pattycakes77

iTrader: (2)

ok, i've been looking into this for awhile and i might have tracked some one down that is able to get me most of the parts for a rear hatch and tire carrier swap for my 4runner. so, if i'm going to do this i need a little more info about this before i pull the trigger.

it all looks interchangeable, but does anyone really know if it is? i can handle the wiring for lights, wiper, and the rear window. i'm really concerned about opening and closing the hatch and how the tire carrier is mounted on the side. i'm sure there is some kind of reinforcement for the tire carrier to mount to behind the quarter panel, anyone know what this looks like and is it welded to the frame somehow? and for opening/closing the hatch, does it latch in the same spot as the 4runner? the license plate is located on the left side and i assume the opening mechanism is there as well, would this still work the same if the latch is in the same spot?

thanks for indulging me everyone. i want to do something to get my tire out from under the truck while keeping it stock-ish looking. and i think the Hilux Surfs look awesome with the tire back there, functional and good looking, can't go wrong.

i basically want it to look like this:

and that wing on the back is sooo sexy as well.

any info i can get would be appreciated. especially if there are Hilux owners from overseas that can give me first hand info on how everything works.
thanks.

Dublin

If anyone knows these guys would. Might be a bit late to get a reply tonight though.
http://www.hiluxsurf.co.uk/forums/index.php

pattycakes77

iTrader: (2)

thanks, i just posted. we'll see what they have to say.

i just saw a picture of a Hilux Surf with the tire carrier taken off, saw the top holes (3 of them) near the left corner of the rear side window, but the lower part that attaches looks like one bolt but the quarter panel looks to be indented a bit. this is making me wonder if this is going to be more than just a little fab and bolt on

KZN185W

iTrader: (1)

there's also a subframe inside (behind the holes) to stiffen the body. this subframe is welded to the body shell.

pattycakes77

iTrader: (2)

thanks KZN185W, those pics helped with outside mounting a bit. i figured there was some kind of reinforcement on the inside, i'll have to see what i can come up with for mine. i got a couple responses from the hiluxsurf website, not much about how it all works but they gave me some leads for where to contact and buy parts from over there to be shipped here. that's really not the problem though. i talked again to the guy i might buy the parts from, he says getting what i need will be no problem, but gave me a guess quote of $525 to ship from his US warehouse to my city. so, i'm trying to negotiate something a bit better for shipping. my sister works for FedEx so i'm talking to her to see what we can do. that was just a guess on his part for shipping though so i hope it will be less. i looked around on ebay some more last night and saw a 3rd gen hilux with tire carrier and they had a picture of the hatch open, looks like the latch that locks the hatch down is in the same spot as the 4runners so that is good news.

some one on HiluxSurf also posted a link to a guy that put a tire carrier on his 2nd gen Hilux Surf that didn't have one from the factory. but, he did not do a complete swap like i'm looking at. he just modified his stock hatch with a plate and made the attaching hardware for the tire carrier. he also did not do any reinforcement where the carrier attaches, he just used some funny looking bolts and nuts that flared out on the inside of the body panel. he said it was solid, but i'd rather have something a little more beefy back there for my swap. a link to his thread HERE

so, i'm still looking for anyone that has info on the sub frame reinforcement that keeps the tire carrier secured.

thanks again for the info thus far, i'm filing it all away for when parts arrive. this is starting to feel like a money pit idea, but i think it will turn out great so i'm not worried.

Aywilkerson

mount it on the roof, with a shovel and a pick ax! looks 10 times better,

pattycakes77

iTrader: (2)

but then i wouldn't look so unique! i'm doing this for looks and function. i thought about getting a nice basket and throwing it up top, but i've read about as mileage going down with that and i'm already at about 10mpg or so, and the cost of a basket is about as much as they want for the Surf parts so i think i'll go this route and see how it turns out. i'm closer to working out shipping. the guy told me that he has to guess pretty generously since gas prices are up and so is shipping, but he said he'd work with me once he sees how much shipping is going to cost on the other Hilux Surf hatch he's selling; and i'm trying to figure out if my sis can get FedEx to make us a killer deal too.

oh, btw, since i know the overseas hatches latch in the same place as the US 4runners, am i right in thinking that the hatch release is under the part on the left side above the license plate?

pattycakes77

iTrader: (2)

btw KZN185W - thanks for posting the info in THIS thread, that helped a lot.

and i posted that this is probably one of those "grass is always greener on the other side of the pond" things. well, in my search i've found 3rd gen Hilux Surf owners wanting to ditch the rear carrier for one under the vehicle like in the US and some Surfs. funny how everyone wants what they don't have

i also found a thread on the HiluxSurf board dated June '05 from Bamachem looking to do the exact same thing, but he didn't get any response to his query. guess i'm not the only one looking to do this. i'll keep updating this thread as i find information or actually do the swap.

aviator

Looking at the pictures the carrier looks very similar to the tire carrier that was available on the early 2gen 4runner/hilux surfs. From what I've seen the body line at the rear corner is very similar between the 2/3gens you could probably use the re-enforcing plate from a 2 gen as a starting point. I have no idea if they are available from the dealer though. The 2 gen also had no dimpling that I could see just the hinge bolted through the body to the plate.
Aviator

pattycakes77

iTrader: (2)

Thanks Aviator! i knew the 2nd gens had the spare tire carrier over here sometimes, but i never thought to look at how they were reinforced. i'm sure i could find one in the yards and do some exploratory surgery and see how it ticks! would definitely give me an idea of how the factory braced things to hold a spare. that's a great idea. i may just see how they attach and nix the whole surf hatch idea. although, i would need to figure out how to open the hatch or re-route those mechanics, and also move the license plate; probably a little more involved than i would like, but it's on the table.

