Notices
86-95 Trucks & 4Runners 2nd/3rd gen pickups, and 1st/2nd gen 4Runners with IFS

Overheating issue

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old Mar 23, 2008 | 06:05 PM
  #21  
91Toyota's Avatar
Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,805
Likes: 1
From: Salem, OR
Originally Posted by abecedarian
If the idle is always high, I'd suspect a vacuum leak- could cause overheating, but not from a simple change to using antifreeze. Potentially, you've got too much antifreeze and not enough water. Also, it could be the sensor malfunctioning.
But as a test to check for a blown head gasket, remove the thermostat and put everything together, take the radiator cap off and start the truck then make sure the radiator is full. If you start seeing bubbles in the radiator that smell like gasoline, you've most likely got a blown head gasket.
Thanks. I checked all of my vacuum lines and they all SEEM fine...I guess they could have cracks...but they are all where they are supposed to go.

I will check the radiator thing in a little while...as it has nothing in it right now (no water or antifreeze)

Concerning #3 cylinder...

Have you thoroughly check the valve lash? Could have a rockerarm too tight; holding a valve open. Although I imagine this would have little effect on your overheating.

0.008" Intake
0.012" Exhaust

is the recommended setting. I have always had far better luck setting them with the engine warm.
Thanks. I had poor compression before the head job...as I thought it was the head it turned out it wasn't. I adjusted the intake cold then the exhaust cold...ran it til I got it warm then adjusted them again. I don't think it would have anything to do with over heating though.

deserthound- I just replaced the head gasket and doing so I replaced the guides. The timing chain was just replaced by the previous owner so I doubt that I have the same problem as you. Thanks for the long post though!!!

I did not read it all but did you try a 160 Degree thermostat? Or running it with no thermo to see if it helped?
Didn't try a 160 thermostat but I did run it with out...and it DID NOT overheat. It barely got warm.
Reply
Old Mar 23, 2008 | 06:16 PM
  #22  
abecedarian's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 12,723
Likes: 6
From: Temecula Valley, CA
Just looking at the vacuum hoses does not mean you don't have a leak. You need to do something along the lines of spraying carb cleaner or WD40 on all of the hoses, gaskets, et al, while the engine is running so you can listen for changes in the idle speed, etc.
Reply
Old Mar 23, 2008 | 06:18 PM
  #23  
91Toyota's Avatar
Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,805
Likes: 1
From: Salem, OR
Yeah I know...but I don't feel like putting chemicals on my engine or hoses. How would a vacuum leak cause over heating anyway????
Reply
Old Mar 23, 2008 | 06:21 PM
  #24  
abecedarian's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 12,723
Likes: 6
From: Temecula Valley, CA
Too much air= lean fuel mixture.
Need I say much more?
Reply
Old Mar 23, 2008 | 06:32 PM
  #25  
91Toyota's Avatar
Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,805
Likes: 1
From: Salem, OR
yeah...if you want. I unplugged a vacuum line while it was running to see if it would run worse and it did. If I did have a vacuum leak wouldn't it idle LESS and be rough???

Last edited by 91Toyota; Mar 30, 2008 at 12:30 PM.
Reply
Old Mar 23, 2008 | 06:41 PM
  #26  
abecedarian's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 12,723
Likes: 6
From: Temecula Valley, CA
You can either act like you know better and ignore everything or realize you don't know everything and some things may seem counter-intuitive to what you already know. I would probably lean towards option 2 since you're already here asking for help.
Obviously, since you said so, you've turned the idle screw in and it didn't affect a darned thing. That fact, logically, implies air is getting into the engine somewhere.
So... since you're not running a diesel engine means...?

Last edited by abecedarian; Mar 23, 2008 at 06:42 PM.
Reply
Old Mar 23, 2008 | 06:54 PM
  #27  
mr_schuster's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 164
Likes: 0
From: NC
OK.. This one is for a Toyota tech to answer.

Is it possible that when replacing a headgasket on a 22R-E, it can be installed upside down blocking a cooling passage? Don't think that sounds stupid because inexperienced technicians working for Toyota at the time the 3.0 headgaskets were being repaired under warranty would place the headgaskets on the wrong head blocking coolant passages. I have see it multiple times. As for the 22R-E I can't recall if it is possible.

If your truely confident your head gasket is ok, the t-stat is installed correctly, then you have to have an air pocket or a faulty t-stat.

You never mentioned where you were originally leaking coolant from and what you did to remedy the problem.

