It has been my experience that a front wheel is in the air MUCH more often than the rear...

Stock suspension 2nd gen 4Runner with admittedly a lot of weight in the back ... need to weigh it some time ...

 

well 4 runner weight distribution is about 60/40 front to rear. so unless you've got lots of weight in the rear physics says your gonna lift the rear.

 

Physics that neglects the laws of torsion bar vs coil spring spring rates I guess might say that if that weight distribution is true for a 2nd gen, which I would find hard to believe...

 

How very true physics should really read the book about torsion bars, and coil springs. Shame on it!

Aaron

 

so you all are lifting rears instead of fronts? Wow.

Well, that sucks. I lift fronts all the time. Almost never lift a rear. Guess more flex is what you need.

 

I lift fronts too. Apparently, we got the back'ards model. I demand a recall.

 

I've noticed that loose dirt/gravel while climbing hills has a lot to do with it. When the surface is packed down I'm fine, but just the littlest bit of loose dirt and I have no traction, my tires start spinning, and I'm stuck. It's extremely frustrating.

 

I lift a front tire more often then a rear but like everything else in life IT DEPENDS, especially on what trail your running, and what type of terrain.

 

I think you'd be better off with a locker in the rear to begin with, because then you can do trails in 2wd that were hard in 4wd (not that you'd do that but...). You will never have one front wheel on the ground and both rears in the air... I'd start at the rear and go forward. I've never done it but I think a 4wd would act really strange with a locker in the front and open in the rear if it was snowing....Plus steering becomes a complete biotch. If you have ever tried to back up a truck with a spool in the rear you'll see. Front lockers kind of hop and hop and go straight when at full lock.

 

It acts just fine. Did it for a year and a half.

 

4850 total weight, front 2650, rear 2200. This was on the CDOT scale on I70 in Dumont. My fatness, 3/4 fuel, about 100lbs in trail gear packed in the back, warn winch and bumper in front. I know I'm not as fat as your truck though.

FYI if the scale is "closed" to truckers, they still leave the scale on so you can weigh you own junk for free. (Only seen this scale on, not sure on others)

 

If you have a locker the front likes to fly more (momentum and weight transfer). If you don't you semi-lifted long before and got stuck. Either way without a locker your the one wheel bandito, spin them suckas

 

The one wheeled bandito! I love it!

 

I have done a fair bit of wheeling around in the reiter pit, a wheeling place near seattle. Lots of rocks, mud and sand. i have toyo a/t haven't gotten stuck yet. from what my limited wheeling experience has taught me, finding a line that looks like it will keep both of either the front wheels on the ground is the best

but that being said hitting something like a sandy hill climb, i don't like using the term "hammering it," I like using enough juice to keep the momentum up. if that requires intermittent full throttle once you are somewhat up the hill, than so be it but i don't think you shouldn't hit a hill or an obstacle regardless of what it is at full throttle or with the "hammer down."

In regards to a locker, even just a rear locker would help get up a huge amount of the power to ground and move over a few obstacles. Us wheelers with IFS and would really benefit from a real locker taking advantage of the pretty decent flex of the rear leaf sprung or rear coil sprung trucks and 4runners.

 

For those who haven't met thefatkid, he's really not that big... and his explanation of lifting fronts while locked, rears while open makes sense.

Turning with JUST the front locked is not too bad (admittedly much harder than normal), it's when both the front and rear are locked that you have MAJOR problems.

x2 for the "one wheeled bandito"

 

I definatly think that adding a locker would help, but I think I'm having the problem even with all 4 tires are on the ground. I think what I need to do is film myself getting stuck so I can really get an idea of whats going on because its kind of hard to know exactly whats going on when I'm in my truck. But back to what I mentioned before, is it possible I don't have the appropriate tire sidewall thickness for the weight of my truck? Maybe its just my driving but I seem to have the problem going slow and fast, when I start lurching and bucking arond, bouncing up and down, it gets even worse when I give it more gas, unless I really just floor it and bomb up the hill, but I feel like I'm gonna break something if I keep doing that.

 

I see you are in AZ... there is a very strong local Toyota scene here with plenty of trails to choose from.

Keep an eye on the AZ section here on YT for upcoming runs of varying difficulty:
https://www.yotatech.com/forums/f66/

You'll learn a lot more in person with others showing you the way then here online. That said... advice from YT is some of the best you'll find when you aren't behind the wheel.

 

Again. No.

You are describing 100% the effect of not having a locker. Yes, you are lifting a tire. However, increasing the flex will get you past that hole, but as soon as you get to a deeper one, you'll be in the same spot. A locker doesn't care how high off the ground the tire is. It just keeps the truck going. You could cut off your fenders, and build a suspension that flexes 5 feet, and you'd still find holes that you can't drive through, and rocks you can't drive over.

Sidewall thickness is, again, not a problem. A sidewall issue would be evident. you'd either be banging the crap out of your rims, or you'd be getting flats constantly.

 

Where in AZ are you ?

I'm in Tucson and kinda regular run trails up in Florence.




Fred

 

Yeah, I think it's more personal preference than anything, I've been building SA rigs for about 5 years now and have never (before now) wanted to cough up money for a 7.5 IFS diff locker, but those days are changing.... I do prefer a locker in the rear first though, vast improvement over open and IMO has way less effect on steering and 4wd road manners. Only my opinion and preference though like I said. A front locker definitely could never be a bad thing, especially if you are lifting tires.