The Hammers In Serious Trouble! Virtual Rally 3/12/08

187proof · 03-06-2008, 08:00 PM

Johnson Valley (The Hammers) OHV area is in serious trouble! The Marine Corps want to take over most, if not all of Johnson Valley as part of a massive expansion project. There is going to be a rally next Wednesday (3/12/08 on pirate4x4.com. I urge ALL of you, wether you have been, plan on going, or even if you dont ever plan on going to get on pirate tomorrow and let your VOICE BE HEARD!!!

Johnson Valley is the Mecca of 4 Wheeling on the West Coast. To lose it would be devastating not only to our sport but our industry. We are already losing record amounts of trails, to lose the most famous trail in the West would be very devastating!! I have never been to the Hammers myself but I have always wanted to go and I would be very upset if it was to be closed.

Please, in the name of preserving our trails log on next Wednesday and help us fight their decision!!

Write your representative:

https://forms.house.gov/wyr/welcome.shtml

The Virtual Rally Thread on PBB:

Important Announcement! Rally For The Hammers! - Pirate4x4.Com Bulletin Board

Quote:

Originally Posted by PIRATE 4X4

Announcing the first ever, Pirate4x4.com: VIRTUAL RALLY FOR THE HAMMERS

Please read the following very carefully!

We need your help to pull this off and make it effective. Any and all input is greatly appreciated and will be carefully listened to.

First, let me be VERY clear. It does not look good for the Hammers.

John Stewart for Cal4Wheel is working extremely hard on this with several other people and organizations, but they cannot do it all alone. Like never before, the OHV community needs to develop a grass-roots effort to show that we have strength in numbers and that we care about our trails being taken away from us.

Here is the goal:

In a four hour time frame pack Pirate with so many people the server fries and Pirate crashes. (OK, just kidding…but that would sound awesome on a press release! LOL!)

All politicians care about is numbers. If you have ever taken a poly-sci class you may remember hearing that 1 letter from a person is seen as roughly equaling 300 votes. The greatest number of users ever logged into Pirate was 3,305 on 2/11/2008. The goal is to CRUSH that number and have all of those people post up in the Rally thread what the Hammers mean to them and to the OHV community.

When the rally is over, we will lock the thread and fab-up ANOTHER press release to the powers that be, showing how many people attended this virtual rally, how many posts there were, and invite them to read the thread and our concerns if they did not attend.

Here is the Plan:

1. We will issue a press release this Friday to politicians, media outlets, companies etc. announcing a virtual rally on Pirate4x4.com and invite them to come.

2. Lance will do a mass e-mail to ALL PBB members this Friday asking them to participate in the rally from 2-6 by posting their concerns in the thread.

3. We will come up with “sample” post to put in the thread to give people an idea of what we are looking for. (post them here please) Even people that have NEVER been to the Hammers need to post their concerns. This is all about showing how many of us there are and that we have a VOICE as a community.

4. The Rally will be on WEDNESDAY MARCH 12th from 2 to 6 pm Pacific Standard time.

5. Mustard Dog will start the “Rally” thread at 2pm that day. As of now, it will be in chit-chat, but we may be able to have it in all forums at once.

6. In the thread people will post their concerns about our trails being taken away, why the Hammers should remain open, pictures of them and their FAMILIES in the Hammers (appropriate ones!), etc. etc. People are encouraged to post multiple times.

ALL CHIT-CHAT BULL AND INAPPRIOPRATE POSTS WILL BE DELETED! We plan on having important people read this thread. If we are not on our best behavior, the OHV community will look bad.

7. As stated above, after the rally another press-release will be issued showing the number of people attending the rally, the number of posts, data on how fast the thread grew etc… We will also invite those in power that did not attend to read the thread.

What I am asking from all of you:

1. PLEASE: Get the word out! E-mail everyone you know, put something about it in your sig-line, go to other boards and sites and announce the rally, send out bulletins on Myspace etc. etc.

