 2008
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From: Burlington, VT
Jay, did this driving sim have a clutch pedal?? I learned to shift gears on my bicycle, but learning the clutch happened at my dad's vineyard when I was 10 or 11 (95 escort, what an awesome car 
: ). The way he taught me was initially 'push the left pedal then start letting off on it' but I asked him why and he explained how the clutch worked and why it was there and stuff, which raelly helped me understand it. Then I drove an automatic (07 camry) for the first time in my life a couple years later and freaked out when it started rolling by itself when I left off the brake 
In my selfish and cheap opinion, the best way to teach someone stick would be in someone else's car. Unless it's a really cute girl you have a thing for, but that never worked out for me
...meh
[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aZzNh5JVzxA[/YOUTUBE]
: ). The way he taught me was initially 'push the left pedal then start letting off on it' but I asked him why and he explained how the clutch worked and why it was there and stuff, which raelly helped me understand it. Then I drove an automatic (07 camry) for the first time in my life a couple years later and freaked out when it started rolling by itself when I left off the brake In my selfish and cheap opinion, the best way to teach someone stick would be in someone else's car. Unless it's a really cute girl you have a thing for, but that never worked out for me...meh[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aZzNh5JVzxA[/YOUTUBE]
Mar 31, 2009 | 05:09 AM
#247
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Hey, at least the first time you are teaching her how to drive a standard the truck isn't already stuck!
The first time I had to teach my wife to drive a standard, the truck was already stuck in mud and I had to get out for whatever reason (can't really remember, maybe I went to find somebody to help pull us out), so she had to take over...lots of burnt clutch, but the craziest thing was, she got it out! Big hit to my "drivers" ego that day.
The first time I had to teach my wife to drive a standard, the truck was already stuck in mud and I had to get out for whatever reason (can't really remember, maybe I went to find somebody to help pull us out), so she had to take over...lots of burnt clutch, but the craziest thing was, she got it out! Big hit to my "drivers" ego that day.
Mar 31, 2009 | 06:43 AM
#248
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,336
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From: Harrisburg, PA
Hey ST, just wanted to offer a few tips to you or anyone trying to teach someone the fine art of driving stick.
Right off the bat, the first thing that I do is to not allow them to even touch the gas peddle. I make them practice getting used to that friction point. Just easing out the clutch slowly, letting them feel it, and about how far their foot has to travel until it reaches that point. Once they get that, I have had pretty good success with getting them to get the vehicle rolling without the use of gas. This is a good exercise to really help them dial in on clutch control. Practice that a few more times until they can do it without stalling, and then add the gas. When it comes to adding the gas into the mix, I tell all my students (thats right, I've taught at least 6 people how to drive stick hahaha, and we've never burnt up a clutch) to think of the gas and clutch as a see-saw. If one is going in, the other should be coming out. At least for getting started and the such haha.
I have them further practice the gas and clutch thing, telling them if they used too much gas, or let the clutch out too slow or too fast. I find you'll never have to tell a newb that they used too little gas...
Doing all that, plus some verbal encouragement, has led to a 100% success rate, however, the time it took to get each person to that point has varied. My worst was my friend who thought he'd be able to pick it right up. He wanted to go straight to a seasoned clutch master like myself from a nobody in one hour's time. He took a full 2 hours to teach stick to, but once he realized he'll never be as good as me, it got a whole lot easier from there
. I'd say on average, I can teach someone the basics in about 20-30 minutes though.
Then comes the inclined starts...
Don't try to teach them hills at first. I tried that with one person, and it just isn't really feasible until they have some practice at driving stick. I say when they don't have to think about driving stick too much, is when they are ready to learn a hill start. The concept on a hill is a bit harder to grasp, and should not be attempted immediately. In other words, save it for another day, after the newb has had some seat time and is pretty comfortable with starting out and shifting gears. As there is not a super good way to teach it, I find that with a little coaching, people can figure it out for themselves, providing they are practiced in starts, stops, and shifts on the level or very slight incline. Start small to get the feel.
