ozzfan1JC

When I start my SAS with a Dana 44... What kinds of modification are required? I searched, but couldn't find many answers. Do the spring perches have to be moved any? Also, I have seen points of the steering that have to be modified. What are they talking about when it says (modify to accept high-steer) or sumthin like that? I am just looking to see what kinds of mods to do to my newly found D44... Thanx abunch...

fourwd1

How much you have to do to the D44 depends on what vehicle it's from. You will probably have to redo the perchs, you may even have to narrow the axle. Why not just use a Toy axle, the D44 isn't any stronger.

Either way you'll need a high-steer kit. You just replace the stock arms on the axle with the new ones, then install the rest.

ozzfan1JC

I don't want to use the toy axle and have to deal with a 5 inch difference in width.... also I think the diff is on the wrong side for me. I have a 96 4Runner...

its2slo

it depends on what d44 you choose.

jruz

Umm...do a search for the user "Breezey" as he recently did the SAS on his 1996 4Runner.

Jim

upndair

The Dana 44 may not be any stronger than the TOY rear, but the front eliminates the problems of the birfields.

You don't need to hysteer it as long as your steeting is setup for crossovr - which is should be. The hysteer is nice, but not required.

You will need to narrow and move the perches - most likely. That'll depend on what you buy and what your current spring width would be after the SAS. You can outboard your spring perhces to match the Dana 44, but then you're running full width with is typically 65 - 67" WMS - WMS. A stock Toy solid axle is only 59"

44Runner

But you say your "newly found" 44. So what did it come out of if you already have it???

If it came out of a Waggy, it will need to be sprung over and you will need a set of flat top knuckles if you want to run high steer, which you do.

<soapbox>

Not to jump on you or anything, but this information is literally ALL OVER the internet. If you don't know this simple stuff and you have already started in on your SAS you might have bigger fish to fry.

I mean your posts look like you don't have a clue on, well, anything. I mean if you have the axle and you can't look at it and tell what needs to be done I hope you'll excuse me if I question your ability to take on a project of this magnitude.

I seriously think you might need to sit down and figure out what every step of this project will require and firgure out wether or not this is something that you know about and can do safely.

Solid axle swaps are not to be attempted by Joe Schmoe. If that junk breaks on the road, you could kill yourself. Not to mention you can't just go back once you've started. I see a lot of people posting simple questions about this stuff and that scares me. If you don't have the basics, how can you expect to do this right?

</soapbox>

With that said, feel free to PM me with any questions you have. Despite what it may look like my interest is not in chastizing you but in helping you to get this 100% right...

upndair

I think the right idea is coming across here. Doing an SAS at home requires significant fabrication skills and should only be taken on by those who have the skills OR by those who have a good friend with the skills.

Personally, I get tired of people (mostly on the Pirate4x4 board) telling everyone to look it up, use the search function etc. While you certainly can and should do that as part of your research, feel free to post questions that you didn't find answers to. I'm no SAS guru nor Dana guru but since I recently went through a lot of the same questions you had, I have no problems answering question either - silly or not

I read through most of this last night but now it's my turn for the silly questions.
1. How far into this process are you? What steps have you taken that you're already committed to - such as; did you already buy the Dana 44?
2. What is your level of knowledge regarding suspension design? It never goes exactly as expected...
3. WHY are you doing the SAS?

Napoleon047

a toy axle with longfields is stronger than a stock D44 and longfeilds are cheaper than CTM's

a stock toy solid front axle is only 56" thats why people use spacers or wide axle kits on their SAS

upndair

The first part is debatable.

The second is correct. I forget that I had spacers :o)

44Runner

Why do people say this? I mean seriously, what the hell is the point?

So you are telling me that if you take two front axles that have roughly the same strength stock, and you add upgraded parts to one of them, that axle then becomes stronger? NO ˟˟˟˟˟???

Here the the cold hard facts. A 44 with alloy shafts and your choice of beefy u-joint is MUCH STRONGER than a toy front with all the available upgrades on the market. Not to mention toy housings are easier to bend. They also have a nasty habit of getting trashed from the inside whether its a shattered bell that takes out the inner knuckle or a piece of R&P shoved through the front of the housing.

I have nothing against them, those are just facts. Take it or leave it. I plan to use a toy front in my next project...

joez

Exacly, people compare a beefed toy axle against a stock junkyard find dana 44. Put alloy shafts in both, longfields in the toy axle, and longs treated 760X u-joints and that 44 will be stronger.

