92' keeps dying
06-12-2006, 06:36 AM
#1
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92' keeps dying
Hey all,
I have a 92' with a rebuilt 3.0..... installed not long ago. After several new parts and several adjustments, the damn thing keeps dying when:
a) Just when you have come to a stop
b) After you've come to the stop, or just started the vehicle, and then begin to accelerate.
It runs fine when cruising at any speed, but does seem to lack power. This could be just the nature of the 3.0 and that I'm used to the pep of my 22RE. The dying is certainly another issue, though.
I've replaced the knock sensor and wire, the fuel press. reg., the throttle sens., pcv valve, plugs (denso), and a couple of leaky vacuum lines. These replacements were done shortly after the installation and follow up testing and adjustments. It was not a case of throwing parts at the problem, but were actually needed. Of course, that did not stop me from hoping it would fix the problem!!!
Short of spending a fair amount of money once again for something that may be a simple adjustment, does anyone have any suggestions where I may begin to look for the problem? I have already tried setting the throttle stop screw in a tad, but set it back to the factory setting because it then seemed to run worse.
Thanks in advance!!!
I have a 92' with a rebuilt 3.0..... installed not long ago. After several new parts and several adjustments, the damn thing keeps dying when:
a) Just when you have come to a stop
b) After you've come to the stop, or just started the vehicle, and then begin to accelerate.
It runs fine when cruising at any speed, but does seem to lack power. This could be just the nature of the 3.0 and that I'm used to the pep of my 22RE. The dying is certainly another issue, though.
I've replaced the knock sensor and wire, the fuel press. reg., the throttle sens., pcv valve, plugs (denso), and a couple of leaky vacuum lines. These replacements were done shortly after the installation and follow up testing and adjustments. It was not a case of throwing parts at the problem, but were actually needed. Of course, that did not stop me from hoping it would fix the problem!!!
Short of spending a fair amount of money once again for something that may be a simple adjustment, does anyone have any suggestions where I may begin to look for the problem? I have already tried setting the throttle stop screw in a tad, but set it back to the factory setting because it then seemed to run worse.
Thanks in advance!!!
Last edited by thook; 06-12-2006 at 06:41 AM.
06-12-2006, 09:53 AM
#2
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Okay, I'm looking into the EGR valve today. If anyone has any other advice, it would be much appreciated. Thank you!
06-12-2006, 02:07 PM
#3
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I switched the EGRV with a spare one I had and there was no difference. The truck stills stalls. I suppose my replacement could be faulty, also.
I read a plugged EGRV would cause this stalling and suspected the original because I had blow-by a little over a month ago. At that time, I changed the PCVV and cleaned up the TB and plenum. Today when I pulled the hard line to the EGRV from the plenum there was oil coating the insert tube. ???? I don't know....I'm taking guesses here because I can't afford to go back to the mechanic. So, if the EGRV is plugged is there a good way to clean it? Other than that, I don't know where else to start looking. Anybody???
I read a plugged EGRV would cause this stalling and suspected the original because I had blow-by a little over a month ago. At that time, I changed the PCVV and cleaned up the TB and plenum. Today when I pulled the hard line to the EGRV from the plenum there was oil coating the insert tube. ???? I don't know....I'm taking guesses here because I can't afford to go back to the mechanic. So, if the EGRV is plugged is there a good way to clean it? Other than that, I don't know where else to start looking. Anybody???
Last edited by thook; 06-12-2006 at 02:09 PM.
06-12-2006, 08:58 PM
#5
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Thank you for even just responding! 
I ran across the injector spray info earlier today, so I've been soaking it ALL day. Lots of dark carbon has been coming out. Tomorrow I will see if this makes any difference, in which case I will post it and let you know, as well.
I ran across the injector spray info earlier today, so I've been soaking it ALL day. Lots of dark carbon has been coming out. Tomorrow I will see if this makes any difference, in which case I will post it and let you know, as well.
06-13-2006, 04:19 PM
#6
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It seems as though it was the indeed the EGRV. Could have also been a little of an air leak at the intake....the tube had a couple of cracks not readily visible. Shored up on the TPS resistance settings, cleaned the EGR, cleaned the plenum out, sealed the cracks, and adjusted the idle. When I got everything back together, she still ran like pooh. But, then kicked right in after a couple of minutes. I figure the EGR came unstuck. Then, the idle was way too high....about a couple hundred RPM's. Did what I could without a hand held tach...used the dash tach. I'm stoked, though. This is the best she's run since we had the motor installed MONTHS ago.
Anyway, case closed...even though only one person replied, thanks!
Anyway, case closed...even though only one person replied, thanks!
