Off-Road Audio, an end to the breaking CD receivers

John101477 · 06-17-2009, 09:43 AM

So after my second CD receiver stopped ejecting CD's in 3 months, I started thinking that there is a better way to have tunes on the trail than a CD receiver that gets filled with dust and we all know that dust and moving parts is a bad combo. Now I had never owned an iPod but was familiar with the audio quality and what was available. I went down to best buy and found a number of receivers that are iPod ready. Most of these were CD receivers as well but being as how my area is very dusty in the dry months I didn't want anything with moving parts. I kinda browsed through the open box area and found the Alpine iDA-x200. someone had brought it back because they thought it had CD capabilities as well. Being open box I got it for a decent deal and bought my first iPod (nano) as well. No moving parts to get clogged by dust, no skipping on rough terrain, and I can take it out once a year and spray that pressurized air in it to clean it once a year. I think I bought $50 bucks worth of songs that I didn't have and added a bunch of my CD's to it already.

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scuba · 06-17-2009, 09:59 AM

Another thread thats slightly blog status.

Anyway;

Cd's are old news IMO, especially in the OR world, I basically bought my ipod because even while crawling the crap still skips.
besides, who wants to mess around with a buttload of cds anyway...

yotarover · 06-17-2009, 10:03 AM

you should have looked for one that has a SD slot or usb, my jvc only takes sd,usb, or mp3 connections and trust me it takes shock and awe like it's nothing no moving parts

desertcamper67 · 06-17-2009, 10:20 AM

I've got a question about these MP3 playing head units. My only digital music carrying device is my phone. It has a 1.5mm? headphone jack on the side. Can I hook a wire from this jack to the MP3 jack on the back of my Pioneer deck? What kind of wire comes out of those Nanos and what does that socket look like on the deck.
My daughter bought a cheap Kragen stereo and it had USB port, SD card slot and plays CDs/am-fm. It may be a cheapie but its very fuctional.

lofreqjeff · 06-17-2009, 10:23 AM

Because I run with no top or doors, keeping the radio free from the elements and dust was always a concern for me. I have the radio one of these marine radio enclosures:

Works great!

scuba · 06-17-2009, 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by desertcamper67

I've got a question about these MP3 playing head units. My only digital music carrying device is my phone. It has a 1.5mm? headphone jack on the side. Can I hook a wire from this jack to the MP3 jack on the back of my Pioneer deck? What kind of wire comes out of those Nanos and what does that socket look like on the deck.
My daughter bought a cheap Kragen stereo and it had USB port, SD card slot and plays CDs/am-fm. It may be a cheapie but its very fuctional.

If it has a headphone jack just find a used cheap HU with the AUX input.
Simple.
Double sided head phone cord from phone to AUX port on HU and your done.

Like this..

Good luck bro!!

desertcamper67 · 06-17-2009, 11:15 AM

Thanks Scuba. I had a feeling it could be done. I think I have an Aux port on the back of mine. Just need to get the double male wire now.

John101477 · 06-18-2009, 09:56 AM

Mine is actually done through a usb as well. A 1.5 jack will work though.

desertcamper67 · 06-18-2009, 11:02 AM

Is the music controlled by my phone then or the receiver?

scuba · 06-18-2009, 11:20 AM

Well, more your phone.
You cant really hit FF or RW on the HU and get it to do anything, So you have to do that from the phone or mp3 player..

**aviator** · 06-18-2009, 11:44 AM

Only problem with MP3s, from an audiophile outlook, is that they compress the data stream and you loose some detail and colour from the track. But I'm just nitpicking here...

John101477 · 06-18-2009, 12:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lofreqjeff

Because I run with no top or doors, keeping the radio free from the elements and dust was always a concern for me. I have the radio one of these marine radio enclosures:

Works great!

the only problem i have with these external units is i use my wheeler as my DD as well so if i have the top down i don't want lucky larry to be able to just yank it out and have a new stereo for his beat up 85 honda. i'd rather the theif atleast have to use tools lol.