Starting on a slight incline allows them to use the nifty friction point they learned about previously to hold the vehicle while they move their foot from the brake to the gas. Then its just a start that needs slightly more gas. Once they get the feel for it, go progressively harder, to a point, and let them practice a few times. If you find they are slipping the clutch too much, try a less steep hill until they master it.
I have not met a person that couldn't learn to drive stick. IMO, putting the vehicle in 4-lo is really not very benefical to learning how the vehicle will act. My 4runner with a 3.4, you can pop the clutch out from a dead stop in 4-lo in 3rd and it won't stall... the friction point in 4-lo is really hard to judge, and will probably make matters worse. Just my opinion though, do what you have to do.
Hope this helps. Let me know if you try this how it works out for you.
Right off the bat, the first thing that I do is to not allow them to even touch the gas peddle. I make them practice getting used to that friction point. Just easing out the clutch slowly, letting them feel it, and about how far their foot has to travel until it reaches that point. Once they get that, I have had pretty good success with getting them to get the vehicle rolling without the use of gas. This is a good exercise to really help them dial in on clutch control. Practice that a few more times until they can do it without stalling, and then add the gas. When it comes to adding the gas into the mix, I tell all my students (thats right, I've taught at least 6 people how to drive stick hahaha, and we've never burnt up a clutch) to think of the gas and clutch as a see-saw. If one is going in, the other should be coming out. At least for getting started and the such haha.
I have them further practice the gas and clutch thing, telling them if they used too much gas, or let the clutch out too slow or too fast. I find you'll never have to tell a newb that they used too little gas...
Doing all that, plus some verbal encouragement, has led to a 100% success rate, however, the time it took to get each person to that point has varied. My worst was my friend who thought he'd be able to pick it right up. He wanted to go straight to a seasoned clutch master like myself from a nobody in one hour's time. He took a full 2 hours to teach stick to, but once he realized he'll never be as good as me, it got a whole lot easier from there
. I'd say on average, I can teach someone the basics in about 20-30 minutes though.Then comes the inclined starts...
Don't try to teach them hills at first. I tried that with one person, and it just isn't really feasible until they have some practice at driving stick. I say when they don't have to think about driving stick too much, is when they are ready to learn a hill start. The concept on a hill is a bit harder to grasp, and should not be attempted immediately. In other words, save it for another day, after the newb has had some seat time and is pretty comfortable with starting out and shifting gears. As there is not a super good way to teach it, I find that with a little coaching, people can figure it out for themselves, providing they are practiced in starts, stops, and shifts on the level or very slight incline. Start small to get the feel.
Starting on a slight incline allows them to use the nifty friction point they learned about previously to hold the vehicle while they move their foot from the brake to the gas. Then its just a start that needs slightly more gas. Once they get the feel for it, go progressively harder, to a point, and let them practice a few times. If you find they are slipping the clutch too much, try a less steep hill until they master it.
I have not met a person that couldn't learn to drive stick. IMO, putting the vehicle in 4-lo is really not very benefical to learning how the vehicle will act. My 4runner with a 3.4, you can pop the clutch out from a dead stop in 4-lo in 3rd and it won't stall... the friction point in 4-lo is really hard to judge, and will probably make matters worse. Just my opinion though, do what you have to do.
Hope this helps. Let me know if you try this how it works out for you.
Mar 31, 2009 | 12:58 PM
#249
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Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 562
Likes: 1
From: Sacramento Valley, Ca
I let my girlfriend drive my yota for the 1st time last weekend and she did AMAZINGLY Well!! I had her feel the friction point 1st, then incorporate some gas. We only played with it for maybe 20 mins and several starts. She did GREAT and didn't stall it untill she tried to back up a few feet on a slight incline. That's when she stalled it once and only once.
Mar 31, 2009 | 02:03 PM
#250
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Registered User
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,094
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From: South
Hey ST, just wanted to offer a few tips to you or anyone trying to teach someone the fine art of driving stick.
