Locker FAQ - Page 4

William · 10-24-2007, 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by melkor

so can you install aussies front and rear on a dd with no ill effects? from the explanation of the aussies, it makes it sound like they would be fine.

There will be a negative change in handling, but it's something that can be lived with.

I had a '94 Mazda Navajo 4wd (same as a same year 2 door Explorer) as a daily driver for many years, first with a rear Lock Right locker, then with front and rear No Slip lockers (the No Slip is smoother and quieter than the Aussie).

I had the Lock Right for about 37,000 miles until it wore out, and then had the rear No Slip for about 80,000 miles until I totalled the vehicle. In the meantime, I took 2 trips from Florida to Washington State and back, 4 to Kentucky and back while towing my motorcycle on a trailer, and a few other long trips.

I managed just fine.

By the way, in the quote that you quoted, it's not locking that makes the tires squeal. It's the fact that, while the vehicle is turning right or left, only the inside tire is accelerating or decelerating the vehicle.

Since only the inside tire is moving the vehicle, and since this tire has less weight because the vehicle leans toward the outside of the turn, the tire squeals easily.

When this happens, the inside tire is rotating the same speed as the ring gear, while the outside tire is rotating faster than the ring gear.

This is also why the handling changes when you install a rear locker. When the vehicle accelerates, the inside rear tire tries to push the vehicle in a straight line. When the vehicle decelerates due to the throttle being released, the inside rear tire tries to make the vehicle pull in the direction the vehicle is turning.

The key is, when you are turning, keep steady throttle and don't change speed. Or if you have a manual transmission, push in the clutch.

If you have an automatic transmission, the torque converter will absorb some of the shock load created by a locker, and the action of a locker won't be as jerky.

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jason191918 · 11-28-2007, 09:23 PM

http://www.fullsizebronco.com/forum/...ad.php?t=22630

Here is a good resource.

William · 11-29-2007, 02:46 AM

His explaination of how a locker works isn't totally accurate. A locker equalizes wheel speed, not "power", which should be called torque.

He was correct in stating that a limited slip sends (transfers) torque to wheel with the most traction. However, a locker does the same thing (although the total amount a limited slip transfers is limited by clutch friction).

So he somewhat contradicted himself, because both increase motive force by transfering torque to the wheel with traction.

GreenFlames · 02-01-2009, 10:24 AM

ima newb so dont chew me out for this one,what if you got a "lunchbox" locker and a locker for your rear end and one for your front end would that give you like ultra locking power or somthing?

William · 02-01-2009, 11:41 AM

With front and rear lockers in a 4wd, and with the transfer case in 4wd, you would not be able to spin just 1, 2, or 3 tires. Either all 4 tires spin, or not at all. This gives as much motive force as is possible to propel the vehicle forward (or backward). However, you would still be limited by several factors, such as tire size, tire tread pattern, power, the terrain, vehicle weight, vehicle wheelbase, and driving technique.

Just because all 4 tires have the ability to turn doesn't mean the vehicle won't get stuck. In fact, it sometimes means that you will go further before you get stuck, and as a result, you might get stuck worse and/or get stuck further away from help.

I hope this answers your question.

GreenFlames · 02-01-2009, 07:45 PM

so your saying to keep you truck unlocked so when you get stuck you dont get stuck to far away from help??? that defies all logic................i wheel with a buddy who goes in before or after.............im also in PEI so are biggest mudhole is only like 3 feet deep

William · 02-02-2009, 12:22 PM

It doesn't defy logic. You simply misunderstood what I meant.

I NEVER said not to use lockers. I said what I said only as a precaution. A locker equipped tuck could possibly get stuck in an area where a non-locker equipped truck can't get to in order to get the locker equipped truck out. And a locker equipped truck is usually harder to get stuck, which often means it's harder to get UNSTUCK when it does get stuck.