John101477 · 06-18-2009, 12:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aviator

Only problem with MP3s, from an audiophile outlook, is that they compress the data stream and you loose some detail and colour from the track. But I'm just nitpicking here...

nit pick away. i was gonna touch on that same point. where an iPod is slightly less perfect than a CD it is not to bad in comparison to a cell phone extremely compressed MP3. I am not a big apple fan but they got it right with the iPod. one thing i like with my Alpine is that i can do a searc h straight from the receiver since it was purposely made for the iPod. I also like that i can unplug my iPod during a song i like ghet out of my truck and plug in my ear buds and start right from where i left off.

scuba sorry for the Blog lol.

desertcamper67 · 06-18-2009, 08:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aviator

Only problem with MP3s, from an audiophile outlook, is that they compress the data stream and you loose some detail and colour from the track. But I'm just nitpicking here...

[quote=John101477;51164764]nit pick away. i was gonna touch on that same point. where an iPod is slightly less perfect than a CD it is not to bad in comparison to a cell phone extremely compressed MP3. I am not a big apple fan but they got it right with the iPod. one thing i like with my Alpine is that i can do a searc h straight from the receiver since it was purposely made for the iPod. I also like that i can unplug my iPod during a song i like ghet out of my truck and plug in my ear buds and start right from where i left off.

I've heard of what you nitpickers are talking about but I would trade music quality for reliablilty. If its something that needs to be heard precisely I'll have to burn it to CD (or have my kids do it since I haven't done it before.)

mastacox · 06-18-2009, 09:11 PM

All you need to satisfy the nit-pickers

is a lossless compression format (For IPods, Apple Lossless I think...) Best of both worlds.

I use WMA Lossless with my Zune, the files end up around 2-3 times as large as a 160 kbps MP3, but they work great! ...as long as you've got the space for them.

**aviator** · 06-18-2009, 09:44 PM

The Kenwood I'm looking at has a USB port so I'll be able to load tracks onto a lipstick drive thingy [memorystick?] as a direct cd data transfer using Nero... I can get 8Gigs for $20 and I've seen huge ones so no worries about not enough space for tunes. One of those lossless compression things might be useful though.

John101477 · 06-18-2009, 09:57 PM

lossless compression is a good setup if you have a 120 gig iPod. i only bought an 8 sooo. as for the sound difference it is not to bad and even with the extended version of hotel california it has the right beat and the guitar work sounds fairly clear. granted even the CD's we buy from wally and best buy are not perfect but it is hard to find perfect CD's anymore. SACD's are just to expensive... what a difference though

kilgoja · 06-19-2009, 10:11 AM

yeah i have an ipod classic...i've hooked it up to my aux input in my truck....have to turn the volume up to like 40 where as a cd the volume can be at like 20 or so.....the ipod tunes were copied to my computer straight from my cds but it just doesn't sound anywhere as good as a cd to me...just sounds kinda weak like an old jambox from back in the day...lol...or a shop radio.....i guess out on the trail it would do the job though

seanmearse · 06-24-2009, 11:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by desertcamper67

My daughter bought a cheap Kragen stereo and it had USB port, SD card slot and plays CDs/am-fm. It may be a cheapie but its very fuctional.

I have the same one you are talking about, with the USB/1.5mm jack/SD card slot? Its actually on the floor in my living room waiting to go back in the truck. I liked it better than the Sony crap i have in it now. I figured, sony, good stuff right? nope. Might even buy a JVC again, never ever had an issue with JVC.

NYChopshop · 06-27-2009, 08:57 PM

Pardon my intrusion on the subject, but I'm both an audiophile and a professional sound engineer, and I feel I could bring a tiny bit of information to the table.

First, there is no such thing as lossless compression, it's a contradiction in terms. Noncompressed audio, or CD format (WAV files), is still not perfect as an audiophile format, but that's neither here nor there for car audio purposes. Most of what is referred to as 'lossless' is just a complex proprietary algorithm applied to the data, but I would just stick to full size WAV files if you are a stickler for quality. For most listeners, a higher quality mp3 is sonically good enough to enjoy in a moving vehicle. There is so much coloring the sound and so much outside noise competing with what you're listening to in most cases that full CD quality isn't necessary. Ipod's cant carry much, and they're apple made which makes me physically ill, so here's what I like to do: I have a kenwood excelon head unit with a hardwired USB cable. I have a 320 GB USB hard drive loaded with mostly MP3's at a higher bit rate, but some non-compressed WAV files. My head unit plays them and scrolls through the folders and files via my head unit (and it's remote control) buttons. Just a thought.