Last edited by thook; 06-13-2006 at 04:21 PM.
06-13-2006, 11:54 PM
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Sorry you didn't have any more responses; that is somewhat unusual. I'm pretty good about checking this forum regularly and I didn't see this post until this morning....glad you got it fixed!
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06-14-2006, 08:53 PM
#8
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Thanks TNRabbit! I just figure there must be more interesting threads going on. LOL!
As it so happens, I only thought it was fixed. It was running much better yesterday. But, today, the runner is doing the same dern thing! I'm not exactly back to square one, but I might as well be.
My wife and I are doing more research on this problem, but most info we're turning up is not related specifically to the 3VZE. Maybe that doesn't matter? We only found one post on bobistheoilguy that talks about our motor... briefly.(Admittedly, I haven't thoroughly search YT, yet...duh)They said EGR problems were common. At this point, we're seriously considering bypassing it altogether. We've read a lot of people are doing it or just suggesting it. It supposedly increases performance and mileage. Would you, or anyone else, know anything about this and is this a good idea? And I already know about the emissions regulations....
I also hope we're not dealing with a bad rebuild. I say that because I found oil, again, in the TB and intake tubing. Not being a mechanic, though, I'm not really sure what I'm looking at. The last time I saw oil there my friend said it was blow-by. Checked the PCV and was indeed stuck. Put in a new one, but still oil.????? Is oil in this location normal? It doesn't seem like there's as much as before the PCV replacement, but I'm curious if this means there's internal oil leakage. We read that this can cause premature or continual EGR problems. I don't know...there's so much info we're turning up, and what is correct?
The search continues, but if anyone has any suggestions it would be soooo much appreciated. My brain is frying trying to figure all of this out!!!
As it so happens, I only thought it was fixed. It was running much better yesterday. But, today, the runner is doing the same dern thing! I'm not exactly back to square one, but I might as well be.
My wife and I are doing more research on this problem, but most info we're turning up is not related specifically to the 3VZE. Maybe that doesn't matter? We only found one post on bobistheoilguy that talks about our motor... briefly.(Admittedly, I haven't thoroughly search YT, yet...duh)They said EGR problems were common. At this point, we're seriously considering bypassing it altogether. We've read a lot of people are doing it or just suggesting it. It supposedly increases performance and mileage. Would you, or anyone else, know anything about this and is this a good idea? And I already know about the emissions regulations....
I also hope we're not dealing with a bad rebuild. I say that because I found oil, again, in the TB and intake tubing. Not being a mechanic, though, I'm not really sure what I'm looking at. The last time I saw oil there my friend said it was blow-by. Checked the PCV and was indeed stuck. Put in a new one, but still oil.????? Is oil in this location normal? It doesn't seem like there's as much as before the PCV replacement, but I'm curious if this means there's internal oil leakage. We read that this can cause premature or continual EGR problems. I don't know...there's so much info we're turning up, and what is correct?
The search continues, but if anyone has any suggestions it would be soooo much appreciated. My brain is frying trying to figure all of this out!!!
06-15-2006, 01:56 AM
#9
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Well, after doing a bunch of archive reading and paying close attention to the FSM, I've discovered I have no EGR gas temp sensor. I wondered what that open, threaded port was on the side of the EGR valve. Hmmm....could this be an issue?
Anyone, jump in anytime.....please?
Anyone, jump in anytime.....please?
06-15-2006, 02:32 AM
#10
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Thread Starter
I just read timing could have something to do with this. I did have to mess with the timing belt when I replaced the knock sensor. Couldn't get the intake manifold off without pulling the water inlet with the #2 idler pulley on it. What is not clear to me, yet, is if what I read is referring to the ignition or crank timing. I had the ignition timing set right on, so it shouldn't be the problem...should it? How can I test the crank timing to make sure I did it correctly?
Of course, I will be reading up on it.....
Of course, I will be reading up on it.....
Last edited by thook; 06-15-2006 at 03:27 AM.
06-15-2006, 03:06 AM
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Did you keep the timing belt cogs in place with the teeth on the cam pulleys when you took the idler pulley off? I've never had the timing off on a Toyota, but I had an '86 Nissan 4x4 that had the timing chain off one tooth and it wasn't appparent until @ 4500 rpms them BANG, it bucked and kicked like a wild horse!