Right off the bat, the first thing that I do is to not allow them to even touch the gas peddle. I make them practice getting used to that friction point. Just easing out the clutch slowly, letting them feel it, and about how far their foot has to travel until it reaches that point. Once they get that, I have had pretty good success with getting them to get the vehicle rolling without the use of gas. This is a good exercise to really help them dial in on clutch control. Practice that a few more times until they can do it without stalling, and then add the gas. When it comes to adding the gas into the mix, I tell all my students (thats right, I've taught at least 6 people how to drive stick hahaha, and we've never burnt up a clutch) to think of the gas and clutch as a see-saw. If one is going in, the other should be coming out. At least for getting started and the such haha.
I have them further practice the gas and clutch thing, telling them if they used too much gas, or let the clutch out too slow or too fast. I find you'll never have to tell a newb that they used too little gas...
Doing all that, plus some verbal encouragement, has led to a 100% success rate, however, the time it took to get each person to that point has varied. My worst was my friend who thought he'd be able to pick it right up. He wanted to go straight to a seasoned clutch master like myself from a nobody in one hour's time. He took a full 2 hours to teach stick to, but once he realized he'll never be as good as me, it got a whole lot easier from there. I'd say on average, I can teach someone the basics in about 20-30 minutes though.
Then comes the inclined starts...
Don't try to teach them hills at first. I tried that with one person, and it just isn't really feasible until they have some practice at driving stick. I say when they don't have to think about driving stick too much, is when they are ready to learn a hill start. The concept on a hill is a bit harder to grasp, and should not be attempted immediately. In other words, save it for another day, after the newb has had some seat time and is pretty comfortable with starting out and shifting gears. As there is not a super good way to teach it, I find that with a little coaching, people can figure it out for themselves, providing they are practiced in starts, stops, and shifts on the level or very slight incline. Start small to get the feel.
Starting on a slight incline allows them to use the nifty friction point they learned about previously to hold the vehicle while they move their foot from the brake to the gas. Then its just a start that needs slightly more gas. Once they get the feel for it, go progressively harder, to a point, and let them practice a few times. If you find they are slipping the clutch too much, try a less steep hill until they master it.
I have not met a person that couldn't learn to drive stick. IMO, putting the vehicle in 4-lo is really not very benefical to learning how the vehicle will act. My 4runner with a 3.4, you can pop the clutch out from a dead stop in 4-lo in 3rd and it won't stall... the friction point in 4-lo is really hard to judge, and will probably make matters worse. Just my opinion though, do what you have to do.
Hope this helps. Let me know if you try this how it works out for you.
Right off the bat, the first thing that I do is to not allow them to even touch the gas peddle. I make them practice getting used to that friction point. Just easing out the clutch slowly, letting them feel it, and about how far their foot has to travel until it reaches that point. Once they get that, I have had pretty good success with getting them to get the vehicle rolling without the use of gas. This is a good exercise to really help them dial in on clutch control. Practice that a few more times until they can do it without stalling, and then add the gas. When it comes to adding the gas into the mix, I tell all my students (thats right, I've taught at least 6 people how to drive stick hahaha, and we've never burnt up a clutch) to think of the gas and clutch as a see-saw. If one is going in, the other should be coming out. At least for getting started and the such haha.
I have them further practice the gas and clutch thing, telling them if they used too much gas, or let the clutch out too slow or too fast. I find you'll never have to tell a newb that they used too little gas...
Doing all that, plus some verbal encouragement, has led to a 100% success rate, however, the time it took to get each person to that point has varied. My worst was my friend who thought he'd be able to pick it right up. He wanted to go straight to a seasoned clutch master like myself from a nobody in one hour's time. He took a full 2 hours to teach stick to, but once he realized he'll never be as good as me, it got a whole lot easier from there
. I'd say on average, I can teach someone the basics in about 20-30 minutes though.Then comes the inclined starts...
Don't try to teach them hills at first. I tried that with one person, and it just isn't really feasible until they have some practice at driving stick. I say when they don't have to think about driving stick too much, is when they are ready to learn a hill start. The concept on a hill is a bit harder to grasp, and should not be attempted immediately. In other words, save it for another day, after the newb has had some seat time and is pretty comfortable with starting out and shifting gears. As there is not a super good way to teach it, I find that with a little coaching, people can figure it out for themselves, providing they are practiced in starts, stops, and shifts on the level or very slight incline. Start small to get the feel.