With or without lockers, you still need to use caution to avoid being stranded. It takes driving techniques which you have to learn. It helps to have a spotter, or you can get out of the truck to see what you are going to drive through. You can take a stick to test mud depth and find ruts, look for rocks that you might get hung up on, etc.

gatorbait · 02-16-2009, 12:02 PM

hey guys, i'm new to this so i need some help. i have an '07 tacoma 4x4 with the v6, and i was wondering what my best choice would be for a rear locker. I wanted to get an aussie locker but they dont make one for my year. Will a locker for an older truck fit? i want to maintain city driveability while increase offroad capabilities. Thanks for the help

tc · 02-16-2009, 04:53 PM

Too late to trade it in for one with an elocker?

bigt · 02-16-2009, 04:58 PM

o just swap out the whole axle forma junkyard and sell you old one!

gatorbait · 02-16-2009, 05:11 PM

ya unfortunately the truck was a gift from my parents who bought it used so i cant really swap it out. I like the idea of findin an e-locker in a junkyard though, i'll have to start calling around

bigt · 02-16-2009, 05:27 PM

yeah man a elocker is your best bet.. you might even have some wiring for it already in teh truck...do some research ... i know i priced a eocker diff for about 400 canadian..

alot cheaper than a arb

tc · 02-16-2009, 07:34 PM

He has to swap the whole axle though, not just the third.

bigt · 02-16-2009, 07:35 PM

or modify the housing? or cant that be done on newer tacos?? is the elocker a different diff?

tc · 02-16-2009, 07:43 PM

Yep - the non elocked diff has a bigger housing (newer "8.4" diff) than the elocker (old size 8" diffs.)

Might be different on the 05+ Tacos though ... probably need to go to www.ttora.com and search

gatorbait · 02-16-2009, 08:11 PM

well assuming i can find a good elocker axle, does anybody know if toyota or any other company makes a wiring kit for it? Has anybody done this before and know what im getting into?

brooklee1000 · 04-28-2009, 08:40 AM

I currently run an Aussie locker in rear of my '82 truck. Some of the characteristics I have noticed that you should consider before getting a locker as they all operate on similar principle.

1. The clicking is quite loud, I have had people tell me they think I have a cv joint going or something. I can live with noise. I tell people "its an Aussie!"

2. The Aussie website says that it will reduce tread wear. Not entirely true. I am easy on the go-pedal when turning, and the inside tire regularly spins up until the locker locks both tires, and I can hear the tire squeeling. This characteristic is really pronounced when it is wet or icy. Now, I have very little weight in the back and that may be why it spins up so easily, your experience may be different. Also, the tire spinning is the inside one, with little weight due to weight shift, so the wear is minimal. But the tires never spun when the diff was open.

3. The driveline winds up alot. If you don't know what that means, the tension built between the two tires trying to spin different speeds, puts pressure into the diffs, driveshaft, and transmission (when engaged). There is a resulting pressure inside the tranny, and shifts are harder or slower due to this pressure. I run a manual and grind my gears a little almost every time I shift now. Beware you standard transmisison owners, and keep in mind that alot of the older trannys barely handled the regular daily abuse.

4. The locker locks well, and in snow it works nice, but on ice, the back end tends to slide sideways under acceleration. This is something you really need to be conscious of, especially if you have more power, then breaking traction is easier. Having said that, my truck has very little weight in the back, and this may have added to the problem. We have 4x4's however, so lock the hubs and not a problem.

5. The axle tends to wrap more than before. A traction bar is highly recomended. MY leaf springs bend alot due to the added traction.

6. You are not invincible. I have already gotten into mudholes that I thought I could get through, but didn't. Need a front locker to get more stuck next time!

turbodrifter · 09-18-2009, 03:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Napoleon047

When is it time to invest in a locker?
Generally, when you find yourself getting stuck due to wheels spinning freely in the air while its opposite is on the ground not moving.

On what type of terrain will a locker help the most?
While a locker will help in any off-road condition, it will help most in conditions where the terrain is uneven causing a tire to lift into the air; and in conditions where the traction is uneven.