2. Write sample “posts” for people to see and post them here. Hopefully, they can type something up over the weekend and just cut and paste it on the day of the Rally.

Will this Rally save the Hammers? I do not know. But if it shows politicians and land-managers that we are a force to reckon with because of our numbers, it may make them think twice.

Why am I doing this if I have never been to the Hammers? During the ELDO fiasco last summer, I asked for help in chit-chat. People asked me, “Why should we help you guys? Where were YOU when OUR trails were being closed?” After I though about it, they were right. Where was I? It seems that we only fight for our own backyards. Not anymore. I promised the PBB in that thread I would fight route closures EVERYWHERE. So I am.

In a few, I will post up what I plan to post in the rally thread on the 12th.

A huge thanks to John Stewart, Del Albright, Randy Burelson, Cal4, BRC, and the other “Land-use” guys for their help, guidance and support. Many of them are working VERY hard behind the scenes on this issue.

I would also like to thank Lance and Camo for letting us do this on their site.

For all of those that e-mailed and PM’ed me on this: A huge thanks for your input and help. I am asking you to all step up in leadership roles in this.

I am sure there are people I forgot to thank. I am sorry….it’s been a long day already! LOL!!

It’s AWN like Donkey KONG!

GET IT!

Kurt Schneider

The Friends of Eldorado National Forest.

CHEERS AND THANK YOU TO EVERYONE WHO PARTICIPATES!!! :beer:

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fillsrunner4 · 03-06-2008, 09:12 PM

Im so sick of land for wheeling being taken away for any reason. Its sad to see and I hope my kids someday will be able to play somewhere. Ridiculous

stevrock · 03-06-2008, 09:51 PM

Gotta train in order to protect the homeland.

Albuquerque Jim · 03-06-2008, 10:48 PM

Bump, this requires your attention.

I believe that the military needs land for training, but just leave the Hammers alone.

fillsrunner4 · 03-06-2008, 11:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stevrock

Gotta train in order to protect the homeland.

You can trail a million other places. They want it so they can go out and play with it and waist even more money. Homeland is important but they dont need to take this land for it

stormin94 · 03-06-2008, 11:52 PM

Bottom line here is that the govt, pretty much does what it wants. I've never been to the hammers, nor do I know where it is(northern California, that's it), and I don't have any plans to visit it in the near future, but I think it shoud remain open, and in the hands of the public.
The military has many other locations that they can train on, hell, if I had 1,000 acres to spare, I'd let em train on that, but being that i"m probably only a few hundred miles away from this, it affects me. What is wrong with using a closed military base for training purposes?

JohnnyRanger54 · 03-07-2008, 08:16 AM

we have enough training grounds in the south and south east parts of the US...

AndYota · 03-07-2008, 08:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnnyRanger54

we have enough training grounds in the south and south east parts of the US...

Yes we do, but maybe they need to train in the rocks?

I too think it's a little crazy to just take away that much pristine OHV playground just because they can. I've never been to The Hammers either, but I truly enjoy my off-roading experiences and can sympathize with those at risk of losing their area. Also, I'd like to have the opportunity to go there in the future when my beast is up to the trip. I'll be showing my support at the Vrally for sure on the 12th.

Andy

187proof · 03-07-2008, 12:59 PM

I too think the military deserves the best training BUT there are plenty of places that can expand to that doesnt involve getting rid of places like JV. I dont have the exact quote on me but from the USMC's plan on their website, the expansion is to allow 3 battalions 36 hours of training as opposed to 2 battalions 28 hours of training (what they currently have).

Johnson Valley is located in Southern California and is largely renowned as the most hardcore/extreme trail on the West Coast.

Thank you everyone who will participate. It will be a long time before I have the time nor the money to take a trip down to JV, but I hope when that time comes the Hammers will still be there.

