frozenSurf

I'm running an 1986 4runner with stock suspension (procomp shocks) and tires (235/75). I do a lot of driving on rough gravel logging roads in the mountains. What tires and or lift will give me the smoothest ride in these kind of conditions? I don't do any heavy off-roading, rock crwling or jumping, just looking for a super-smooth ride on the washboard. Any suggestions would be great!

cheers,
Jeff

1986 Hilux Surf Turbo diesel
3" intake
2.5" exhaust
Intercooled
Manual boost controled
Running on B100 & WVO

jagger_snitt

For your needs,I'd upgrade my shocks and run a small body lift. I'd run 31's,32's or 33's depending on the look you want(personally 33's).For what you described, you might want to put some 32's on and no lift. You could also look into air ride suspension for the rear. The cheapest route would be new shocks.
Hope this helps.

hud

Aside from the high-dollar desert racing coilover kits, you need some soft springs with good shocks.

For the front, you could install ball joint spacers, then UN-crank the torsions bars to get a softer ride.

I think the old 4runners still had leaves in the back, so I would get some l-o-n-g-e-r springs, like off a 1/2 ton full size (pull a leaf from the pack), or a custom pack from Deaver.

Good shocks all around goes without saying. I'd stay with a 31" tire, unless you want to regear. You could run at a slightly lower pressure to soften the ride, but be careful with that, you don't want to blow a bead, or excessively roll the tire casing under hard cornering.


...oh yeah, since you've got a surf instead of a 4Runner, those still had solid front axles, right? In that case, just follow the recipe for the rear. Longer springs. Rears up front work ok, or get a custom pack. You might want to consider cross-over steering to replace the stock push-pull setup. It will hold up better, and give less feedback over the bumps.

Rears up front, and fullsize 1/2 tons are going to lift your truck slightly, but you could work around it with modifications at the hangers.

Soft springs will smooth the ride, but will sag pretty bad if you need to haul loads. A work-around would be to get some sort of airbag setup to support the load only when you need to.

tacoma728

upgrade shocks, but other than that, get used to a rough ride. Road and off road ride quality doesn't bother me in the least. I actually like the rough ride.

thook

My driveway IS an old logging road. There are a few things I've found that help the most. Lift isn't one of them, and neither is tire size. The condition of your springs and bushings make the most difference (and shocks, of course). Are yours sagging in the rear or front..... near or even on the overload springs? If so, you can give up trying anything else until you've fixed it with say an add-a-leaf or new springs altogether. I'd suggest rearching, but that doesn't last long on these gravel roads.

Once the leafs are good, then softer shocks. I run Pro-Comp 9000 on my '86. They're a bit stiff, but I haul weight all the time so I need something heavy duty. Plus, with weight the ride is smoother.

Deflating your tires even only 5psi would help tremendously. If you have nice, heavy-duty sidewalls there's not much danger in compromising your tire safety, but it may cut your mileage a bit and tire life. I keep mine even all around at 35psi so my tires last longer and I get better mileage, but I've experimented with less and it made a lot of difference.

Another thing, a couple of sand bags in the back.....around 100-200lbs....make a very big difference. Again, smoother ride...you'd be surprised.

Lastly, the only other option is to, of course, slow down....lol.

MudHippy

For conquering the infamous "washboard" at high speeds I like to have(for my 88 long bed pickup):

1) Bigger tires=smaller rocks, commonly known. But, bigger tires also=smaller potholes and/or smaller ribs on the "washboard". So with that in mind, the largest tires you can fit, for me 35's. Don't over-inflate, letting out 5 psi(or more)from what you run on the street is a good move. I do this to minimize punctures, not necessarily through the sidewalls(though I've had it occur)but mainly through the tread(or lack there of). This allows the tire to absorb more of an impact before letting sharp objects peirce the carcass. Almost forgot, BIAS PLY helps alot there too, stronger construction and ride is fine for mostly non-paved/uneven surfaces. Radial is alright, just of no real benefit and certainly more prone to puncture.

2)Lift to accomodate tires. Not really needed for suspension travel on even the worst gravel roads, but doesn't really hurt much if not exessive. Body lift raises your center of gravity less than suspension lift, therefor handling suffers less.

3)Good shocks, 'nuff said there.

4)As close to stock stiffness springs, or softer, as you can get. Shocks won't be as effective with really stiff springs. Rubber leaf spring bushings might ride a tad softer, but won't survive the punishment as long as polyurethane. I didn't notice that much more roughness in the ride when I went to the poly's. And it improved handling so much I couldn't care less anyway.

I routinely travel the worst potholed, "washboard", gravel logging roads we have in Oregon. I do so at speeds nearing 60+ miles per hour whenever possible. So I definetly know what works best for me. Makes me appreciate IFS, and a long wheelbase too. Not much you can do there though if that's not the vehicle you bought.

ewong

off the cuff - an 86 4Runner probably has skagged out rear springs.