John101477 · 06-27-2009, 09:23 PM

thats a heck of a deal there nychop. I have worked many years with kenwood among other makers, but ur the first i heard of that uses it in this fashion. i may have to see what my hard drive does with my unit, might be interesting. i will call alpine this week and see if this unit would be compatible, although the iPod is much more handy than my hard drive.
thanks for the share.

**aviator** · 06-27-2009, 09:35 PM

Exactly my plan chopper... once I get my excelon... just use USB flash drives...

Hayes · 06-27-2009, 09:51 PM

You can always run the iPOD through a 3.5mm-RCA cable to an amp, then out to speakers. Control everything through the iPOD and get good sound. Take the iPOD when you leave so that prying eyes can't get to it.

seanmearse · 06-27-2009, 10:57 PM

Here is another thought from me. if i am cruising a dirt road or exploring on some randomn trail, i leave the tunes on. But for the most part the stereo is off and the cb on. Plus, i dont look at the tach when i am getin' it done, i prefer to hear what my engine is doing, what my spotter (if i use one) is saying, what gets yelled at me- i.e.- diff hung up, oil spraying everywhere. Try this, next time you are out wheeling, shut off your deck and listen to your truck, its rather peaceful and calming.

NYChopshop · 06-27-2009, 11:21 PM

one thing I should point out, the usb HARD DRIVES like the one I use is nothing more than a laptop hard drive, meaning it has moving parts. You can seriously screw up a hard drive if you abuse it too badly, but if you get one that has a warranty, go for it! My only suggestion would be to use a smaller capacity (I know, I know...) solid state memory device like a USB flash drive or four since they're so cheap these days. Then you have as close to bulletproof music as you can get anywhere.

Oh, and my excelon deck (see build thread in signature for pics) has a built in USB cable not just a slot, so all I have to do is wrap my hard drive in a T-shirt for padding and drop it in my glove box where I ran my USB cable to for some extra shock protection not to mention key-ed locking out of sight theft prevention. Just a thought.

06-17-2009, 09:59 AM	#2 (permalink)
scuba Registered User Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: WHEELIN BIG BEAR Posts: 6,968	Another thread thats slightly blog status. Anyway; Cd's are old news IMO, especially in the OR world, I basically bought my ipod because even while crawling the crap still skips. besides, who wants to mess around with a buttload of cds anyway... __________________ Screw you guys I'm goin to TTORA Mods, please be mature and leave my sig alone, thanks. No, I will not be your friend.

06-17-2009, 10:23 AM	#5 (permalink)
lofreqjeff Registered User Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Chandler AZ Posts: 637	Because I run with no top or doors, keeping the radio free from the elements and dust was always a concern for me. I have the radio one of these marine radio enclosures: Works great! __________________ Jeff -'89 4Runner - Manual Trans - 3.Slo - 31x10.50-15 Goodyear MTR's - Downey Bikini Top - 4X Innovations Tube doors - Sonoran Steel IFS Truss - Bud Built Crossmemeber/Skids - 1.5" sdori BJ spacers, 2" Downey rear leafs, 1" wheel spacers on all 4, OME Shocks - Detroit Soft locker - ZUK mod - Custom sliders and rear bumper w/Spare carrier - Asian Manual Hubs - COMING SOON: - Custom dash with passenger side grab handle & clinometer - plus plenty more!

06-18-2009, 09:56 AM	#8 (permalink)
John101477 Registered User Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Vina, Ca. Posts: 484	Mine is actually done through a usb as well. A 1.5 jack will work though. __________________ Stand up for your rights www.northerncalimages.com 86 4Runner limited

06-18-2009, 11:20 AM	#10 (permalink)
scuba Registered User Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: WHEELIN BIG BEAR Posts: 6,968	Well, more your phone. You cant really hit FF or RW on the HU and get it to do anything, So you have to do that from the phone or mp3 player.. __________________ Screw you guys I'm goin to TTORA Mods, please be mature and leave my sig alone, thanks. No, I will not be your friend.

06-18-2009, 11:44 AM	#11 (permalink)
aviator Super Moderator Staff Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: COTKU,Ontario,Canada Posts: 7,469	Only problem with MP3s, from an audiophile outlook, is that they compress the data stream and you loose some detail and colour from the track. But I'm just nitpicking here... __________________ Silver 1994 Hilux Xtra cab 4x4 3.0 K&N cone filter, ported MAF, advanced timing, oversize exhaust, free flow cat, "rumble" muffler custom covered SR5 seats, map lights, factory AC tv4184 style black interior conversion started mods to come... header, custom centre console, stereo upgrade tinted windows Founding member 1972TLC fan club - Get well soon Mary Toyota Hilux... Get in or Get out of the way.