HuskyRunner · 03-07-2008, 06:00 PM

If they take away the land from the people, whose homeland are they protecting? Public land should be exactly that: public. I'd participate, but I don't think the US government would car what a Canadian has to say...

187proof · 03-08-2008, 02:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HuskyRunner

If they take away the land from the people, whose homeland are they protecting? Public land should be exactly that: public. I'd participate, but I don't think the US government would car what a Canadian has to say...

No no no!! You are missing the point! Every voice counts, even though you dont live in the USA, the fact that you would be willing to spend big $$$ to travel all the way there and spend more of $$$ is what counts. We are trying to show everyone, not just the USMC that we have numbers, we play a lot, and we put a lot of money into local economies. please participate, even if you feel your voice matters not, it does. We need all the help we can get.

BLKNBLU · 03-08-2008, 07:25 AM

I especially like this part:

Why am I doing this if I have never been to the Hammers? During the ELDO fiasco last summer, I asked for help in chit-chat. People asked me, “Why should we help you guys? Where were YOU when OUR trails were being closed?” After I though about it, they were right. Where was I? It seems that we only fight for our own backyards. Not anymore. I promised the PBB in that thread I would fight route closures EVERYWHERE. So I am.

...and he is right. We all need to start thinking in terms of the whole community, not just our own immediate, local concerns.

**Lysmachia** · 03-08-2008, 08:27 AM

You can also add this to your sig:

SAVE THE HAMMERS
Online Rally MARCH 12th 2pm-6pm PST. ON PBB. Be there and please post POSITIVE COMMENTS!!

ozziesironmanoffroad · 03-09-2008, 12:06 AM

regretfully i cannot make it, due to work, but theyd better not close that trail. and for TRAINING purposes? they have ENOUGH 'training terrain' in NEVADA!!! its hard to find a place to 4x4 out here due to the thiefment taking everything for itself. i mean hell most of nevada that isnt populated is owned by the military.. sucks

NPE701 · 03-09-2008, 07:52 PM

I don't understand.. what happened to "Support our troops"??!

drew303 · 03-11-2008, 01:28 AM

before 9/11 you COULD 4x4 on Ft. Lewis.. not the restricted parts but they have A LOT of land dedicated to Ft. Lewis and you can NO LONGER mess around out there. You cant go play on the forest roads and WAVE and bs with the troops. now you get arrested and fined hardcore.

SAD to say the least, it irrates the $^$%&^%$#%*U@#$$#@$#$% out of me to no end but thats the price we pay for others #%%$%^&$%%$ ups. ie terrorist.

The people who trash the remaining trails and areas we are allow to play also SUCK and if i caught someone dumping trash on one my trials id probably be in jail for murder.. if they found the body. It sickens me.

I cant make the rally that pisses me off to cuz i work. If I someonhow get there when it goes down i will post.

It's already hard enough to find good places to wheel here. To take our woods away anywhere agravates me.

drew303 · 03-11-2008, 01:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NPE701

I don't understand.. what happened to "Support our troops"??!

I would have to see the exact reasoning behind WHY they need to claim this NEW land for training purposes.

I really don't see how this has a lot do with supporting troops or not supporting them. What could they possibly need that area for? The government already has to much power over the people.

Ricer-X · 03-11-2008, 07:44 AM

im an admin over on clubxterra.org
we are lending our support
im gonna push for our sister sites (clubtitan/frontier/armada to join and help too)
i only wish i had seen this earlier than today!

BLKNBLU · 03-11-2008, 12:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ricer-X

im an admin over on clubxterra.org
we are lending our support
im gonna push for our sister sites (clubtitan/frontier/armada to join and help too)
i only wish i had seen this earlier than today!

Thanks.

YeloSub7 · 03-12-2008, 12:36 PM

tow this behind my runner and fight BACK!

infiltrator · 03-12-2008, 12:54 PM

Well, today is the rally. I hope everything goes well.
Why can't the military use the area for a couple weeks and give it back? That would be fair to all wouldn't it?