Does it BOTTOM now?

shocks first
new rear springs
should get you ALOT.

If you drive "fast" in the washboads - Id suggest Bilstiens. But if you drive slow they are kinda "harsh" (they work better for speed hits than slow hits)

frozenSurf

Thanks for all the replies! As far as it goes, this truck hasn't had much that has been left stock. Is there any options in between the full on long travel kits & leaving things stock? HOw much does one of these long travel kits REALLY cost if I put it in myself? HOw about the longer rear springs? Is it really worth all the effort? ANd lastly, tires; which ride the smoothest? I'm not doing any mudding, so no worries if it's just an all terrain.

Cheers,
Jeff

CoedNaked

The stock shocks on these trucks, coupled with newer or in good shape stock springs or some softer/well articulating aftermarket springs will work very well on washboard type roads. Remember that these trucks were built when Toyota thought of them as a 4x4 first and not some people mover or pavement princess. They are built for roads less travelled. The only reason I run bilsteins is for improved onroad handling, and they are good offroad, but you do get more feedback from them because they slam the tires down a little harder. For pure comfort you can't beat the stock shocks on these things.

deathrunner

My truck is pretty smooth on gravel roads.

Longer springs DO make a difference.
The way you mount your springs DOES make a difference.

The long travel kits costs are depndant on your needs.

You could probably find a used Total Chaos balljoint kit for a couple hundred.
Get some thick torsions cheap. You'll need to acquire and weld on some decnet shock hoops. Unless you want the cheap downey hoops.

Are you going to run fenders? 250+ for a pair of fenders.
Or ar eyou going to cut and bend your stock fenders.

You can drop coin on some 3" diameter bypass shocks w resevoirs, or you can run a pair of doetsche tech shocks.

Are you planning to keep 4x4? That adds a but for t-100 axles.

That's pretty much what goes into a long travel front end.

As far as tires, if it sees alot of highway.... All terrains are the only way to.
go. I haven't driven many truck tires that couldn't handle gravel. BFG AT's or Procomp AT's, GoodYear Wrangler ATS.

Just don't get stuck down the mod tunnel. Up until a month ago, I thought the Deathrunner's ride was rough. Then I drove our new 3rd gen. Wow, Long Travel really does make a huge difference.

deathrunner

Amen, Brother.

frozenSurf

Too funny. I got caught going down that ugly mod tunnel a long time ago!

I think my wife is ready to kill me.

Replacing the fenders is not a problem & the Total Chaos balljoint kit is looking pretty good. (know of anybody with one for sale?)

I'm finding the ride in the rear to be pretty good, I have a 15 Gal aux tank in the back & I usually have 2-4 big DH mountain bikes hanging off the rear as well. Do I need to do a rear spring upgrade if I go with a long travel front end? I was thinking of just doing the shocks & adding air bags in the rear.

Again, thanks for all the help.

-jeff

deathrunner

I found that upgrading the front just pointed out how incapable the rear really was. The trick is having it balanced, so it really depends on how you set the front and what you are doing with it.

frozenSurf

Maybe I'll just start out with ball joint spacers, crank down the torsion bars, new shocks & tires, and go from there. If that doesn't do it, I'll jump right into the full front & back long travel. It's not like these projects ever happen overnight & cost less than you expect!

cheers,
jeff

frozenSurf

On that note. Where to buy ball joint spacers, (new torsion bars?) and shocks?

-j

chimmike

smooth ride on washboard will lead you to easy loss of control=crash.

frozenSurf

Wow Chimmike! Thanks for the wise words of encouragement. Your contribution has added depth to my perspectives in suspension technology.

-j

chimmike

thanks.

well, think about it. A smooth ride does not mean the tires will maintain full contact with the road surface. A smooth ride means the suspension generally transitions and responds more slowly to bumps, has softer spring rates, etc., which all lend to traits that keep tires from maintaining full contact with the road surface, which in your case will likely lead to loss of control. If anything, try decreasing your tire pressure a little bit.

btw, your sarcasm isn't necessary, newbie. Washboard is washboard. I suggest you try to get used to it, or buy a cadillac or something.

chimmike

try some of the vendors of the site? Or sdori, etc?

There are lots of resources here, search and you shall find

ewong

IMHO

in this order

SHOCKS
tires
fix rear sag

Skip the BJ spacer unless you need the ground clearance.

Build up step by step
better on your wallet AND the S.O.

---

Driving "fast" on washboard requires a VERY DIFFERENT kind of suspension than "rock crawling".
In fact - the ideal suspension for fast wash boradring (or pre-running) is VERY STIFF compared to stock. It will be BUMPY at slower speeds byt controlable at faster speeds..

TANSTAAFL