Good Times

Anyone have any experience in this arena? though I already have a garmin quest, I'm looking for a more advanced gps system that I can use for my expeditions. The quest will be demoted but still be used as a secondary device. Basically going to be looking at using the good ol maps + gps laptop + quest. Figure this should cover all of my bases outside of going old fashion w/ the compass and sundial

Based on the weeks of reading, this is what I've found so far:
Panasonic Toughbook CF-18,19,28,29
Itronix ix250,260 (hp nr3600)
Getac (looks to be very pricey on ebay)

What I want / to do:
GPS navigation
MP3 tunes!
DVD movies!

GPS Software I'm looking into:
Topo Fusion
Ozi Explorer
Google Earth
Delorme Topo USA
Other suggestions?

touch screen is a must!
backlit keyboard is good too!
bluetooth/usb2.0 would be nice too!

This laptop will be mounted either by the ram mount or similar type and must handle the rugged terrain. Mounting hardware and laptop must survive the wheeling abuse that it'll experience. Size and weight will be critical as if the screen is too big it may interefere the driver and/or navigator. I have already factored that I will need a screen mount/holder so it doesn't move as I wheel.

Mounting vendors:
Ram Mount
Ram Mount Ram Pod III
Jotto Desk

I did consider a carputer (or similar form) but came to a conclusion that having a laptop that I can disconnect and configure some way points for the next day away from the 4runner would be a big plus. There are some concerns w/ the rugged terrain on the carputer so that's more food for thought. Dust will be very excessive so the equipment must be very durable.

Would like some input on what kind of laptop used in relationship to the type of exploration trails encountered. Speed on the laptop when using gps software will be key as well since I don't want a slow working computer.

Thoughts, suggestions?

edit:
If I don't go this route I'm looking at the following gps units:
Garmin 276c
Lowrance iWay 500c/600c (unit comes w/ HD which is concerning due to the vibration from the vehicle in offroad terrains)
Lowrance Baja 480c
...

it's madness!

glenyoshida

I tried National Geographic Topo 4.0. and updated to 4.2.7 but was never able to get it to work with my USB NMEA Holux GPS Mouse. The maps are the best I've found but I talked to tech support at NGEO and found out that of the three GPS mouse receivers that I tried none of them work with the NGEO software. They seem to work fine with the handhelds but not the GPS mice.

Currently I use StreetWizard for the GPS live tracking and then the NGEO topo map software with paper maps to reality check. I sure would like an all in one as well.

I have a laptop in my 4runner and used 1 inch copper pipe and 1/4 inch plywood for the tabletop. I used a Mapp gas torch to connect the pipe just like you would working on your water pipes in the house. It attaches to the front bolts holding the seat and extends to the front of the truck for a third point to rests on the floor. It's high enough to have a passenger, allows the glove box to be opened, and with my laptop does not obstruct the view out the windows. If I were to make another one I'd make it one inch higher. I must have measured wrong and when shifting into 5th gear it rubs the bottom of the laptop table. One nice thing is that it requires no drilling or cutting in to the 4runner. I think my total cost was about 30 bucks or so. By the way the sketch is just that so I don't think the measurements are dead on. Sorry I don't have photos. My 4runner's getting worked on. New idle arm, wheel bearings, Clutch and O-ring seals on the power steering.

I've only heard good things about the Panasonic Tough Books (except for the price). The cops around here use them and the ones I've talked to like 'em. I heard a nice story on NPR, where if I remember right, the reporter actually ran over it with a car, had her kids jump on the keyboards, and pour soda on to it and it still worked.

li_runner

An option could be to use a laptop as a carputer.

Meaning, that you could have the laptop mounted somewhere out of the way, and then use a docking station, and hook up a touchscreen monitor in the front. Almost the same as a dedicated carputer, but you could take the laptop with you at any point.

This would free up some room in the front for passengers. I'm not sure if you are looking to have mounts that disconnect but even if you do what do you do with the wires every time you take the mount out.

I toyed with the idea of using a laptop as you are, but in trying it realized that controling it in that area while driving was downright dangerous, this though was before there were tablets with touchscreens. I ended up going dedicated carputer w/touchscreen monitor @ the time it was the best option.