Maybe we can get them to "Tread lightly"

Tankota · 03-12-2008, 03:00 PM

The rally is on right now! Until 6pm PST.. Post up people! I've got post #178, now get over there!

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=664629

This is your chance to speak up for your wheeling lands, no mater where you live.

***Corey*** · 03-12-2008, 03:40 PM

Post #705 reporting in.

Tankota · 03-12-2008, 03:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Corey

Post #705 reporting in.

Yes! Thank you! Anybody else what to stand up for their wheeling rights?

http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=664629

Don't just lurk, or you may find yourself lurking on the otherside of a fence on lands you used to wheel on! Just post something postive, even if you have never been there. If they can take a place as huge as Johnson Valley here, what's to stop them from taking your backyard wheeling area there??

**Lysmachia** · 03-12-2008, 04:22 PM

Post # 896 Checking in

Lost of folks are signing up on Pirate just for this rally. You won't get flamed if you do. Shoot I've been a member since Oct 2005 and This is my 2nd post!!

SAVE THE HAMMERS

Online Rally MARCH 12th 2pm-6pm PST. ON Pirate4x4. Be there and please post POSITIVE COMMENTS!!

03-06-2008, 09:12 PM	#2 (permalink)
fillsrunner4 Registered User Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Sammamish, wa Posts: 2,724	Im so sick of land for wheeling being taken away for any reason. Its sad to see and I hope my kids someday will be able to play somewhere. Ridiculous __________________ 94' toyota 4runner (Many a change!) purchased bone stock, NOW... SAS, 39" Iroks, Rear Leafswap, 5.29's , Air locked front, Welded rear, Chevy 4.3L V6, 5spd swap, dual T/C's MC10R10, flatbelly with custom skids, sliders, Chopped, Bobbed and so much more. Might as well start reading this if ya want know more Fillsrunner4 3.4crawler Build Thread Fillsrunner4.3 crawler (Part Two) build thread

03-06-2008, 10:48 PM	#4 (permalink)
Albuquerque Jim Contributing Member Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Albuquerque, NM Posts: 2,570	Bump, this requires your attention. I believe that the military needs land for training, but just leave the Hammers alone. __________________ '00 SR5, "Highlander" Dual Cases, Aisin Hubs, E-Lock'd, Cryo'd, Chromo'd, ARB'd, 315's, Sonoran Steel Bumper, Lift & UCA's, 4 Crawl 1" BL, Armored...etc. F-Toy #081 in progress Dual Cases, 30 Splines, 5.71's, E-lockers, Hydro-Assist, 37's, DOM Hendrix Chassis, 80Proof, ORS, Sonoran Steel...etc.

03-06-2008, 11:52 PM	#6 (permalink)
stormin94 Contributing Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Lake County, CA/Sacramento Posts: 3,539	Bottom line here is that the govt, pretty much does what it wants. I've never been to the hammers, nor do I know where it is(northern California, that's it), and I don't have any plans to visit it in the near future, but I think it shoud remain open, and in the hands of the public. The military has many other locations that they can train on, hell, if I had 1,000 acres to spare, I'd let em train on that, but being that i"m probably only a few hundred miles away from this, it affects me. What is wrong with using a closed military base for training purposes? __________________ 1994 Toyota 4Runner SR5 4X4 213,000 miles and counting 3.0 V6, 5 speed 10/15 MPG city/hwy(with 33's) Current Mods Headers, 2.5" Flowmaster custom exhaust, K&N FIPK KC Daylighter 100 Watt lights Ranchos x4, 2" Lift Downey coils 33-12.50 M/T's, 1" t-bar lift, 1" body lift Tow pkg w/ lighthookups Silverstar Headlights, Pioneer Deck w/XM Brushguard 250Watt JLAudio 8" W3 Sub Future Mods 12V Aux outlet-400/800peak inverter roof basket/lights Air locker 4.88 gears H.O. Alternator