Lunchbox Lockers

What is a lunchbox locker?

A lunchbox locker is any of several brands of lockers that replace the spider and side gears in a differential.

Are these lockers selectable?

No. These lockers are fully automatic, meaning they require no user input to lock them. They are actually locked by default, meaning they are tied together. One side will automatically unlock, however, when needed.

What kind of quirks should I expect?

The locker makes itself know when making U-turns and 90 degree turns at intersections. In these cases, it helps to either coast with the clutch in or to drive with steady throttle through the turn. In more gentle turns and on the highway, the locker will be un-noticeable as it engages and disengages.

Can I install a lunchbox locker myself?

Yes. A home mechanic can install a lockrite with simple hand tools. One person can do it, but an extra pair of hands comes in handy.

How does one go about installing a lunchbox locker?

The locker will come with instructions, the best supplement I know of to these instructions is here.

Should I get a lunchbox locker or save up for an ARB or E-locker?

Well, if you want/need a locker but dont have a lot of money to spend, then yes, you should get a lunchbox. Because of its low buy-in cost, and its ease of install, lunchbox lockers have a lot of bang for the buck. If, however, you have the money to spend on an ARB, go for it. The majority of the people who install lockrites are happy with them.

Are these lockers weak?

Pretty much any peice of equipment has its limitations. Lunchbox lockers do fail on occasion. The most common breakage is a chipped/missing tooth. These usually go unnoticed because the locker continues to function as before. Rarely, the locker will jam in the locked position acting as a spool.

So which is the best option ? i have 97 4runner auto sr5 i need locker cheapest and best for front and rear. PLEASE HELP

AxleIke · 09-18-2009, 06:14 AM

Cheapest and best are mutually exclusive. Cheapest will be an aussie or lockright (lunchbox style). You can adapt to driving them with a little practice, and be just fine. Should be easier with the automatic tranny too.

Best is ARB.

Pick your poison.

tc · 09-18-2009, 09:59 AM

Actually, cheapest would be welded or a spool ... I would add elocker to the "best" option (for the rear only on IFS rigs obviously)

All "traction aiding devices" balance on-road performance, off-road performance, and price/complexity. The only lockers that do not have performance tradeoffs are the selectables. If you drive on snowy streets or someone else drives your rig (wife, for example), this could be a HUGE (perhaps life and death) factor.

turbodrifter · 09-18-2009, 01:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AxleIke

Cheapest and best are mutually exclusive. Cheapest will be an aussie or lockright (lunchbox style). You can adapt to driving them with a little practice, and be just fine. Should be easier with the automatic tranny too.

Best is ARB.

Pick your poison.

thanks, how about front if i put locker in and i only drive rear in city will it turn on ? will it be pain to have front locker? or it wont bother me if i drive with rear only and if it does manual hubs is the answer ?

AxleIke · 09-18-2009, 01:20 PM

Someone will have to chime in who has an auto(lunchbox) locker in the front with ADD. I would assume it would be fine, as the add disconnects one side of the diff, which should allow you to have no issues with the locker. Could be wrong though.

11-29-2007, 02:46 AM	#78 (permalink)
William Registered User Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Bradley Junction, Florida Posts: 276	His explaination of how a locker works isn't totally accurate. A locker equalizes wheel speed, not "power", which should be called torque. He was correct in stating that a limited slip sends (transfers) torque to wheel with the most traction. However, a locker does the same thing (although the total amount a limited slip transfers is limited by clutch friction). So he somewhat contradicted himself, because both increase motive force by transfering torque to the wheel with traction. __________________ '06 Tacoma TRD 4wd 4 door short bed. Rear locker mod (can use in high range and 2wd now). Skyjacker 3" lift struts with new rear springs and shocks. Home made spacers in front for another 3/4" lift. Roadmaster overload springs in the rear for another 7/8" lift, and better carrying/towing ability. 285/75-16 BFG All Terrains. More to come. '08 Yamaha FJR1300 with ABS and power adjustable windshield. '06 Yamaha Wolverine 450 sport/4wd ATV