06-17-2009, 10:03 AM	#3 (permalink)
yotarover Registered User Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Forest City Nc Posts: 48	you should have looked for one that has a SD slot or usb, my jvc only takes sd,usb, or mp3 connections and trust me it takes shock and awe like it's nothing no moving parts

06-18-2009, 09:11 PM	#15 (permalink)
mastacox Contributing Member Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Los Alamos, NM Posts: 2,650	All you need to satisfy the nit-pickers is a lossless compression format (For IPods, Apple Lossless I think...) Best of both worlds. I use WMA Lossless with my Zune, the files end up around 2-3 times as large as a 160 kbps MP3, but they work great! ...as long as you've got the space for them. __________________ Brian 1998 4Runner SR5

06-18-2009, 09:44 PM	#16 (permalink)
aviator Super Moderator Staff Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: COTKU,Ontario,Canada Posts: 7,469	The Kenwood I'm looking at has a USB port so I'll be able to load tracks onto a lipstick drive thingy [memorystick?] as a direct cd data transfer using Nero... I can get 8Gigs for $20 and I've seen huge ones so no worries about not enough space for tunes. One of those lossless compression things might be useful though. __________________ Silver 1994 Hilux Xtra cab 4x4 3.0 K&N cone filter, ported MAF, advanced timing, oversize exhaust, free flow cat, "rumble" muffler custom covered SR5 seats, map lights, factory AC tv4184 style black interior conversion started mods to come... header, custom centre console, stereo upgrade tinted windows Founding member 1972TLC fan club - Get well soon Mary Toyota Hilux... Get in or Get out of the way. Last edited by aviator; 06-18-2009 at 09:45 PM.

06-18-2009, 09:57 PM	#17 (permalink)
John101477 Registered User Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Vina, Ca. Posts: 484	lossless compression is a good setup if you have a 120 gig iPod. i only bought an 8 sooo. as for the sound difference it is not to bad and even with the extended version of hotel california it has the right beat and the guitar work sounds fairly clear. granted even the CD's we buy from wally and best buy are not perfect but it is hard to find perfect CD's anymore. SACD's are just to expensive... what a difference though __________________ Stand up for your rights www.northerncalimages.com 86 4Runner limited

06-19-2009, 10:11 AM	#18 (permalink)
kilgoja Registered User Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Alabama Posts: 22	yeah i have an ipod classic...i've hooked it up to my aux input in my truck....have to turn the volume up to like 40 where as a cd the volume can be at like 20 or so.....the ipod tunes were copied to my computer straight from my cds but it just doesn't sound anywhere as good as a cd to me...just sounds kinda weak like an old jambox from back in the day...lol...or a shop radio.....i guess out on the trail it would do the job though __________________ 2009 toyota tacoma 4x4 2.7L 4cyl (silver) (in the past) 1988 toyota 4x4 2.2L RE 4cyl (silver)

06-27-2009, 08:57 PM	#20 (permalink)
NYChopshop Registered User Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Back in New York City! Posts: 428	Pardon my intrusion on the subject, but I'm both an audiophile and a professional sound engineer, and I feel I could bring a tiny bit of information to the table. First, there is no such thing as lossless compression, it's a contradiction in terms. Noncompressed audio, or CD format (WAV files), is still not perfect as an audiophile format, but that's neither here nor there for car audio purposes. Most of what is referred to as 'lossless' is just a complex proprietary algorithm applied to the data, but I would just stick to full size WAV files if you are a stickler for quality. For most listeners, a higher quality mp3 is sonically good enough to enjoy in a moving vehicle. There is so much coloring the sound and so much outside noise competing with what you're listening to in most cases that full CD quality isn't necessary. Ipod's cant carry much, and they're apple made which makes me physically ill, so here's what I like to do: I have a kenwood excelon head unit with a hardwired USB cable. I have a 320 GB USB hard drive loaded with mostly MP3's at a higher bit rate, but some non-compressed WAV files. My head unit plays them and scrolls through the folders and files via my head unit (and it's remote control) buttons. Just a thought. __________________ 1994 4runner 5speed 3.slow 2" ball joint spacers, 2" OME HD lift springs, rancho shocks, magnaflow exhaust, 31x10.5r15 Procomp Xterrains, S&B cold air intake, Marlin Crawler 2100lb super heavy duty clutch kit w/ grade 8.8 pressure plate bolts My build thread This guy is the biggest idiot in the world!