Mickdady

I just use a regular Dell laptop and a collapsable laptop support I got at a police auction. It came out of a patrol car and it folds down on the side of the seat like those desk you used in college. I also have it wired to a docking station that plugs into my inverter.

I used the Ozi software and the Delorme software (topo USA or something like that) for the Nevada trophy series. I like Ozi but it isn't as easy to use as the Delorme stuff. The Delorme stuff came on 2 dvds which I loaded onto my laptop and I now have the entire US including most trails at my fingertips.

For me the touch screen would never work due to bouncing around in a truck but while your stopped it may work. Also, a track ball mouse is a must. It lets the navigator scroll while driving without getting bumped and accidentally closing a window.

Good Times

Great responses!

Making a home made mount has made me think but I'm not sure how well it's going to hold up on the trails. Since it'll be mixed terrain I need to ensure that the mount won't break and become a projectile. I'm still considering this as those links for the mounts I've posted are $$$. On the flip side I did read that many owners have said that making something on their own would be very difficult (in terms of strength and mobility of the mount itself).

The carputer concept using the laptop does give me some ideas but I know going that route will really take a toll on the wallet. I figure the laptop and mount will be expensive as it is. Most of the navigating will be done by the copilot so I won't be directly interfacing w/ the laptop.

Mike, how accurate was the delorme's map for the Nevada race? I'm curious to see how effective it was since that event definitely interests me. I've read that their maps are not up to date so hence the concern. good call on the trackball! I didn't even think about that one.

Mickdady

The funny thing was our partner team spent about $500 for some new maps from some "secret" source that was supposedly the most up to date. It was wrong 40% of the time while my $100 delorme setup was only wrong once! I couldn't have been happier!

Do you have any interest in doing a similiar event in AZ this fall? We may be looking for a partner.

calrockx

Interested in seeing how this turns out.

I know the goal of this project isn't so much a carputer ,but this forum might have some helpful anyway - http://www.mp3car.com/vbulletin/
(got me intersted in such a thing now haha)

Bighead

Take a look at this: New Portable Computer and GPS System (from IH8Mud)

It's a different option than what you stated in your first post but appears to meet all the requirements you set.

anomad

I work as a Geographic Information Systems (GIS) and GPS Specialist to support my hobbies.

At work we use standard Dell or IBM laptops (luck of the bid) with expensive ESRI software called ArcMap. This software allows you to load background images such as topo maps, aerial photography, and other data such as roads, land owndership, and whatever else so see exactly where you are and on whose land.

There are a number of Jotto desks in use but the 3/4 ton trucks pounding desert roads are not good for hard drives. There are more stable mounts but I don't know brands. Some guys are happy attaching they laptop to some kind of center console with velcro.

I have used Ozi Explorer and Topo in the field, both are good.
AccuGlobe is a great free GIS program with a 20 dollar GPS extension
Manifold is a low cost GIS program that is also worth looking into

For around town microshaft streets and trips is fine.
The software that comes with Garmin Navigation units (like the GPS 18) is fine too. But these programs stop displaying data as soon as you leave the pavement.



BTW: plugging a laptop into your rigs stereo and curling up in the back with some beers and a good DVD is a great way to spend a crummy weather evening in camp.

glenyoshida

Did you end up making a decision? I tried using the Topofusion a few times but found that the connection to download and save to the hard drive was too slow to be practical. I tried downloading The state of Colorado and after 3 days of downloading on a DSL connection I think it was at about 2 percent or so. I also had some trouble on two different PCs with an error message saying that the tiles wouldn't load because my color bitrate might be at an incompatible setting but I checked on both and they were OK.

I still like the National Geographic Topo 4.0 series the most from what I've looked at. I did also find out that there is a GPS mouse that will work with NGEO Topo 4.0 with a software program called GpsGate. GpsGate allows one GPS source to be used in multiple mapping programs.

Good Times

I'm heavily leaning towards the laptop solution. I have an old hand me down laptop so I'm going to give this a try and see if it works the way I envision it. I've downloaded Topofusion too and am in the middle of downloading maps of socal. It's taking a long time but considering it's free I'm giving it my all and download the maps. Hopefully it won't be that bad

I may end up just picking up the delorme topo usa and the city streets map as it looks to be pretty good. I'm also considering trying ozi and ms streets. we'll see.