You stated in your first post that the 3.0 didn't seem as peppy as the 22r. Wow, I have a 3.0 and it is WAY more powerful than a 22r. You should have plenty of power from it. Have you check the TPS adjustment position (I saw in your first post your replace the throttle sensor, I assume you mean TPS)? Here's a good link on adjusting it: http://www.4crawler.com/4x4/CheapTricks/TPS/index.shtml
I also read in your first post that you tried to adjust the idle stop screw but it ran worse; which screw were you adjusting? It's a recessed flat-head screw on top of the throttel body. If you adjusted anything else, it was the wrong thing. Check out this pic:
Where was the screw you adjusted located in this pic?
You stated in your first post that the 3.0 didn't seem as peppy as the 22r. Wow, I have a 3.0 and it is WAY more powerful than a 22r. You should have plenty of power from it. Have you check the TPS adjustment position (I saw in your first post your replace the throttle sensor, I assume you mean TPS)? Here's a good link on adjusting it: http://www.4crawler.com/4x4/CheapTricks/TPS/index.shtml
I also read in your first post that you tried to adjust the idle stop screw but it ran worse; which screw were you adjusting? It's a recessed flat-head screw on top of the throttel body. If you adjusted anything else, it was the wrong thing. Check out this pic:
Where was the screw you adjusted located in this pic?
Last edited by TNRabbit; 06-15-2006 at 03:33 AM.
06-15-2006, 03:38 AM
#12
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No to the first question. So, I had to reset the cam pulleys.
And, yes to the second. I've tested the position several times with on ohm meter. I had to tinker with it a bit to get the correct resistance reading on the first two terminal spec, though.
Oops! And yes, that's the one I adjusted for the idle specifically. It's pointed out rather plainly in the FSM. I even marked the original position counting how many turns I deviated from that. I like to take safe measures...hehe!
I did the throttle stop screw, though, because there was clearance between it and the throttle stop wherein the manual said there should be none. That affects the amount the butterfly in the TB is open at dead idle...does it not? This was at the time I was adjusting the throttle position sensor making sure everything was correct.
And, yes to the second. I've tested the position several times with on ohm meter. I had to tinker with it a bit to get the correct resistance reading on the first two terminal spec, though.
Oops! And yes, that's the one I adjusted for the idle specifically. It's pointed out rather plainly in the FSM. I even marked the original position counting how many turns I deviated from that. I like to take safe measures...hehe!
I did the throttle stop screw, though, because there was clearance between it and the throttle stop wherein the manual said there should be none. That affects the amount the butterfly in the TB is open at dead idle...does it not? This was at the time I was adjusting the throttle position sensor making sure everything was correct.
Last edited by thook; 06-15-2006 at 07:01 AM.
06-15-2006, 09:35 AM
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I thought I remember the throttle stop screw being a feeler gauge thickness away from the stop...(.10?)? I was thinking the TB butterfly was NOT supposed to be open at idle, and that is what the idle air adjustment screw was for...
However, that's from memory and you have the manual!
However, that's from memory and you have the manual!
06-15-2006, 12:56 PM
#14
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K, my first suggestion is to replace the intake tube. If you found some cracks then I'd say its shot. It may be hard to permanently seal them. You could find a good one from the wrecker or do the ISR mod (search there is a lot of info).
Second, if you don't have to worry about inspections where you are and you are having problems with the EGR then I'd consider just removing it and placing the resister in place of the sensor (10ohm I think but you'll have to search on this as well). Keep the parts in case you ever need them in the future.
What are the codes it is throwing if any?
Second, if you don't have to worry about inspections where you are and you are having problems with the EGR then I'd consider just removing it and placing the resister in place of the sensor (10ohm I think but you'll have to search on this as well). Keep the parts in case you ever need them in the future.
What are the codes it is throwing if any?
06-15-2006, 10:41 PM
#15
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Hey Supra!!!! Thanks so much for responding.
Yeah, I know the tube is shot. Eventually, when I have the time and money (which I know isn't much, so that's not really the issue) I'll be doing the ISR mod. For now, so we can operate the truck, I've lined the inside of the intake tube where it connects to the TB with the good duck tape (as a dam), filled in the cracks with black gasket maker, then doubled the tape over the edge, and wrapped the whole end with another layer of tape. Then I hooked it up and tightened it down with a good hose clamp. It seems to be sealed well for now. I realize that's not permanent, though.
This is off topic, but since you mention it, does this mod really make that much of a difference in performance? It just doesn't look like it will. But, I don't know....I just know what I've read, which is that it does. I've already drilled a multitude of holes in the air filter box.....sounds rather MEAN!!!! LOL! And, of course, I'll eventually do the exhaust mod....in which case money IS the issue.
