Correct.

 

Hmm.....well, it's not the first time. And, probably not the last.

 

if the cooling system is in good shape and you run without a thermostat it wont overheat.
it will run rich (longer)wont have heater or wont be as hot and probably use more oil because pistons and rings wont expand if not running at the intended operating temp..
summer is probably fine but winter you should run a thermostat.

that said ive been running my daily driver 89 22re for a over a year without a thermostat. only because ive been neglecting her..

i drilled a hole in my wifes 94 3.0 (over a year ago)and my old 1uz (just replaced) was running with a drilled thermo.

 

i would think it would also depend on he kind of driving AND the weather.. if you do alot of stop and go or alot of traffic in warm to hot climates, theres obviously not gonna be enough airflow going through the rad with no t stat to keep the constant coolant flow, cool, in which it would most likely overheat, whereas if you had no t stat and drove warm to hot climates with mostly 60+ mph speeds, it would prolly run fine.. idk though, i like the mythbusters idea..

 

I am going to go out on a limb here, and I am no automech or engineer I assure you. As a matter of fact, I have a 22re, and need to change my thermostat out, I don't even know where it is.
But from what I understand, coolant is not really, reheheeely a cooling agent per se; Water, and flow, and transfer is what does the cooling. The main reason for adding the coolant / and or type of coolant is to do a few things; make water ' wetter', make water have certain electochem properties, so that what your cooling system components are made of, regular water won't ' rot' out those certain metal parts of your system. Some coolants being made for more brass stuff, some for more steel stuff, etc.
Finally, coolant keeps the pump nice and smoove and lubricated, so it doesn't 'rust' up or loosen or wallow out it's parts any.
I know the speed demon racer dudes, especially the 1/4 milers, use distilled water, and maybe a bit of a ' wetter' agent, and that is it.
Because the water actually keeps the temps down better, all by itself.

I have read the bits and pieces of above in several diff places, and in articles, mags, on the net, listen to dudes in bike race shops, etc., so
I am pretty confident in the above; but if I am wrong, I can be convinced.
Oh yeah, where is the thermostat, and are you drilling a hole all the way through the middle of this or something, or just around the edges, I don't
get it. Sounds like I wanna try this out...

 

not necessarily true, with the t-stat removed you will experience greater cooling due to the increase in volumetric flow rate(no longer has to squeeze through a small orifice. its like electric fans the faster you move air across a hot surface the faster you will cool it.

 

You are missing some of the main things, antifreeze raises the boiling point and lowers the freezing point of the coolant. Running hot is bad but boiling your coolant is really really bad because you lose your cooling completely then.

I run waterless coolant (Evans). Yes, I sacrifice about 5* of heat transfer ability, but Its never going to boil.

 

gonna add something to my comment,

The faster the cooolant flows the less it will cool down in the radiator. In addition the faster it moves through the engine block, the less heat that is removed from the engine. therefore engine will run hotter, even though the temp gauge may or may not show it.

Only way to to really prove my point is to thermal graph the motor with and without the thermostat in there. With something like a FLIR. Not sure if an Infrared Laser Thermometer would work or not.

 

They're drilling a small hole to mimic the "jiggle valve" that some Tstats have on the flat outside of the thermostat. Make sure the hole is oriented up when its installed so the air can get through. Hole at the bottom won't help at all with burping the engine.

I fill the radiator to just below the top then squeeze the upper hose till I can add more and keep doing that until it doesn't drop anymore. Sometimes you have to squeeze and release kinda fast to get air bubbles out and sometimes have to squeeze the lower hose as well. Never had to reburp my rig ever.

 

What you're missing is that the coolant flows through more cycles the faster it goes. Yes, it removes less heat per cycle but there are more cycles. So, it evens out. Bottom line is this, (unless your coolant boils) you have heat being exchanged 100% of the time either way.

Keep in mind the coolant boils at the head surface first, so running the coolant by the head faster should help reduce boiling at those hot spots. I believe that is why people run those high flow racing water pumps. http://www.edelbrock.com/automotive_...mps_main.shtml

 

Think about it this way:

The purpose of the cooling system is to keep the operating temperature in a specified range and in order to do that it has to move the excess heat from the engine into the atmosphere. Heat transfer, not "temperature transfer." Temperature difference is what drives the flow of heat energy. In general, for conduction and convection, the transfer of heat is equal to some thermal resistance times the difference in temperature. For example, cold outside air and hot coolant in a radiator. In that example the thermal resistance is the type and thickness of metal and the amount of convection applied by the fan. It's easy to compare it to a circuit: heat is current, temp difference is voltage, resistance is itself.

If water is moving slowly through a radiator, one side of it will have hot coolant in it and the other side will have cold coolant. Since heat flow is driven by temperature difference, only the hot side of the radiator will be doing anything. Pumping the water faster will keep the entire surface of the radiator nice and hot so that it can reject heat to the air being forced over it.

Another way to convince yourself of this is to imagine the water pump turning slower and slower... what happens to the temperature of the coolant in the engine? Higher water flowrate will promote better cooling.

 

Yeah it always helps me see things quicker to take equations to the limit. In the extreme limits you can see effects easier.

One other note: On some vehicles there is a weird cooling system design that actually bypasses the radiator flow some if the t-stat is removed completely. On those designs the system can run hotter with no t-stat in place.

 

bad analogy, there is a reason why they make underdrive pullies for water pumps.

 

I think it was a great analogy. They don't make underdrive pulleys because they cool better, they sacrifice cooling ability for the hope of HP gains.

That's the last I'll be dealing with you on this issue, you need to just admit you don't know it all.

 

that's only a part of the reason why underdrive pulleys for water pumps are made. Underdrive pulleys are designed for water pumps because if they are spun too quicky (usually because someone has put an underdrive crank pulley on) they develop cavitation, this cavitation even though the water pump is spinning faster can and will lead to reduced cooling and waterflow. Therefore underdrive pulleys for water pumps are designed for both minimal HP gain if used by themselves or better cooling when used with underdrive crank pulleys.

 

My problem is I do know it all. I just don't believe it......

(That's a little existentialism......for levity. )

 

Right, the whole situation is different with cavitation. I guess the question is how fast do you need to pump for cavitation to occur? My problem is just with the idea that the coolant "needs more time" in the radiator.

 

thook what side are you on on this one, removing will or will not cool the engine better? I forgot already. haha

and remember I am not taking coolant temp here (however as stated above as well) some vehicles ( i think some GMs the ones with the integrated rad cap/overflow????) it will lead to boil over, I am talking physical temperature of the metal of the engine. see above post of mine for more info on my explanation of this.

I did however do retract my statement from much earlier with the coolant (not engine) temp getting hotter and hotter on each pass. This may or may not be true on our toyota motors due to the cooling design.

I know my cutlass that I had quite awhile ago ran extremely hot without the thermo in to the point it warped heads.

 

Looks like I need to have a serious discussion with my old heat transfer professor... and with the guy who wrote the heat transfer book!!

 

Rereading would remedy that bit of amnesia. My posts aren't too far back..... But, in short, I'm on the sideline, for the moment. Honestly, I've never ran a vehicle without a thermostat. I've only read pages here and there on the web written by people who seem to know what they're talking about. I have drilled a hole in the Stant unit currectly residing in my engine, though. And, it has not lead to overheating. Only remedied temp guage overshoot.