03-07-2008, 08:16 AM	#7 (permalink)
JohnnyRanger54 Registered User Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Grants Pass Oregon Posts: 275	we have enough training grounds in the south and south east parts of the US... __________________ 1988 4Runner, 3.Slow, 5 spd.... not stock.... I have 2 sets of BFG AT's 33x12.5x15 Brand New.. 660 per set.. Oh yeah http://http://www.geocities.com/serioustoys/home.html

03-07-2008, 12:59 PM	#9 (permalink)
187proof Registered User Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: N. California Posts: 79	I too think the military deserves the best training BUT there are plenty of places that can expand to that doesnt involve getting rid of places like JV. I dont have the exact quote on me but from the USMC's plan on their website, the expansion is to allow 3 battalions 36 hours of training as opposed to 2 battalions 28 hours of training (what they currently have). Johnson Valley is located in Southern California and is largely renowned as the most hardcore/extreme trail on the West Coast. Thank you everyone who will participate. It will be a long time before I have the time nor the money to take a trip down to JV, but I hope when that time comes the Hammers will still be there. __________________ 1985 EFI SR5 4Runner

03-08-2008, 07:25 AM	#12 (permalink)
BLKNBLU Registered User Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Gilbert, Arizona Posts: 1,667	I especially like this part: Why am I doing this if I have never been to the Hammers? During the ELDO fiasco last summer, I asked for help in chit-chat. People asked me, “Why should we help you guys? Where were YOU when OUR trails were being closed?” After I though about it, they were right. Where was I? It seems that we only fight for our own backyards. Not anymore. I promised the PBB in that thread I would fight route closures EVERYWHERE. So I am. ...and he is right. We all need to start thinking in terms of the whole community, not just our own immediate, local concerns. __________________ 86 4Runner, custom Sonoran Steel rear bumper, 4Crawler 1" body lift, rock sliders from Richard Stubbs, rear Lockright, SAS w/ARB My build thread. http://www.yotatech.com/f66/blknblu-s-sac-155872/

03-09-2008, 12:06 AM	#14 (permalink)
ozziesironmanoffroad Registered User Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Spring Valley, CA Posts: 5,676	regretfully i cannot make it, due to work, but theyd better not close that trail. and for TRAINING purposes? they have ENOUGH 'training terrain' in NEVADA!!! its hard to find a place to 4x4 out here due to the thiefment taking everything for itself. i mean hell most of nevada that isnt populated is owned by the military.. sucks __________________ The 22r series engines are made from the fires of hell, and will fight tooth and nail to not be sent back. 1988 Toyota P/U 4x4 22re, 1200 miles on the rebuild engine builder .268 cam pioneer CD deck 31x10.50x15 BFG A/T BAJA 100W lights on prerunner bumper KC Daylighters 100W rancho rs5000 MUD IS A VALID PAINT JOB! If not living life to the fullest, why live it? my trucks official buildup thread

03-09-2008, 07:52 PM	#15 (permalink)
NPE701 Registered User Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Calgary, AB Posts: 96	I don't understand.. what happened to "Support our troops"??! __________________ 1998 4Runner SR5 TJM T15 BFG MT IPF CB OME SW OMFG CDROM ABS MDF WTF Umm... yeah!

03-11-2008, 01:28 AM	#16 (permalink)
drew303 Registered User Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Olympia, WA Posts: 2,033	before 9/11 you COULD 4x4 on Ft. Lewis.. not the restricted parts but they have A LOT of land dedicated to Ft. Lewis and you can NO LONGER mess around out there. You cant go play on the forest roads and WAVE and bs with the troops. now you get arrested and fined hardcore. SAD to say the least, it irrates the $^$%&^%$#%*U@#$$#@$#$% out of me to no end but thats the price we pay for others #%%$%^&$%%$ ups. ie terrorist. The people who trash the remaining trails and areas we are allow to play also SUCK and if i caught someone dumping trash on one my trials id probably be in jail for murder.. if they found the body. It sickens me. I cant make the rally that pisses me off to cuz i work. If I someonhow get there when it goes down i will post. It's already hard enough to find good places to wheel here. To take our woods away anywhere agravates me. __________________ 1987 Pickup, single cab, 22R, new head, 260 cam TG 3" SAS, rear disc brakes, chromoly rear axles, Chromoly Birfs, Tcase brake, 37x12.50R15 MT/Rs, 5.29 gears, rear Aussie Locker, front Detroit Truetrac.