Also if you have a 40 psi in one cylinder its probably a burnt valve, over tightened valve, cracked ring or whatever, In that case that cylinder is not going to burn fuel. The o2 may read this as a rich signal and lean out the motor like someone above said.
Reply
Old Mar 23, 2008 | 07:02 PM
  #28  
mr_schuster's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 164
Likes: 0
From: NC
[QUOTE=abecedarian;50786814]You can either act like you know better and ignore everything or realize you don't know everything and some things may seem counter-intuitive to what you already know. I would probably lean towards option 2 since you're already here asking for help.
Obviously, since you said so, you've turned the idle screw in and it didn't affect a darned thing. That fact, logically, implies air is getting into the engine somewhere.
QUOTE]

I can only think maybe the air boot is cracked after the MAF or the dashpot is sticking. If the engine has that great of an air leak entering the engine, its got to run like crap since the air is not being pulled through the MAF and being recognized by the ECM. It would also seem the 02 would recognize how lean the engine was running and try to correct fuel trim. I don't know. I think that he should work some overtime and take it to the dealer. Why keep bothering with the headache. Get it repaired before it gets worse.
Reply
Old Mar 23, 2008 | 07:11 PM
  #29  
mr_schuster's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 164
Likes: 0
From: NC
Another thought.. You got a good radiator cap that holds pressure?
Reply
Old Mar 23, 2008 | 07:45 PM
  #30  
abecedarian's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 12,723
Likes: 6
From: Temecula Valley, CA
I'll admit, I'm not an authority on toyo FI systems, but being a certified heavy equipment mechanic and also having owned a few injected VW's and seeing something like what is going on- a high idle that can't be 'twisted down'... they were most often caused by vacuum leaks. Disconnecting hoses won't always reveal a leak either since... obviously... a disconnected hose is already leaking....
This is why I suggested spraying carb cleaner or WD everywhere- and I'd suggest it for a diesel or gas engine. These "hydrocarbons" WILL affect the idle speed: diesels will tend to speed up and gas engines will tend to lug down or sputter.
Since on gas engines, vacuum leaks can also cause overheating, as can head gaskets... it makes sense to start simple- with the hoses... and maybe looking in the radiator for bubbles. Not too hard and may cost about 2 bucks for a can of carb cleaner or WD- neither of which will hurt the hoses... particularly if you find the leak and have to replace the hose anyways.

Last edited by abecedarian; Mar 23, 2008 at 07:46 PM.
Reply
Old Mar 23, 2008 | 08:46 PM
  #31  
91Toyota's Avatar
Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,805
Likes: 1
From: Salem, OR
Originally Posted by mr_schuster
You never mentioned where you were originally leaking coolant from and what you did to remedy the problem.

Also if you have a 40 psi in one cylinder its probably a burnt valve, over tightened valve, cracked ring or whatever, In that case that cylinder is not going to burn fuel. The o2 may read this as a rich signal and lean out the motor like someone above said.
The head IS fine. Didn't over tighten the valves...they are at spec. I had the head checked by a local shop and they lightly shaved it (just barely) and checked out the valves. He did a valve job on the whole thing.