02-01-2009, 11:41 AM	#80 (permalink)
William Registered User Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Bradley Junction, Florida Posts: 276	With front and rear lockers in a 4wd, and with the transfer case in 4wd, you would not be able to spin just 1, 2, or 3 tires. Either all 4 tires spin, or not at all. This gives as much motive force as is possible to propel the vehicle forward (or backward). However, you would still be limited by several factors, such as tire size, tire tread pattern, power, the terrain, vehicle weight, vehicle wheelbase, and driving technique. Just because all 4 tires have the ability to turn doesn't mean the vehicle won't get stuck. In fact, it sometimes means that you will go further before you get stuck, and as a result, you might get stuck worse and/or get stuck further away from help. I hope this answers your question. __________________ '06 Tacoma TRD 4wd 4 door short bed. Rear locker mod (can use in high range and 2wd now). Skyjacker 3" lift struts with new rear springs and shocks. Home made spacers in front for another 3/4" lift. Roadmaster overload springs in the rear for another 7/8" lift, and better carrying/towing ability. 285/75-16 BFG All Terrains. More to come. '08 Yamaha FJR1300 with ABS and power adjustable windshield. '06 Yamaha Wolverine 450 sport/4wd ATV

02-02-2009, 12:22 PM	#82 (permalink)
William Registered User Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Bradley Junction, Florida Posts: 276	It doesn't defy logic. You simply misunderstood what I meant. I NEVER said not to use lockers. I said what I said only as a precaution. A locker equipped tuck could possibly get stuck in an area where a non-locker equipped truck can't get to in order to get the locker equipped truck out. And a locker equipped truck is usually harder to get stuck, which often means it's harder to get UNSTUCK when it does get stuck. With or without lockers, you still need to use caution to avoid being stranded. It takes driving techniques which you have to learn. It helps to have a spotter, or you can get out of the truck to see what you are going to drive through. You can take a stick to test mud depth and find ruts, look for rocks that you might get hung up on, etc. __________________ '06 Tacoma TRD 4wd 4 door short bed. Rear locker mod (can use in high range and 2wd now). Skyjacker 3" lift struts with new rear springs and shocks. Home made spacers in front for another 3/4" lift. Roadmaster overload springs in the rear for another 7/8" lift, and better carrying/towing ability. 285/75-16 BFG All Terrains. More to come. '08 Yamaha FJR1300 with ABS and power adjustable windshield. '06 Yamaha Wolverine 450 sport/4wd ATV

02-16-2009, 04:53 PM	#84 (permalink)
tc Contributing Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Longmont, CO Posts: 8,376	Too late to trade it in for one with an elocker? __________________ Check out www.coTTORA.org to hook up with great Toyota 'wheelin' folks! Current - 93 4Runner: 3VZ 33"x10.50" no lift ARB F/R 96 Impala SS: My own personal cop car Previous - 89 2WD Pickup 22R, Fabtech "Ivan Dan" lift, 31x10.50, IASCA World Finals 4th Place Stop with the mods and get on the trail! Pix at www.4wheelingoh.shutterfly.com/action

02-16-2009, 04:58 PM	#85 (permalink)
bigt Registered User Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: chippawa niagara falls ontario Posts: 3,201	o just swap out the whole axle forma junkyard and sell you old one! __________________ 1991 HILUX SURF SSR-X turbo diesel right hand drive toyota imported in 2005 from japan, 130,000 km 31 bfg a/t auto current build 1987 LWB suzuki samurai. turning 2 into one.. yota axles welded front to back, yota springs , ifs steering box,, this bad boy will not only eat jeeps but toyotas aswell \m/

02-01-2009, 10:24 AM	#79 (permalink)
GreenFlames Registered User Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: the nearest mudhole Posts: 131	ima newb so dont chew me out for this one,what if you got a "lunchbox" locker and a locker for your rear end and one for your front end would that give you like ultra locking power or somthing?