Starting on a slight incline allows them to use the nifty friction point they learned about previously to hold the vehicle while they move their foot from the brake to the gas. Then its just a start that needs slightly more gas. Once they get the feel for it, go progressively harder, to a point, and let them practice a few times. If you find they are slipping the clutch too much, try a less steep hill until they master it.
I have not met a person that couldn't learn to drive stick. IMO, putting the vehicle in 4-lo is really not very benefical to learning how the vehicle will act. My 4runner with a 3.4, you can pop the clutch out from a dead stop in 4-lo in 3rd and it won't stall... the friction point in 4-lo is really hard to judge, and will probably make matters worse. Just my opinion though, do what you have to do.
Hope this helps. Let me know if you try this how it works out for you.
As for how I like the 3.4 with the r150f compared to the 22r and 22re's I've owned... Well, honestly it feels like just the tiniest bit more powerful (able to hold hwy speed decently), but other than that, no different. Thing that has me thrown for a loop is that at 70mph, the rpm sits at 4k... Wondering if that's normal, or just the fact that I have the 4.10s with 31s. Dunno what, but I need to look into that. Been getting about 250ish miles to the tank (15gals), mostly highway, which is about 16-17mpg, so that's kind of blah. Especially since these were rated at 22mpg hwy and mines pretty much stock on 31s...
Mar 31, 2009 | 06:31 PM
#256
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2,094
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From: South
And yeah, I figured the the rpms were a little high. According to my calculations, with a 5th gear ratio of 0.84, tcase with 1:1 high range, 4.10 gears, and 31" tires, my road speeds and rpms should be something more like this:
2000rpm - 54mph
2500rpm - 67mph
3000rpm - 80mph
3500rpm - 94mph
4000rpm - 107mph
So do I just fubar my numbers, or is something else wrong?
2000rpm - 54mph
2500rpm - 67mph
3000rpm - 80mph
3500rpm - 94mph
4000rpm - 107mph
So do I just fubar my numbers, or is something else wrong?
Mar 31, 2009 | 09:08 PM
#257
Contributing Member
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,336
Likes: 2
From: Harrisburg, PA
And yeah, I figured the the rpms were a little high. According to my calculations, with a 5th gear ratio of 0.84, tcase with 1:1 high range, 4.10 gears, and 31" tires, my road speeds and rpms should be something more like this:
2000rpm - 54mph
2500rpm - 67mph
3000rpm - 80mph
3500rpm - 94mph
4000rpm - 107mph
So do I just fubar my numbers, or is something else wrong?
2000rpm - 54mph
2500rpm - 67mph
3000rpm - 80mph
3500rpm - 94mph
4000rpm - 107mph
So do I just fubar my numbers, or is something else wrong?
If I ever have to rebuild the transmission, I want a steeper 5th gear for sure... And I would rate my 4runner about on par with my 3.0 auto truck... I guess the 3.4 really makes a difference if swapped into our trucks, but in a stock vehicle, I really don't consider it hardly any faster...
Apr 1, 2009 | 08:04 AM
#259
Contributing Member
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,336
Likes: 2
From: Harrisburg, PA
no way his tcase is stuck in low range, he'd top out at like 35-40MPH.
hey swampy, I made those instructions into a thread
hey swampy, I made those instructions into a thread
Apr 1, 2009 | 09:20 AM
#260
Registered User
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 562
Likes: 1
From: Sacramento Valley, Ca
That's what I expected. Not knowing tacos, I thought I would ask. The only other thing I can think of the axle was regeared and he didn't know it. Or the Tach isn't reading correctly. . . But with the kind of mileage he's getting, that doesn't seem to likely.
ST Was it running at 4k @ 70 before you started teaching your sis to drive stick?
ST Was it running at 4k @ 70 before you started teaching your sis to drive stick?