I coolant was leaking from my intake. Being an idiot...I couldn't get my intake off...so I used a pry bar and bent it out a little. I tried using silicone or something like that and it did NOT work. It leaked like crazy. I took my intake off again and used jb weld to fill in the gap and then smoothed it out flush. I did NOT bend the whole intake...I bent a little piece out to the right of the thermostat like where it the coolant goes into the engine. It leaked because there was only a small area to actually hold the coolant in. I then bought new gaskets and put some gasketmaker stuff on top of the gasket just in case and then put it all back together. It worked just great with water. One day my heater hose popped off and I noticed it was leaking water so I pulled over and put water in it and drove it and it was fine. Nothing major. I don't have a check engine light on...so are you saying there is no lean or rich code???
Reply
Old Mar 23, 2008 | 08:47 PM
  #32  
91Toyota's Avatar
Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,805
Likes: 1
From: Salem, OR
Originally Posted by abecedarian
I'll admit, I'm not an authority on toyo FI systems, but being a certified heavy equipment mechanic and also having owned a few injected VW's and seeing something like what is going on- a high idle that can't be 'twisted down'... they were most often caused by vacuum leaks. Disconnecting hoses won't always reveal a leak either since... obviously... a disconnected hose is already leaking....
This is why I suggested spraying carb cleaner or WD everywhere- and I'd suggest it for a diesel or gas engine. These "hydrocarbons" WILL affect the idle speed: diesels will tend to speed up and gas engines will tend to lug down or sputter.
Since on gas engines, vacuum leaks can also cause overheating, as can head gaskets... it makes sense to start simple- with the hoses... and maybe looking in the radiator for bubbles. Not too hard and may cost about 2 bucks for a can of carb cleaner or WD- neither of which will hurt the hoses... particularly if you find the leak and have to replace the hose anyways.
I'll fill my engine up with coolant and i'll burp it then I will do your test...and I will see what happens.
Reply
Old Mar 23, 2008 | 08:48 PM
  #33  
91Toyota's Avatar
Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,805
Likes: 1
From: Salem, OR
Originally Posted by mr_schuster
Another thought.. You got a good radiator cap that holds pressure?
Yep...I just bought a new one ($7) and my radiator is about a year old along with the old cap which I am NOT using.
Reply
Old Mar 23, 2008 | 08:51 PM
  #34  
91Toyota's Avatar
Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,805
Likes: 1
From: Salem, OR
I can only think maybe the air boot is cracked after the MAF or the dashpot is sticking. If the engine has that great of an air leak entering the engine, its got to run like crap since the air is not being pulled through the MAF and being recognized by the ECM. It would also seem the 02 would recognize how lean the engine was running and try to correct fuel trim. I don't know. I think that he should work some overtime and take it to the dealer. Why keep bothering with the headache. Get it repaired before it gets worse.
I don't have a job...nor do I have enough money to get it repaired or to take to a shop. I took the dash pot off and tested my truck and nothing. I put it back on and there is no difference. The dash pot DOES NOT touch anything other than the side of the intake...I thought it was supposed to touch something other than a solid thing. (like it doesn't touch the butterfly)
Reply
Old Mar 23, 2008 | 09:34 PM
  #35  
abecedarian's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 12,723
Likes: 6
From: Temecula Valley, CA
If it helps you feel better, I own a '91 pickup. It's a 22R-E. It had a bout of overheating that was fixed by first: new fan-clutch; then second: a new thermostat and finally: a new sending unit. Turns out the gauge was reading the wrong temp all along because of the sending unit- there was nothing wrong with the engine after all. So I spent about 3 days and 60 bucks to fix a 1 hour / 10 dollar problem. Now I've got a spare fan-clutch and thermostat. SO? All the steps I've mentioned lead me to that. There was no magical solution that fixed the problem. I started my troubleshooting at the basement/cheapest checks and replaced every part along the way and worked my way up.

But I will not tell you to replace the sending unit first. Test the vacuum lines for leaks (you did say that adjusting the screw didn't change your idle: BIG CLUE there is something 'else' going on). Test, test test....
It may turn out you've just got a vacuum leak and a bad sending unit... but you won't know if you don't test.

I hope it all works out for you.

Last edited by abecedarian; Mar 23, 2008 at 09:44 PM.
Reply
Old Mar 23, 2008 | 09:42 PM
  #36  
91Toyota's Avatar
Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,805
Likes: 1
From: Salem, OR
I just wrote a big reply and it got deleted....damn!!!

I tested my temp of my engine at the head at it was 250
Tested my brothers at the head on the same spot and it was 210...so it is overheating.

Sending unit works. Overheats while moving.

About the screw...I said it is screwed in. It will change my idle...but when I start unscrewing it my idle just surges...it doesn't get higher and higher it gets a little higher then starts surging. I don't think my sending unit is bad. I unplugged it while running and it went down...then I plugged it back in and my temp went back to the spot.

Last edited by 91Toyota; Mar 23, 2008 at 09:45 PM.
Reply
Old Mar 23, 2008 | 09:51 PM
  #37  
abecedarian's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 12,723
Likes: 6
From: Temecula Valley, CA
bubbles in the radiator?
Reply
Old Mar 23, 2008 | 10:08 PM
  #38  
91Toyota's Avatar
Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,805
Likes: 1
From: Salem, OR
Like when it is running? I think sometimes it bubbles...I can't quite remember. If it bubbles then wouldn't that mean I have a leak???

So, tomorrow when I check should I take off the radiator cap and look at it while running to see if it bubbles?

If it does then I have a leak...if not I have a different problem...right?

When I burped my radiator it like gushed out...like a damn geyser!!!
Reply
Old Mar 23, 2008 | 10:17 PM
  #39  
abecedarian's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 12,723
Likes: 6
From: Temecula Valley, CA
When the engine is running, if there are bubbles coming up in the radiator- constant littleish bubbles, not just big burps, nothing that blows a lot of water out... more than likely a piston is pushing air past the head gasket and into the cooling system.
This is why I suggested taking the thermostat out- so it wouldn't hold back any big pockets of air.

Last edited by abecedarian; Mar 23, 2008 at 10:18 PM.
Reply
Old Mar 23, 2008 | 10:20 PM
  #40  
91Toyota's Avatar
Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,805
Likes: 1
From: Salem, OR
my thermostat is out right now. I will have to check this out tomorrow. Thanks for the help! I will update back tomorrow!
Reply



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 08:52 PM.