What do you mean "Setting by ear" - if you're advancing it to fast idle point by ear, you're not doing it correctly. You need to jumper it, which will make it idle low as it pulls idle advance... Don't time EFI vehicles by ear.

Maxx is having a different issue - he's indicating that he's using a lot of advance and the truck is running better...

 

You are absolutely correct, I skipped that step in my post on timing. I just assumed you'd know to jumper it when setting timing. My bad. Yes, always jumper Te1 & E1 when setting timing, even 'by ear'.

And yes, my issue seems to be that this engine just loves more advance. Question is why.
I've often thought it's the computer being unwilling to do what the engine needs and it's the one area in which I've had no control over mods and how it behaves.

I'm pretty sure the surge of power at 3krpm is computer coming out of closed loop mode and giving the engine some fuel.
I wonder if this high advance is also somehow related to something screwy the computer is doing. I don't get high EGTs when my foot's in it either (peak at WOT is about 1380), only at cruise power (It's not WOT, but it's 'workin') does EGT get silly. The worst spike occured like when cresting a hill, it's just had a good long climb and now cruise control is backing off the throttle, but still working EGT would go stupid and I'd have to cancel cruise. (now that the advance is cranked this doesn't happen.)
I only have a narrowband O2 now and gauge, but you can still watch it do some odd things at odd times thru the power curve.

I've known (or strongly suspected) that I'm giving up power in a lot of places on the power curve. And based on some 'odd condition' days I can get high MPG too (seems to like a 100% humidity day a lot.) {Then again...maybe the wet road surface has less frictional losses for those 12" meats.}

If it turns out I can do a MS for $500ish and gain full control over timing and fuel that's a no brainer to me. I'd skip the overnight express, but they'd have the order immediately.

 

Well, it seems I do not have a VAST system, it's ESA (one pole on bottom w/ double pickups and 24 on top) which isn't well supported.

The eMS-PRO does support it, but $900!


***edit, make that almost $900 w/ the connector

 

The other option might be to use EDIS-6, which is very well supported, and rock solid... It's not as plug and play as the 22RE VAST stuff, but it sounds like you'd be pulling a tooth out of that distributor anyway.

 

I had it jumpered and it idled like a turd until I started playing around with the position of the dizzy. When I checked the timing with it still jumpered it was reading about 14 deg BTDC.

I didn't leave it that way because it didn't seem right, I'm not sure where to go from here. The only thing I can think to check is the TPS.

 

I may be wrong... but if u over advance ur timing dont u run the risk of burning ur pistons? Just because something seems to run better, does that mean its right? if I can get more power by just turning my distributer, w/out burning my up... that sounds good to me!!

 

Well, the thread started and I both have modified engines with different cams in them so that changes things.

 

ok...thats what i thought... i have 250k on my stock 3vze, i am very familiar with suspension and driveline in these trucks, have never had to do engine work, until now, knock sensor.. and i was wondering if this might be a quick solution for me

 

I think at 250K trying to squeeze more power out of it is just asking for it to blow up. I bet you enjoyed paying for the new knock sensor, I had to replace mine when I bought the truck. Very expensive!

 

no..i havent done the knock sensor yet... its gonna b a pain in the butt job, and i live in maine, and we still have 4ft of snow on the ground.. it is the only vehicle that will make it to the road, so i was hoping for a quick fix till i can start driving my other veh's

 

some1 actualy said u can get away with mounting an new sensor on the side of the block, so as to avoid ripping all the stuff at the top off, and possibly being in garage 4 a couple days, that would b awesome, but im sure it cant b that easy, i have found a new sensor for $150 + $15 for the wires.. any idea if that may work???

 

What's so hard about changing a knock sensor? I know i's not easy like if it were on the outside of the block, but removing upper and lower manifolds isn't that hard.
2hrs and a hundred bucks in parts ought to get done.

 

Changing the knock sensor took all of 5 minutes on my 22RE but if I remember correctly a new one was $200+.

 

2 hrs?? i think it would take me that long just to label all vacum hoses and such, and as i said b4... ive never had to do much engine work on these b4, other than timing belt, plugs, wires..etc so i dont feel confident in doing it in 2 hrs, and w/ 250...im planning on need finding other probs along the way, i know ill have to do it... but for now, i would feel better having a backup veh that could make it to the main road

 

i guess what i really want to know.. i have been getting code 52 for about 20-30k... am i ruining my motor? is there something temporary i can do to "fix" it till some snow melts and i can get the thing into my garage? Or should i start shoveling now, and plan to take a few days off to get it done?... dont want to destroy my motor!!!

 

I don't take the vacuum hoses off.
Disconnect the very minimum on that upper plenum to get it off and lay it over on the fender.
Take off the fuel rails.
Probably have to take the front cover off so you can hold the belt down when you remove the upper pulley. Use a bunjee or something to keep tension on it when you remove the pulley.
Pull the manifold
now you are at the sensor. replace it and the wire and put it back together.
If it took three hours including the beers and finding missing tools I'd be surprised.

I just bought a knocksensor and wire last year and seem to rememeber a $60 price,,,something like that. I'm sure you can look it up online somewhere.


Have you tried clearing the code and see if it picks it up again?

 

Actually advancing your timing means the fuel burns earlier, before it's going out the exhaust valve - so less of a chance of burning a valve.

Advancing it too much causes detonation, which can crack or melt pistions.

Something is up with Maxx's motor - might be electronic related - don't try cranking up your base timing beyond a few degrees at home. Very Bad Things [TM] can happen.

 

When I put the distrib back in this time I rechecked the way I was checking timing and it comes up the same. Jumpered, operating temp, below 800 rpm, comes up 28deg. I modded the distrib a little and can now get 33deg.


While I was tinkering I figured I'd chop off the EGR, but when I took it apart it was clean as a whistle. When I put a vac on the ports it moves and does what it should. I think I leave it alone. Might try blocking the vac port. But I think I fiddled with it a long time ago and found little to say one way or the other.

if we disregard emissions most engines like as much spark advance as you can give them without pre ignition or detonation. Where that point is differs from engine to engine. The 10deg stock setting is likely a blend of many factors.

 

ok..neat... ill try that..all instructions i got said remove all vac stuff.. i imagine that would save me some time... and i understand the beers and searching for tools... thats y i always allow extra time for what i fix.. i did clear codes..it came back.. i dont even think its the sensor..just the pigtail.. i tried to do a cut and splice, but there is still bare wire exposed where it goes into the head.
can u remove upper plenum with egr still attached to exhaust manifold? that would make things much much quicker

 

also.. i just figured that a knock sensor "listens" for knock under load right?? thus advancing timing to correct this knock.. figured if u advance timing slightly.. maybe it would help.. might sound stupid.. but as i said.. i need a quick temp fix till i can get into my garage