Anyway, whatever the problem is with the EGR system we've already decided bypassing will be the most affordable option. The parts are way too much right now. And it even seems the best from things we've read. Inspections are a non-issure. They were done away with in my state. But, what is this resistor? We've read where someone blocked off the system with plates and installed some performance chip. Is that what you are talking about? It would help me in a search if I knew what to call it besides a resistor. Someone at the dealer feared it would cause a lean condition if we did the bypass. Is this true? We have read otherwise.
I'm not sure what the code was. You see....it was throwing one for the KS and then we replaced it. Then the CEL came back. But, I didn't have the money to have another diagnostic run. All we knew was that the runner ran poorly dying at an idle, when you put in gear and tried to go, and when you came to stop. We started reading and determined it was the EGR system, cleaned the valve and such, it ran better, and I cleared the computer and it hasn't come back, yet. But, then, it's not really running long enough for the freak'n CEL to come back on. Hehe!
Yeah, I know the tube is shot. Eventually, when I have the time and money (which I know isn't much, so that's not really the issue) I'll be doing the ISR mod. For now, so we can operate the truck, I've lined the inside of the intake tube where it connects to the TB with the good duck tape (as a dam), filled in the cracks with black gasket maker, then doubled the tape over the edge, and wrapped the whole end with another layer of tape. Then I hooked it up and tightened it down with a good hose clamp. It seems to be sealed well for now. I realize that's not permanent, though.
This is off topic, but since you mention it, does this mod really make that much of a difference in performance? It just doesn't look like it will. But, I don't know....I just know what I've read, which is that it does. I've already drilled a multitude of holes in the air filter box.....sounds rather MEAN!!!! LOL! And, of course, I'll eventually do the exhaust mod....in which case money IS the issue.
Anyway, whatever the problem is with the EGR system we've already decided bypassing will be the most affordable option. The parts are way too much right now. And it even seems the best from things we've read. Inspections are a non-issure. They were done away with in my state. But, what is this resistor? We've read where someone blocked off the system with plates and installed some performance chip. Is that what you are talking about? It would help me in a search if I knew what to call it besides a resistor. Someone at the dealer feared it would cause a lean condition if we did the bypass. Is this true? We have read otherwise.
I'm not sure what the code was. You see....it was throwing one for the KS and then we replaced it. Then the CEL came back. But, I didn't have the money to have another diagnostic run. All we knew was that the runner ran poorly dying at an idle, when you put in gear and tried to go, and when you came to stop. We started reading and determined it was the EGR system, cleaned the valve and such, it ran better, and I cleared the computer and it hasn't come back, yet. But, then, it's not really running long enough for the freak'n CEL to come back on. Hehe!
Last edited by thook; 06-15-2006 at 10:44 PM.
06-16-2006, 02:47 AM
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You can pull the codes yourself; go to this link: http://www.off-road.com/toyota/tech/codes/index.html
Here's another good link with factory service manuals posted for a 1993 V6 (mostly same): http://personal.utulsa.edu/~nathan-b...fsm/index.html
AND, here's another good link for all kinds of info on your truck: http://www.4crawler.com/4x4/CheapTricks/index.shtml
Here's another good link with factory service manuals posted for a 1993 V6 (mostly same): http://personal.utulsa.edu/~nathan-b...fsm/index.html
AND, here's another good link for all kinds of info on your truck: http://www.4crawler.com/4x4/CheapTricks/index.shtml
06-16-2006, 08:26 AM
#17
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Thanks TNRabbit. I've found good info on 4crawler's site before. That's how I got the rear window working again in my '86 runner. But, then I forgot about it, so I am glad you reminded me of it. I also know of the second link (it's the FSM I've been referring to), but the first one I had know idea. I didn't know you pull the codes on the 2nd gen's like that....thought you had to have the machine and the special hook up. D@#N!!! That would've saved me some money! But, from now on it will.
06-16-2006, 01:09 PM
#18
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Originally Posted by TNRabbit
You can pull the codes yourself; go to this link: http://www.off-road.com/toyota/tech/codes/index.html
Here's another good link with factory service manuals posted for a 1993 V6 (mostly same): http://personal.utulsa.edu/~nathan-b...fsm/index.html
AND, here's another good link for all kinds of info on your truck: http://www.4crawler.com/4x4/CheapTricks/index.shtml
Here's another good link with factory service manuals posted for a 1993 V6 (mostly same): http://personal.utulsa.edu/~nathan-b...fsm/index.html
AND, here's another good link for all kinds of info on your truck: http://www.4crawler.com/4x4/CheapTricks/index.shtml
06-17-2006, 08:23 AM
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Try the fuel filter...mine has been having the same problem and I am changing my fuel filter today! Mine just hasnt been dying.....but it has been wanting to...!!