02-01-2009, 07:45 PM	#81 (permalink)
GreenFlames Registered User Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: the nearest mudhole Posts: 131	so your saying to keep you truck unlocked so when you get stuck you dont get stuck to far away from help??? that defies all logic................i wheel with a buddy who goes in before or after.............im also in PEI so are biggest mudhole is only like 3 feet deep

02-16-2009, 12:02 PM	#83 (permalink)
gatorbait Registered User Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Gainesville, FL Posts: 3	hey guys, i'm new to this so i need some help. i have an '07 tacoma 4x4 with the v6, and i was wondering what my best choice would be for a rear locker. I wanted to get an aussie locker but they dont make one for my year. Will a locker for an older truck fit? i want to maintain city driveability while increase offroad capabilities. Thanks for the help

02-16-2009, 05:11 PM	#86 (permalink)
gatorbait Registered User Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Gainesville, FL Posts: 3	ya unfortunately the truck was a gift from my parents who bought it used so i cant really swap it out. I like the idea of findin an e-locker in a junkyard though, i'll have to start calling around

02-16-2009, 05:27 PM	#87 (permalink)
bigt Registered User Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: chippawa niagara falls ontario Posts: 3,201	yeah man a elocker is your best bet.. you might even have some wiring for it already in teh truck...do some research ... i know i priced a eocker diff for about 400 canadian.. alot cheaper than a arb __________________ 1991 HILUX SURF SSR-X turbo diesel right hand drive toyota imported in 2005 from japan, 130,000 km 31 bfg a/t auto current build 1987 LWB suzuki samurai. turning 2 into one.. yota axles welded front to back, yota springs , ifs steering box,, this bad boy will not only eat jeeps but toyotas aswell \m/

02-16-2009, 07:34 PM	#88 (permalink)
tc Contributing Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Longmont, CO Posts: 8,376	He has to swap the whole axle though, not just the third. __________________ Check out www.coTTORA.org to hook up with great Toyota 'wheelin' folks! Current - 93 4Runner: 3VZ 33"x10.50" no lift ARB F/R 96 Impala SS: My own personal cop car Previous - 89 2WD Pickup 22R, Fabtech "Ivan Dan" lift, 31x10.50, IASCA World Finals 4th Place Stop with the mods and get on the trail! Pix at www.4wheelingoh.shutterfly.com/action

02-16-2009, 07:35 PM	#89 (permalink)
bigt Registered User Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: chippawa niagara falls ontario Posts: 3,201	or modify the housing? or cant that be done on newer tacos?? is the elocker a different diff? __________________ 1991 HILUX SURF SSR-X turbo diesel right hand drive toyota imported in 2005 from japan, 130,000 km 31 bfg a/t auto current build 1987 LWB suzuki samurai. turning 2 into one.. yota axles welded front to back, yota springs , ifs steering box,, this bad boy will not only eat jeeps but toyotas aswell \m/

02-16-2009, 07:43 PM	#90 (permalink)
tc Contributing Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Longmont, CO Posts: 8,376	Yep - the non elocked diff has a bigger housing (newer "8.4" diff) than the elocker (old size 8" diffs.) Might be different on the 05+ Tacos though ... probably need to go to www.ttora.com and search __________________ Check out www.coTTORA.org to hook up with great Toyota 'wheelin' folks! Current - 93 4Runner: 3VZ 33"x10.50" no lift ARB F/R 96 Impala SS: My own personal cop car Previous - 89 2WD Pickup 22R, Fabtech "Ivan Dan" lift, 31x10.50, IASCA World Finals 4th Place Stop with the mods and get on the trail! Pix at www.4wheelingoh.shutterfly.com/action

02-16-2009, 08:11 PM	#91 (permalink)
gatorbait Registered User Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Gainesville, FL Posts: 3	well assuming i can find a good elocker axle, does anybody know if toyota or any other company makes a wiring kit for it? Has anybody done this before and know what im getting into?