06-27-2009, 09:23 PM	#21 (permalink)
John101477 Registered User Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Vina, Ca. Posts: 484	thats a heck of a deal there nychop. I have worked many years with kenwood among other makers, but ur the first i heard of that uses it in this fashion. i may have to see what my hard drive does with my unit, might be interesting. i will call alpine this week and see if this unit would be compatible, although the iPod is much more handy than my hard drive. thanks for the share. __________________ Stand up for your rights www.northerncalimages.com 86 4Runner limited

06-27-2009, 09:35 PM	#22 (permalink)
aviator Super Moderator Staff Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: COTKU,Ontario,Canada Posts: 7,469	Exactly my plan chopper... once I get my excelon... just use USB flash drives... __________________ Silver 1994 Hilux Xtra cab 4x4 3.0 K&N cone filter, ported MAF, advanced timing, oversize exhaust, free flow cat, "rumble" muffler custom covered SR5 seats, map lights, factory AC tv4184 style black interior conversion started mods to come... header, custom centre console, stereo upgrade tinted windows Founding member 1972TLC fan club - Get well soon Mary Toyota Hilux... Get in or Get out of the way. Last edited by aviator; 06-28-2009 at 01:23 PM.

06-27-2009, 09:51 PM	#23 (permalink)
Hayes Registered User Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Aurora, CO Posts: 1,884	You can always run the iPOD through a 3.5mm-RCA cable to an amp, then out to speakers. Control everything through the iPOD and get good sound. Take the iPOD when you leave so that prying eyes can't get to it. __________________ Obama is an acronym. OBAMA = One Big Ass Mistake, America

06-27-2009, 10:57 PM	#24 (permalink)
seanmearse Registered User Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Ridgecrest, Ca Posts: 1,121	Here is another thought from me. if i am cruising a dirt road or exploring on some randomn trail, i leave the tunes on. But for the most part the stereo is off and the cb on. Plus, i dont look at the tach when i am getin' it done, i prefer to hear what my engine is doing, what my spotter (if i use one) is saying, what gets yelled at me- i.e.- diff hung up, oil spraying everywhere. Try this, next time you are out wheeling, shut off your deck and listen to your truck, its rather peaceful and calming. __________________ The Internet, where men are men, women are men, and children are FBI agents. Proud sponsor of the re-poster thread. http://www.yotatech.com/f5/you-re-poster-193103/ 84 SR5 pickup, Mostly stock 22R, K&N air filter, Mobil 1 oil filter, Cherry Bomb, Mobil 1 engine, Royal Purple diff and trans fluid, 15X8 street locks, 3 inch procomp front springs, waiting to buy rears, rancho RS9000XL's up front. 2003 Vstar 650, straight pipe, loud and fast baby!

06-27-2009, 11:21 PM	#25 (permalink)
NYChopshop Registered User Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Back in New York City! Posts: 428	one thing I should point out, the usb HARD DRIVES like the one I use is nothing more than a laptop hard drive, meaning it has moving parts. You can seriously screw up a hard drive if you abuse it too badly, but if you get one that has a warranty, go for it! My only suggestion would be to use a smaller capacity (I know, I know...) solid state memory device like a USB flash drive or four since they're so cheap these days. Then you have as close to bulletproof music as you can get anywhere. Oh, and my excelon deck (see build thread in signature for pics) has a built in USB cable not just a slot, so all I have to do is wrap my hard drive in a T-shirt for padding and drop it in my glove box where I ran my USB cable to for some extra shock protection not to mention key-ed locking out of sight theft prevention. Just a thought. __________________ 1994 4runner 5speed 3.slow 2" ball joint spacers, 2" OME HD lift springs, rancho shocks, magnaflow exhaust, 31x10.5r15 Procomp Xterrains, S&B cold air intake, Marlin Crawler 2100lb super heavy duty clutch kit w/ grade 8.8 pressure plate bolts My build thread This guy is the biggest idiot in the world! Last edited by NYChopshop; 06-27-2009 at 11:24 PM.

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