smishgibson

Hello,

I have searched around, and haven't been able to come up with a definitive answer, so I thought I should make a new thread.

I bought an 86 SR5 pickup, 2wd 22re turbo, about 3 months ago. It has 140,000 miles. Since the day I bought it, it has had "startup rattle". I saved up the money, and got a timing set (chain, tensioner, guides, gears, oil pump, gaskets, etc), and just finished installing them.

I also had the oil pan off, cleaned it out, cleaned the oil pickup, also cleaned the factory oil cooler(I think this is a turbo only item, it is an oil to water cooler, that goes between the oil filter, and the block)

Buttoned everything back up, installed a new toyota oil filter, 10w30 synthetic oil, and commenced to starting.

The startup rattle, is if anything, worse.

It is distinctively a chain rattle, (sounds like chain to cover, toward the bottom) that lasts 2-5 seconds after starting. When oil pressure reaches 1/4 on the gauge, it is gone.

I can shut it off, and restart immediately and I get no rattle, but if it let it set, for more than 5-10 mins, and restart, it does rattle.

I suspect that my tensioner is bleeding off, but I don't understand why.

Just looking at it, it seems like the head has been off, and perhaps surfaced, I wonder if it was surfaced to much, and the head is too low, and the chain is now, basicly too short?

I'll be taking the valve cover back off tomorrow, and start it and see if I can see the slack.

Smish

PS - this is timing set I used http://www.rockauto.com/catalog/x,ca...t,partGroup,20
I used the beck/arnley HD.

DanStew

Welcome to the club. There is another post similar to this. I also did the same thing and still have the same noise. Do you also get a rattle at times at about 2000 rpms cruising around down the road?

smishgibson

Yeah, I did read your thread.

It never rattles, even above 5,000 rpm, after startup. .

I have actually installed at least 3 of these chains before, and never had a problem with rattling, after replacement.

Smish

DeathCougar

iTrader: (23)

Its the aftermarket tensioner. I have installed both factory and aftermarket in trucks. The factory ones i had have never done this. Every aftermarket one I have ever installed has done it.

And what torque did you tighten them to?

paxil4x4

Where did you buy the parts?

Brendan

sluggish oil pump?

Flash319

Just the way they are.........I have done 4 or 5 of my own trucks and they still do it. I bet when they were new they did it. It is a sucky design but I would not worry about it. If it is rattling all the time I would worry.

smishgibson

new





I might go ahead and get a whole timing set from stealership, and redo...

Thanks for the replies.

Smish

smishgibson

Local autoparts store.

drew303

every yoter ive started rattles a tidbit at startup. Once the oil pressure gets up the motor smooths out.

You shouldnt have to replace everything, just the tensioner. But i wouldnt even do that. If you installed steel guides then you really dont have much to worry about. Maybe in 6 months and your bored pull the cover and check the chain.

The chain will only make contact w/ the cover if the guides wear through.fyi

DeathCougar

iTrader: (23)

No need for a whole timing set. Just the tensioner. And while you are in there, get the metal backed guides from DOA.

drew303

" If the cyl. head or eng. block has been resurfaced use shim"

off of http://www.rockauto.com/catalog/x,ca...t,partGroup,20

huh? And where would a "shim" go?

drew303

Im wondering if steel guides vs the stock plastic guides arent just more noisy because of the obvious? The chain rides on them constantly.

smishgibson

A shim should mean a "steel shim" headgasket, basicly like running 2 headgaskets, only the second one being a very thin metal shim.

I think LC engineering sells such, althought it may only be MLS headgaskets, not shims.

Well, one thing that i find odd, is that my old guides were in place, and not worn through, but you could clearly see where the timing chain was making contact with the timing cover, down at the bottom, below and to the passenger side of the crankshaft.

Now this noise sounds atleast the same, if not louder, and it comes from the same place.

I'm afraid if I leave it too long, I'm going to get more aluminium shavings in my oil .

I will go ahead and pickup a dealership tensioner, and a few more cover gaskets, in case mine tear, on the way home from work tomorrow, and ill go ahead and take her apart.

Smish

smishgibson

Is it possible that the dealership tensioner has a checkball and spring it in, to retain some degree of tension during startup?

Smish

drew303

hmm ... im trying to visualize how its hitting the cover w/ the guide intact... other than the tensioner not working.

i pulled this off of 4x4wire



I just did a timing chain on my brothers 22r a few weeks ago but still having hard time seeing how it can make contact w/ the guide at the lower sprocket.. other than complete failure of the tensioner.


i found this written by Engnbldr:

"I would suggest you check to see if the oil pump mounting bolts got mixed up during install. If so, any long bolt will restrict the tensioner pad, interfere with it's operation. The result will be noise at best, and chain/guiderails/tensioner failure quickly, with the chain finally breaking. "

from here: http://www.4x4wire.com/forums/showfl...62&Main=826336

keithguts

I have the same problem with my 95 runner, same noise. I guess my question is, is this bad for the engine, I had the compleat top end re-done, and it still is making the noise at startup for about 1-2 sec's.

Targetnut

This may not be it, but is it possible that the oil pump bolt that goes through the timing cover is sticking through and interfering with the operation of the tensioner?

If you got the bolts mixed up and that bolt is longer, or if it is stretched It could hit the tensioner

Flash319

If the bolt is hitting the tensioner you will get a rattle all the time. The rattle is the chain slapping the guide, this will not cause a problem unless they are plastic guides as they will break aftera while. That is what they are there for to "guide" the chain.

SEAIRESCUE

Head resurfacing is a performance issue, not a problem for the tensioner and its ability to compensate. Cutting the head will retard the cam. Adjustable cam sprockets will solve the problem. Also, "shimgaskets" or thicker head gaskets will correct, to a point, resurfaced heads. I think they are about 50% thicker than a standard gasket.

As suggested, I would get a Toyota tensioner and a new oil pump. Upon reassembly, check the length of all bolts that go through the pump to ensure that they are equal length on the back side. You may want to put a steel guide on the driver side for insurance.

I would also take a can of carburetor cleaner and shoot some into the oil hole that feeds the tensioner. One blob of sludge would hamper its effectiveness. Once the motor warms, the solvent will cook off. My 1987 turbo truck with 242,000 miles is quiet. Block is original, head has been overhauled, OEM tensioner and oil pump. CT26 Supra turbo, synthetic oil, shimgasket due to head warpage.