Gotta find me a cheap usb gps unit to plug into the laptop so that's my next goal.

4x4Lamm

I can vouch for the Panasonics. Many of teh fire depts. and ambulances around here have them on the units and they are tough as nails.

They can even stop a bullet!

Lamm

glenyoshida

I've got a second GPS mouse you can try out for a while if you like. It's a Holux just like the one I normally use. I think I paid about $40 for it maybe $50 with shipping I can't quite remember. If you end up wanting to keep it just throw me $20 or so otherwise mail it back. That'll give you a chance to try out the laptop with a GPS mouse that has decent sensitivity. Hopefully it will also help you decide on if it is going to work out for you before you drop the bucks on a setup.

I'm looking to get one or two more software maps. It seems like no one map has it all. Often times I'll look at one map and then verify with a second to find out that one has more information that the other didn't. Even though I already use StreetWizard and NGEO Topo 4.0 I still find myself looking at my both of my map books.

I'd send you a DVD of all seven NGEO CDs to check out too but I only have a license key for Colorado. If you do plan on a trip to Colorado or want to have it for the CO4RJ let me know I'd be happy to mail you a copy.

Glen

glenyoshida

Were you able to complete the Topofusion download for SoCal?

jrallan26

Good Times,

If you are looking for a mount for your laptop. Do a search for Ram Mounts. These are very sturdy mounts. I just installed a mount for my Garmin GPS. Very solid.

Try gomobile.com

glenyoshida

Update on National Geographic Topo 4.0 on an laptop with a GPS mouse:

After making many, many unsuccessful attempts to get a Holux GM-210 USB GPS Mouse or a Holux GM-307 USB GPS mouse to work I ended up buying the GlobalSat BU-353 USB GPS mouse. At least there is at least one GPS mouse that works with National Geographic Topo 4.0.

In case you want to get NEGO TOPO 4.0 to work with the BU-353 on a laptop this might help:

If you are running Windows XP: On your Laptop Under control panel, System, Hardware, Device Manager, Ports (Com & LPT) lists the COM port that your USB Mouse is connected to (You will have to have your USB Mouse plugged in to have the port be detected). In my case it was COM 4.





In Franson GpsGate under settings there are three tabs Input, Output, and Advanced.

If you do not have GpsGate you can get it here:

http://franson.com/gpsgate/

Franson has a 14 day free trial to test before buying.

Under the input tab: set the input COM Port to the same port that you just found under the device manager. In my case it was COM 4.

Under the Output tab: Add a Virtual COM to the active output. In my case I randomly added Virtual COM8

I didn't change anything under the Advanced Tab.




In National Geographic Topo 4.0 (updated to 4.2.7 as of 03/02/2007) under Handhelds, Change GPS Settings, look for Receiver Type and Connection Settings.

Receiver Type, change the Make to NMEA ($GPGGA), Model (Not Applicable)

Under the Connection Settings: Connection Type Serial Port, Serial Port Settings change the COM Port to the same as the output in Gps Gate (In my case it's COM Port 8), Baud Rate 9600.

If you click on Test GPS Connection you will get the message "Selected receiver can't be tested but may still work."

Click OK to close the dialog window.

I really like the NGEO Topo maps they are accurate and detailed.

Erich_870

Great info Glen!

Do you think this setup will work with the basic $20 Google Earth download instead of National Geographic Topo?

GPSGate sounds like it really fills a niche market

Erich

glenyoshida

I'm not sure. If Google allows the map info to be downloaded and saved to a hard drive then I'd be all over it. I don't think Google will let you do that though. If you know otherwise I'd really like to know!

Maybe Lance will chime in and let us know what he found.

BTW I've been using NGEO Topo with Street Wizard for a couple of months and really like it. It's a major benefit to have multiple maps because maps often choose different names for the same street depending on who made the map. What I don't find on one map I often can find on a 2nd or 3rd.

Erich_870

Glenyoshida,

Does NGEO Topo have Canada in it? I have a trip planned to go up to Whitehorse, Yukon, but I can't tell if they cover Canada.

Erich

glenyoshida

Hi Erich,

Sorry for the slow reply. I'm not receiving notifications of new posts. I must have changed a setting without knowing it or something.

As far as I know National Geographic does not have the Topo software available for Canada.