jimbo74

thats why the system is so screwed up now.... people thinking exactly that way... truth of the matter is, you drive as a priviledge, it isnt a right... you mess up, they take it back....

bulldog-yota

Hi Peter, I agree with your point of not waisting officers' time. I think various counties in CA has a shortage of CHP or locals. The problem however is that there is two sides to a story, it is in the officer's discretion to give you a ticket or not. I feel outdone by the fact that I recieved 2 tickets over a 2 year period doing 80 on the highway market 65, it had at least 3 lanes going each way in the middle of the day with little traffic on it. One was Nor Cali and one South Cali, neither time did the officer (one was female and one male) even consider giving me just a warning. Just pulled out the book and wrote me up. Ironically both times I was distracted by setting up the GPS (OK know I shouldn't do it while driving). Now they could have easily just gave me a warning with exactly the same effect on me.

Now on the I5 between the Bay Area and LA looks like a racetrack with people doing over 100 MPH while it is busy and swerving through the 2 lane traffic, and I have only seen 2 people getting a ticket there. Yet on the 101 just south of San Jose I see people getting tickets on a far more regular basis, and the normal speed is 75-80.

So my point is that it is a 2 way street , officers need to apply more discretion and people need to own up if they overstep. This way the courts will be less busy and cops able to do more patrol time.

Tacoma Dude

Bulldog, Christian:

I should amend my original statement.
If you were obviously breaking the law and you were not being "picked on" then yes, I believe you're attempting to take advantage of the "system" to get off something you got caught doing.
HOWEVER, if you feel that you were unjustly singled out or circumstances were unavoidable - yes, you should feel free to exercise your right to contest the citation.

In my case, my 1st speeding ticket in I don't know how many years came because I got caught by a radar going 50 in a 35 zone while driving my dad's V8 (man, you can get going before you realize it!). People normally travel 45 through the area but because of rampant speeding down the street the community asked the local Sheriff's Office to patrol the area. I got caught and wasn't unjustly picked on.
I can't say that I'm happy I got the citation but the officer was polite and considerate. I broke the law and paid the price. No sense in tying up the courts and wasting the cop's time.

rimpainter.com

Peter -

My point is that the technicality should not be available in the first place. If a ticket doesn't get filled out correctly, or is not submitted in a required time frame - is that my problem? And is it my problem that I chose to get a traffic lawyer because I did not want to go to court, I was young and didnt know better, and the lawyer happen to get me out of the ticket - yes on a technicality - but legally mind you?

I understand the "tying up the officer" thing. I really do. And that sucks. But let's get to the heart of the problem. The problem is that the system allows for too much leniency in the wrong areas, and people are not doing their jobs.

Am I going to go out and become a "lawmaker" because of this? No. If that was the requirement for every breakdown in every system, I would be in school for the rest of my life.

PirateFins

I'm surprised the normal cop bashing crew have'nt put their $.02 in yet.

Where did you get the ticket? Was it in WV, MD, PA, DE, NJ?
If it wasn't in MD pay it. Why waste your time, gas, court cost, and the price of maybe having to still pay the fine + all of the gov. cost on the other side.
If it was in MD (I assume that is where you are licensed), go to court ask for PBJ (probation before judgement), if not ask to pay the fine and court cost, but not to get any points on your record.

I just got a ticket the week before this past Christmas. Told the Trooper my spedo is off due to the larger tires (which it is), apologized for speeding. He wrote me up for 55 in a 40 (instead of 63). Went to court, pleaded quilty with an explination. Told the judge exactly the same thing. He brought it down to 45 in a 40 + court cost + no points. I thanked him and went on my way.

Tacoma Dude

I'm afraid I don't understand the debate - sounds like we're on the same side here?

jimbo74

i totally bash cops everytime i get.... however some cops are jsut out doing their job..... and when i get caught, yeah im pissed but just think about how many times i knowingly break the law and dont get caught..... its a statistic that every driver commits at least 2 violations per mile ever driven..... thats a lot i havent gotten nailed for!

rimpainter.com

Peter -

You know we are on the same side. But I am attacking this from a different direction, and somewhat defending my previous actions. All I am saying is eliminate the problems with the system (most of them anyway) and you will virtually eliminate the possibility of the ticket being dismissed based on a technicality. Get to the root cause of the officers submitting the ticket late, data errors, and administrative people not doing their job and the traffic lawyers will eventually be extinct. At the time I hired my traffic lawyer I could care less how he did it; I just wanted those tickets off my record. I paid him and a few weeks later he called me with the results. That was it. He stayed well within the boundaries set forth by the law and the courts.

Tacoma Dude

I would expect nothing less

I'm not condemning you or anyone else - it's just my personal stance on it since I have personally seen what goes on this side of the process. From the business/economics end, it is definitely smarter to contest the citations.

As for government employees not doing their job effectively, man tell me about it

wvuviv30

I ticket was issued in MD, my home state, just 2 hours away.

I was not driving my 4Runner. I was driving my g/f car ('01 Pontiac Grand Am GT) and taking her back to NJ.

When I was pleading my case to the cop (before issued the ticket), he said to save it for the Judge. He went to his car wrote the ticket, and told me to plead my case to a Judge or pay the fine and get the points.

I am not trying to plead my case on here, I am trying to find out information about taking a speeding ticket to court and what has happened to you.

