Localmotion

There are very little things that are actually manufactured in America. The Jeep you will buy will have components from around the world. The clothing on your back is not made in America. I understand your pride, as I also have the same. Driving a domestic does not make you an American. The way you act and live your life is what makes you an American. The way you care for your family and abide by the laws that are put in place is what makes you an American.

sorry for the rant. Like I said, if owning a wrangler is your dream, who are we to crush it. Good luck!

bamachem

and a new Rubicon 4DR Unlimited is $31K when you add the power accessories and automatic transmission.

for that difference in price, you could have toyota rebuild your current engine, transmission, and transfer case, have any and every little thing fixed that may need attention, upgrade to 99+ headlights & Center Console, put on a ARB up front with Warn Winch and lighting, have a custom rear bumper built, have a sonoran steel suspension lift installed at a shop, put on some toyota 16x8 alloys and some nice 305's, put in some 4.88 gears and dual ARB's = all for about $16k. you couldn't sell your runner for more than $7K-8K, so you'd basically have a NEW 1996 4Runner set up for some serious offroading and still have about $8K to $10K in your pocket...

tc

SFA isn't any advantage for 99% of even US who 'wheel. Especially the stock Jeeps, even the Rubicons. They say they're D44's, but they're not really. Stock flex and tire size is rather sad compared to our trucks.

Your ROI on a front locker compared to the incremental monthly payment on the Jeep is probably less than a month.

Certainly, you can build a Jeep to be VERY capable for less than a Toyota, but stock out of the box, they're much more equal offroad than you would think...

Yota Tony

Coil sprung Jeeps aren't great for off road because it's costs a ÅÅÅÅ load to set them up right. Long arm suspension is expensive.
Plus the Dana 30/35 axles can't take the abuse, lock them and you'll either break shafts or ring gears.

I had a Jeep before my Toyota and I rather my Toyota. It will be a lot cheaper to build it to where I want.

Adam F

My buddy Josh sold his 4Runner to get a Jeep YJ. A year or 2 later he sold it and got a Land Cruiser. He said he wishes he never got rid of the 4Runner.

bob200587

I don't see how this incredible saftey gap is bridged by adding two doors to a Wrangler.

My 4runner is 103inches in wheelbase
a YJ or TJ is 93"
A new 07 Wrangler is 95"
and the unlimited or 4 door is 116"


having driven YJ's and TJs many a time, I can tell you that the 10" less in wheelbase doesn't have much affect, other than turning circle, which then is still minimal.

If I'm not mistaken 3rd gen 4runners have 105" wheelbase.

All I can say is that the suspension and steering on jeeps makes them feel much less stable and rougher riding than 4runners, not the difference in wheelbase, and I know that the TJs have shoulder belts in the rear. they YJs I don't think do, but regardless. I don't think getting a ugly 4 door wrangler and having the car payment is worth it. I'd buy a YJ as the leaf sprung suspension is much better and easier to lift IMO. Especially if you're going to not use it as a DD.

If you won't get a YJ do like andy said and put the money you'd spend on a rubicon into your 4runner. He's got the right idea!

keithguts

Stick with a toyota, Safety is in the yota.

slosurfer

The reason I brought up the wheelbase was for offroading purposes. There are a lot of trails out here in the Sierras where that wheelbase would be too long. 10" is a big difference on the trails. When I wheel with jeeps they usually have to take a different line than longer wheelbased rigs. Sometimes they have the advantage and other times the longer wheelbased rigs do. Rarely do the rigs with a longer wheelbase than the 4runners have the advantage. I just find it odd that jeep made it with such a long wheelbase, and it still doesn't have a big cargo area. Room for 4 with room for the gear of 2!

Stomis

Coming from someone that was a chevy person before his yota... Jeeps are absolute pieces of junk and a bigger death trap than the average car. We recently had a kid flip his jeep and grind half his skull off due to the lack of roof protection. My opinion that crysler products are short lived pieces of junk is pretty true. My dad had a neon with 160,000 on it and he had around $3000 in front end alone from 110,000-140,000. We also had a Seabring that had a tick in the motor had to sell that before it ÅÅÅÅ. Now we're working on an Intrepid with more frontend problems at 110,000. All miles are highway which imo is easy cruising on a vehicle vs stop and go. I think my families experience just says something about Crysler products.

Fink

Don't go with a Jeep man.

Find an old beater Yota (abused 2nd gen, abused 1st gen) and use it as a minor project rig to eventually teach your kids about them and maybe it could become a cool father-son or father-daughter thing.

Just a thought, I would stay as far away from Jeeps as possible.

I was driving past the Jeep dealership the other day and I swear my 4runner shut off and coasted with smoke pouring out of the hood while I was passing all those Jeeps, weird.

Fink

Yota Tony

Wow....just wow.

Jeeps aren't as bad as everyone is making them out to be. I used to wheel one and my GF still wheels a TJ. They are fine trail rigs but poor dual purpose rigs.

bob200587

It does make some difference on the trail, but like you say, the advantage is not always in the shorter's favor.

I also think it's dumb to have that much more length and very little extra cargo space. A YJ or TJ without a backseat has enough room for the gear for 2 people.

I honestly don't think that I've got enough room for 4 people's gear in my 4runner. I'd need a roof basket to really have ample room and still be able to see out the back window. It's still alot more than a jeep, even more than a XJ... I've considered getting one of those hitch mount baskets for the back of the runner, but I'm afraid that i'd hit stuff with it. It would be nice for trips, and alot cheaper than getting Yakima rails and a basket or cargo hold thing.

Stomis

Idk storage has never really made me think twice about buying a vehicle... Even on the trail I dont have that much interior storage with an ext cab let alone a standard. Cant wait to get a waterproff box or two with the flatbed.

bob200587

I would probably never buy a single cab truck. Not having but a few cubic inches behind the seats for storage doesn't appeal to me.

My Ranger has an ext. cab and that has plenty of room for me to carry most of what I need in a 2wd.

Our other truck has a tool box in the bed. That's nice to have.

the 4runner has plenty of room, and I can fold down one or both rear seats and have approx. 48 cu. ft of space that is protected from the elements and resistant to theft.

I usually keep one rear seat down and one up in case I need to carry a 3rd passenger. I rarely carry any.

allenr

I have been driving Jeeps for 35 years. I've driven mall criusers, Rock crawlers, and everything in between. I currently have a 2005 wrangler Willys edition and a 1974 CJ-5 and I loved them every one. I usually drive my 4runner(95) when I am with the family and my wrangler when I am not. My wife sometimes takes the wrangler to work. In the 20 years we have been married, she has driven all of my jeeps and loves them almost as much as I do. I think Toyotas are great but that don't make all other vehicles crap. Jeeps are supposed to ride rough and have wind noise. I have seen lots of people die in accidents but they were not all in jeeps; In fact most of them were in cars. BTW, my most capable off road vehicle was my 1990 OD green SamuraI locked front and rear with a GRSII tcase, revolver shackles and 33s and a few other goodies but it cost almost as much as my house. Allen