KZN185W

iTrader: (1)

To help you get familiar with the carrier:





to help you with the reinforcement:

JDM KZN/VZN185W D-Pillar:


USDM VZN185L D-Pillar:

aviator

The licence plate was mounted to the carrier itself (beside the tire) and the reverse lights were in the rear light assembly much like the pick-up's (or else the lights were two small rectangles in the outer lower corners)[not sure which]. Everything else was pretty much the same as I recall. The hatch was slightly different it had a re-inforcing plate in the middle behind the carrier bump stop (I think) and no licence cut out, the carrier was latched to the middle of the bumper at the bottom if I remember correctly. For reverse lights you could always use a pair of tractor work lights attached to the bumper or a set of those "auxilliary" reverse lights secured to the trailer hitch crossmember (if you have one). If you wanted a cleaner "import" look a pair of those small square driving lights mounted to the bumper could meet your needs. As for the latch mechanics I don't see what would need changing just make sure the carrier is open first before you release the thing from the inside lol.
For that sweet JDM wing I believe you can source that from import auto speed shops or possibly ebay.
Aviator

pattycakes77

iTrader: (2)

Thank You, Thank You, Thank You, Thank You, Thank You, Thank You, Thank You, Thank You, Thank You, Thank You, Thank You, Thank You, Thank You, Thank You, Thank You, Thank You, Thank You, Thank You, Thank You, Thank You, Thank You, Thank You, Thank You, Thank You, Thank You, Thank You!

a wealth of information for me to process now. still waiting on the updated shipping quote for the parts. i'll keep this thread updated with any new useful bits. thanks again everyone!

Ron Helmuth

quite an ambitious project pattycakes77

following along-but this is way beyond anything I would attempt. I admire you guys that can pull this all together.

pattycakes77

iTrader: (2)

just a quick update...

i haven't heard back from the parts vendor yet, i hope that means he's just waiting for the parts to be imported. but, i do have a little speculative information on a question i posted above about how the hatch works as in how it is opened from the outside. at first i thought the mechanics for popping open the hatch were located under the piece above the license plate on the left side of the hilux surf hatch. i'm thinking this is not true. i was doing some digging, and i found the website for Satoshi and his Hilux Surf and he has a picture of his Surf with the tire carrier taken off. here is the picture:



it looks like in the middle there is a place for the mechanism just like on our 4runners. all they did was move the license plate and lights to the left, but kept the handle for popping the hatch in the center. i think. i don't know why else they would have that place in the middle other than to house the handle for popping the hatch. this has not been confirmed though, i have yet to find anyone with a Hilux Surf with the tire carrier that will tell me for sure how that hatch works.

but, this is good news. the less they move around and re-design from these two models, the better it is for the swap.

that's all for now, nothing major but a little something noteworthy.

4Runner202020

this is a big idea!! you should just keep your hatck and put your plate on your spare tire. seen it done many times before... just another (cheaper) way to do it.

keep us posted

bobby

aviator

I just saw a 92 with a hatch for a truck that would have had a tire carrier in a scrap yard last week. It was a retro fit because this truck did not have the carrier but I recognised it anyway.

The centre licence plate/reverse light thingy was there as normal [though in retrospect he may have cut the thing in since he did'nt have the carrier] the reverse lights (used with the carrier) were there they are about 3.5" x 1.5" and are located in the lower corners of the hatch about 1" in from the outer edge and about 2" or 3" up from the bottom. If I have time in the week and it's still there (fat chance) I'll snap a pic for you.

KZN185W

iTrader: (1)

The keyhole for window control and lock is on the license plate light (at the left) but the hatch is opened using the latch at the center.

pattycakes77

iTrader: (2)

thank you once again KZN185W! this is great news. i think it's safe to say that it's going to be an easy swap for the hatch, maybe just figure out the wiring but that shouldn't be a problem.

now, the waiting on the parts vendor is killing me!

pattycakes77

iTrader: (2)

well, i got some bad news about this project today. my "pretty much sure thing" as far as sourcing the parts just emailed me today and said this:

"We did not get one from this last trip and as of now, we will not be going back to Japan to pack any more shipments. The EPA has re-written there laws and it is no longer legal to import engines, so we are getting out of the importing business, sorry."

so, the guy that was going to sell everything to me at a reasonable price and has access to the parts, has now been run out of business by the EPA.

looks like i'll have to keep checking ebay UK and contacting wrecking yards overseas and hope they actually respond to my requests and don't charge me the $2000 i was quoted once from the only UK yard that replied to my emails. man, this guy was going to sell it to me for $500 and i had my sister's FedEx shipping rate of about $70, what a pisser!

so, anyone that was watching this thread to see how it turned out, i guess you're going to be disappointed. i'll keep looking, but i'm not hopeful that i will ever be able to afford the parts and shipping now. i guess it's on to a custom bumper with integrated tire carrier like Bamachem has on his; he also looked into the hilux tire carrier and was unsuccessful.

oh well, that's all i've got, guess i'll drown my sorrows in some green beer today