04-28-2009, 08:40 AM	#92 (permalink)
brooklee1000 Registered User Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: ontario Posts: 118	I currently run an Aussie locker in rear of my '82 truck. Some of the characteristics I have noticed that you should consider before getting a locker as they all operate on similar principle. 1. The clicking is quite loud, I have had people tell me they think I have a cv joint going or something. I can live with noise. I tell people "its an Aussie!" 2. The Aussie website says that it will reduce tread wear. Not entirely true. I am easy on the go-pedal when turning, and the inside tire regularly spins up until the locker locks both tires, and I can hear the tire squeeling. This characteristic is really pronounced when it is wet or icy. Now, I have very little weight in the back and that may be why it spins up so easily, your experience may be different. Also, the tire spinning is the inside one, with little weight due to weight shift, so the wear is minimal. But the tires never spun when the diff was open. 3. The driveline winds up alot. If you don't know what that means, the tension built between the two tires trying to spin different speeds, puts pressure into the diffs, driveshaft, and transmission (when engaged). There is a resulting pressure inside the tranny, and shifts are harder or slower due to this pressure. I run a manual and grind my gears a little almost every time I shift now. Beware you standard transmisison owners, and keep in mind that alot of the older trannys barely handled the regular daily abuse. 4. The locker locks well, and in snow it works nice, but on ice, the back end tends to slide sideways under acceleration. This is something you really need to be conscious of, especially if you have more power, then breaking traction is easier. Having said that, my truck has very little weight in the back, and this may have added to the problem. We have 4x4's however, so lock the hubs and not a problem. 5. The axle tends to wrap more than before. A traction bar is highly recomended. MY leaf springs bend alot due to the added traction. 6. You are not invincible. I have already gotten into mudholes that I thought I could get through, but didn't. Need a front locker to get more stuck next time! __________________ Toyota does it Better, Longer, Faster, Stronger.

09-18-2009, 06:14 AM	#94 (permalink)
AxleIke Contributing Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Boulder, Colorado Posts: 4,888	Cheapest and best are mutually exclusive. Cheapest will be an aussie or lockright (lunchbox style). You can adapt to driving them with a little practice, and be just fine. Should be easier with the automatic tranny too. Best is ARB. Pick your poison. __________________ 1987 Mutant 4runner\|Slightly Modified\|Lacking general build direction -Lifts and Tires look cool at the Mall, Lockers and Gears look cool on the trail. -Internet Nice Guy

09-18-2009, 09:59 AM	#95 (permalink)
tc Contributing Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Longmont, CO Posts: 8,376	Actually, cheapest would be welded or a spool ... I would add elocker to the "best" option (for the rear only on IFS rigs obviously) All "traction aiding devices" balance on-road performance, off-road performance, and price/complexity. The only lockers that do not have performance tradeoffs are the selectables. If you drive on snowy streets or someone else drives your rig (wife, for example), this could be a HUGE (perhaps life and death) factor. __________________ Check out www.coTTORA.org to hook up with great Toyota 'wheelin' folks! Current - 93 4Runner: 3VZ 33"x10.50" no lift ARB F/R 96 Impala SS: My own personal cop car Previous - 89 2WD Pickup 22R, Fabtech "Ivan Dan" lift, 31x10.50, IASCA World Finals 4th Place Stop with the mods and get on the trail! Pix at www.4wheelingoh.shutterfly.com/action

09-18-2009, 01:20 PM	#97 (permalink)
AxleIke Contributing Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Boulder, Colorado Posts: 4,888	Someone will have to chime in who has an auto(lunchbox) locker in the front with ADD. I would assume it would be fine, as the add disconnects one side of the diff, which should allow you to have no issues with the locker. Could be wrong though. __________________ 1987 Mutant 4runner\|Slightly Modified\|Lacking general build direction -Lifts and Tires look cool at the Mall, Lockers and Gears look cool on the trail. -Internet Nice Guy

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