I am going to have to agree completely with 44Runner here, If i remember there are 3 recent SAS's in this forum section alone. Two with 44's, and one with a Toy axle.

Spend a little time reading those three, and search pirate for a while. You will find more information than you will need.

Edit, as i look on the first page of this forum, i see 2 SAS that have been completed and documented. Not to pick on you or anything, but how much did you search?

ozzfan1JC

OK....first things first... I haven't started the SAS (as I said in the first post) yet. I do know some about the swap, but all I want is a good number of opinions. I know that alot of the info is on the site already, but I want opinions from people, not just facts and information. About the "newly found" D44, a friend of mine told me he has an axle, but I haven't been able to go get it yet. That's why I was just curious how much work is going to have to be done on it. Also, I am not doing the SAS by myself. I have a friend who is going to do it with me, that knows plenty about this. I just can never catch him at home right now, because he works out of town alot, and also just had a baby boy. So his time is pretty occupied, and I don't want to bother him too much right now. It's just the "anticipation of articulation" is killin me!!! I know people just hate when I post a question about this, but I am really nervous about the road ahead. I don't know everything about this swap, but I do know some. The things I don't know are like "high-steer", and "crossover steering." Stuff like that, I have no clue of it. I wouldn't be so worried about possibly missing one little detail, but this is my everyday ride for now... I just wanted everyone's opinion that I could get to help me make my decision on whether to do it yet or not. I may even not worry about it, and start work on my 1967 Ford Fairlane 2-Door Hardtop. It may be a better way to go...... Who knows though? I guess people's opinions will help decide that. Thanx for the help everyone...

upndair

You're asking for help in the right place. In my opinion, the only dumb question was the one that you didn't ask.

jruz

I still think people were curious as to which D44 you are going to get from this friend...as they are not all created equal.

(yup, there are different ones, as lame as that sounds)

Jim

lcopelan22

"Hy Steer" and "Cross over Steering" are almost one in the same. You can get standard Crossover steering which leaves the tie rod under the leaf springs, or you can get Hy Crossover Steering that moves the tierod up over the springs. I know your gonna run a dana 44 but just for a general idea you can check out some X-over pics on a yota axle at Allprooffroad.com. This should give you an idea of how it works. Hope this helps.

WATRD

...and in addition to those, here's a photo of cross-over, hi-steer on a Waggy D44 axle that is almost clear enough to see everything up to the Pitman arm.

Edit: It would help if I inserted the damn image

ozzfan1JC

Let me just tell you my goal.....and see what ya'll think..... I have two friends whom I ride with. My brother has a 97 Taco, 3 inch Revtek spacer lift, 3 inch body lift, and 32x11.50 SSR Swampers. My other friend has a 95 Jeep Grand Cherokee, 4 inch Rubicon Express lift (dang that thing will flex), and a rear locker. We ride as a little group, and it seems I always get left behind on the trail. I want the SAS because I love flex. I loved the 4-link rear when I first got it, because I just think its neat to watch it going through a rut, and keepin the tires on the ground. However, this IFS front-end just isn't enough for me. Maybe if I had a big IFS lift, it would be better, but I don't wanna spend 2 grand on a lift, and not be satisfied. I'm sure you all know where I'm coming from. I have never done a SAS, but to be honest, I do all the work to my 4Runner. I also installed both lifts on my brother's Taco(along with help from him). The SAS looks complicated, but I honestly think I can do it. Like I said, a friend of mine has done a couple of swaps (a 90-sumthin Z71 sittin now on Dana 60's front and rear). He also has a jeep he has built.....well it used to be a jeep...lol. He said he will help me do it, but I guess I am just nervous about such a venture. I know I have asked repeat questions, but ya'll gotta bare with me..... I'm about to take that big leap....this is like marriage or sumthin.....(except life gets better with SAS) (I heard its sumtimes the other way around with marriage... lol). Thanx for all you guys help. It means alot.

P.S. WATRD, I want my 4Runner sumthin like yours... maybe on 35's.......one day.... one day.....

upndair

I think you just offended WATRD :o)

Taco - 4Runner - Taco??

WATRD

I had never done a swap before either, but between ChrisCo and I and a lot of research, we muddled it out and I am QUITE happy with the end result.

Gibby, the word it "flattered", not "offended" ehehehheheeh