PoBoy

Like I said above there are many different court systems. Best thing to do is to visit the court a couple weeks before hand and see how they do business. Some start you out with an informal hearing...some just take your plea then make you come back another day for your informal hearing. I usually dont waste my time in an informal hearing and request a formal one, however some courts are so small that they do not give Formal hearings for traffic offenses without an attorney present. Anyway, I think you'll find that formal hearings are the best place to plea your case...actually you probably wont plead anything to a judge though. Most formal hearings have a meeting with the DA before you see the judge. The DA may offer you some sort of deal...take it if it's good. I've only pleaded my case once in a formal hearing...but Ive taken deals at least 10 times from the DA. They are all about saving time and money. That judge gets paid about $400 an hour to sit on the bench and go through cases ------>>>>>>> WHich is why the court system LOVES attorneys for traffic tickets. It is all done by mail and wastes zero time of the court. Thus, it is very easy for an attorney to get the ticket off your record. They make the court money by getting you to pay the ticket and save it at the same time by keeping you from tying up a judge. My attorney doesnt set foot in the courtroom for most traffic violations...she does it all by mail or a simple phone call. Everyone wins...

I dont know about smaller cities, but all the ones Ive lived in the police officers pick one day a month that they spend in court. It is a rareity that they do not show up. NEVER count on that happening anymore. As a result of them picking one day a month...you arent wasting their time. They have to be there anyway...so atleast give them something to do CONTEST!

PirateFins

Ok I understand now.

Go to court, plead "quilty with an explanation". Explain to the judge that it was not your vehicle and you were not familiar with it, being your DD is a SUV. Apologize for speeding (because you were) and like I said before ask for PBJ (only works if you have not had a ticket before or your record is clean), or ask to pay the fine and court cost but not to get the points. Just remember they have heard it all, and they normaly are more forgiving if you just tell the truth and are willing to take some sort of punishment.

jacksonpt

OK... I'm not trying to be the resident ass here or anything but..

Did the car have a speedo? THEN DON'T SPEED IF YOU DON'T WANT A TICKET!!! I don't care if you're used to driving a school bus but on this one day you got a ferrari. Pay closer attention to the speedometer - it's not that difficult.

And I also don't buy all this talk about being unfairly picked on. Seems to me that if you break the law, get caught, and are issued a warning (instead of a ticket), YOU SHOULD BE GREATFUL. You caught a break and the officer was understanding/merciful/whatever. If you break the law, get caught, and are given a ticket, you are not being picked on, the system is doing it's 'job'. If a speeding ticket does not have any different affect on you than a warning does, then keep speeding. Eventually you'll get your liscense revoked and THAT will have an affect.

I don't mean to be an ass, and I'm not trying to pick on anyone specifically... but this whole issue really gets me worked up. IMO, society is in a decline because there is no accountability. And let's face it... accountability is at the heart of this thread. If you've got a legitimate justification (not an explanation, not an excuse) as to why you were speeding, go plead your case. Otherwise be a man and pay the fine/take the points.

OK... I'm done now - before I really piss someone off or get myself banned

caylorm

Well said, Jackson! The lack of personal responsibility is being well displayed in this thread. Pay the freakin ticket and quit whining! (Maybe you'll get enough points so that you won't be able to drive to vote for John ˟˟˟˟˟˟ Kerry)

PirateFins

What I am getting sick of is the holier than thou attitude of some. Everyone makes mistakes, no one is perfect. You can't sit there and make it sound like you never speed, or do anything wrong / break the law. You just don't get caught doing it, and that doesn't make it right.

You guy's must have missed his reply. He is not "whining" about anything. I take it as he is not familiar as to how the court system works.
That is what my previous post was about going to court and taking your punishment.
There is absolutly nothing wrong with going to court and trying to take some type of lesser punishment. You are still being punished, that is why the system is set up like that, you are given the chance to tell your side. Imagine if you didn't have that chance what life would be like, you wouldn't have a voice and possibly wouldn't "be able to drive to vote for John ˟˟˟˟˟˟ Kerry" or anyone else for that matter. If you just paid the ticket everytime you got one, your insurance goes up and up. If this is a one time event why should you be punished twice, once by the courts and then by the insurance.

jacksonpt

While I don't get that impression from this thread (or perhaps you're talking about me...), I just wanted to add this to put my comments in perspective.

I've received several tickets in my day, and I've paid every one of them. Sure, I gripe and bitch to myself, but I don't complain to the officer issuing the ticket (even the one who parked me in in my own driveway) or raise issue to a judge.

I broke the law, I deserve what I get. We're not talking rodney king here.

Tacoma Dude

While I agree with you and jacksonpt I have to say that I don't really think that it's "well displayed."
The guy is just looking to see what his options are - there have been other idiot "I just got a ticket from a pig that caught me going 85 in a 35," threads before. This is pretty tame - I don't think we really need to slam on this guy.

Tacoma Dude

Not too many people think like this anymore - I respect your self-morals and accountability.

jacksonpt

OK, good point. My first response to this thead was a direct response to the initial question. I didn't mean to "attack" or slam the guy, but I did mean to be short and blunt. To me, this is a very black and white situation. If he was in deed speeding, he should pay the ticket. Period, end of story (for me).

My second post was a bit more "fueled" if you will, but not directed at anyone in particular, rather stated as support for my view and an arguement against the whole "I'm not used to this car" and "I was unfairly picked on" points of view.

jacksonpt

Well, I kinda have to live this way, for a couple of reasons.

One, I have 2 younger brothers (20 and 23) and they are two of the most irresponsible/unaccountable people I know. I feel like I'm always preaching to them to grow up and take some accountability for their actions. I can't very well preach to them in one breath then turn around and try to weasel out of a traffic ticket.

Second, I'm inherently (sp?) pessimistic. As such, I don't like or trust the general public, i.e. society. Generally speaking, I don't like what it stands for, the direction it's going, or what what society considers the norms. I think the number one problem with people today is lack of accountability (with a lack of critical thinking skills a close second - too many lemmings these days). I'm not a tree hugger or out to change the world, but I am going to try to influence people I know to be more accountable.