03-11-2008, 07:44 AM	#18 (permalink)
Ricer-X Registered User Join Date: May 2007 Location: houston, tx Posts: 122	im an admin over on clubxterra.org we are lending our support im gonna push for our sister sites (clubtitan/frontier/armada to join and help too) i only wish i had seen this earlier than today! __________________ 89 4x4 4runner; 3.0 5psd topless 2 seater on 33x13.5 LTBs on black 15x10 procomp series 51, aisin manual hubs, custom snorkel, 3" BL , 1.5" SL 04 4x2 xterra 3.5" daystar lift, .5" ball joint spacers, SAW Tbars, bilstien HD shocks, hoohaa steering, idler arm brace, 1.5"wheel spacers

03-12-2008, 12:36 PM	#20 (permalink)
YeloSub7 Contributing Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 897	tow this behind my runner and fight BACK! __________________ -Jake 1990 4Runner <> 1990 Toyota 4Runner-22RE-5 speed-TG 3" front/4" rear-35" BFG M/T-4.88's-rear LSD-front TruTrac-MC Rear Bumper-TG DOM Sliders-TG Front Bumper SAS Build-Up Old Rigs: '85 4Runner (RIP) '95 4Runner (sold)

03-12-2008, 12:54 PM	#21 (permalink)
infiltrator Registered User Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Valencia, California Posts: 1,307	Well, today is the rally. I hope everything goes well. Why can't the military use the area for a couple weeks and give it back? That would be fair to all wouldn't it? Maybe we can get them to "Tread lightly" __________________ Old Rig: '95 4runner \| White \| ISR \| 193,000mi. \| Totalled.

03-12-2008, 03:00 PM	#22 (permalink)
Tankota Registered User Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Reseda, CA Posts: 10	The rally is on right now! Until 6pm PST.. Post up people! I've got post #178, now get over there! http://www.pirate4x4.com/forum/showthread.php?t=664629 This is your chance to speak up for your wheeling lands, no mater where you live. __________________ David Hale 2007 Sun Fusion FJ Cruiser - Project T2 Demello Sliders, Donahoe Front coilovers, Deaver Rear 2.5 Coils and rear Bilstein 7100 shocks, All Pro HD rear links, 34" Goodyear MT/R's, Bandi Mount, Demello front bumper w/winch, Demello Front Skid plate, 4x150W roof mounted KC's and safari lights, ATRAC-Hack. 2007 Yamaha Grizzly 700fi 4x4 2007 Yaris S-Sedan (DD) http://www.offroadingadventures.com TTORA-Socal member #38 Trail Crew Member

03-12-2008, 03:40 PM	#23 (permalink)
*Corey* Co-Founder/Administrator Staff Join Date: May 2002 Location: Auburn, Washington Posts: 26,071	Post #705 reporting in. __________________ Corey 2007 FJ Cruiser Built for 4wheelin', expedition, camping, and overlanding use PNW FJ Cruisers ☺ Detailing 101 ☺ Join Topsites ☺ Muffler Comparisons ☺ Maggiolinas In The Wild FJ Cruiser Buildup ☺ New Roof Top Tent ☺ Video Of My Penthouse Part II ☺ Rehinge Your ARB/Engel Fridge Blog About Roof Top Tents ☺ FJC Magazines Online Review Of My Tent ☺ 2009 Specialized Rockhopper Pro

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