thook

You're not the first person to suggest that. And someone else even suggested just getting a reman'd motor. I'm not in to either idea. Number one, it would take a lot more time to find a used motor (much less in good shape) than it would be to rebuild mine. They aren't easy to find in my area. Number two, I know how used motors go. They almost always need work. And a reman'd, to me, is rediculous.....unless my motor is just trashed....because I'd come out ahead rebuilding mine financially. The machine work I'd have to pay for, but parts and assembly would all be done by me. In either case, it's not a consideration until I know total damage....which would have to be severe. Like a cracked block or something.

I got the head off today.....no rain! Ha! Even a bit of sunshine. I was elated. I inspected the cam, journals, valves, and rocker assembly. Everything looks perfect for the exception of the valves. From the impact marks on the cylinders and intake valves (noted by the carbon deposits knocked off), all four intake valves are bent. Probably because I tried starting it so many times...I don't know. And, I won't know what damage there is to the valve ports until the shop inspects. Unless the head has been cracked somehow, I'm going to have it refurbished to whatever degree necessary with new valves.....of course.

That raises a question....
I don't fully understand what is done to head in this case. I'm guessing the valve ports would be bored out? Much like a block would be in the case of installing new pistons and such? If so, would be possible or prudent to go with something like oversized valves or would that consitute having to do other things....like a larger cam and such? The cam, from what I can tell, is just fine. Being so, I will leave alone.

In addition to the head, I have the motor ready to be pulled, but the guys at the shop were too busy today to help me pull it. Either that, or they were too afraid to get out in the cold. Wimps ....lol. Anyway, the motor will have to come out next week and then I can look at the bottom end more closely.

Interesting tid bit...
The driver's side chain guide was loose. I believe I mentioned that already, and I believed it to be from wear. But NO! The fastener had backed out a bit causing the flop. Apparently, the fellow that I had replace the timing chain assembly when I first got the vehicle didn't tighten it down well enough. I can't imagine the guide flopping would interfere enough with the chain to cause it to jump, but....????

TORTIS

iTrader: (1)

progress. that is good. better break out the heaters gonna get really cold this weekend. i guess your are a little too busy to go trout fishing with me this weekend i don't mind standing around in 30 degree weather fishing, but work on my truck, don't think so. hats off to you for struggling with the weather. still subscribed

thook

Too busy is definitely the word for it. I still have to figure out why the 4wd isn't working the '92 amidst everything else. My wife reeeaaally wants her truck back! Wish I could go, though. I wouldn't fish, but I would watch and drink the beer. Life IS good!

Progress, indeed. I'm amazed how much wrenching is involved in this. By the time I got to the last few bolts (prepping for motor pull) I felt like throwing the wrenches out on the highway and watching as cars ground them into the blacktop. I'd probably felt different were it not for being at the top of a foothill where winds seem to have 100x's more bone chilling capacity. I've found more than a couple times the underneath of vehicles increases wind velocity. Someone needs to develop Gort-tex coveralls!!!

No more wrenching until next week, though. I have firewood to split and animal shelters and a wellhouse to fortify so no one or no thing freezes during this cold snap. Plus, the weekend arrives with the weekend job in town. Maybe by Sunday I will have imploded and business will be a none issue, though. In which case, look for me at the lake. I'll be somewhere out in the middle floating a canoe.

TORTIS

iTrader: (1)

cardboard makes a great wind break. cold air is denser, so you tend to feel it more.

thook

So does four walls......burrrrr. It's 28* today; a raging density issue.

I was wondering...
Anyone every heard of a starter seizing and momentarily seizing the motor up via the flywheel? I noticed yesterday that the motor side of the flywheel teeth appears to have worn from grinding. I don't recall them looking that way last Jan. when I replaced the clutch. The grinding is not terribly extreme and no teeth appear to be broken....though I've not seen the entire flywheel yet.

thook

Okaaay.....just got off the phone with Don Clarke. The starter theory is out. That couldn't happen. So, I mentioned the bolt backing out on the guide and he questioned the whereabouts of the second bolt. I said it simply wasn't there. So, guess what. It's looking the like the second bolt fell out of it's hole and into the chain/gear....if there is in fact a second bolt. I don't recall. Can anyone verify this? I won't actually know until I get the timing cover off, but that would explain it all. Hope it didn't munch the crank gear!

thook

Yep, there's a second bolt. Just looked the FSM blow out. You can see second bolt hole for the driver's side guide though the blow out doesn't actually show the bottom bolt. I think the mystery of the cause is solved. Now to fix it.

TORTIS

iTrader: (1)

darn skippy there is a second bolt. tip:thread locker on the timing chain guides bolts. that sucks matthew. never heard of one backing out before.

dcg9381

First I understand the budget issue. If you don't have it, you don't have it.

I didn't understand how donations for the animals meant money for the truck, though.. It's probably better that I don't understand.

At least have the bores checked. It's true that they could be fine and it's also true that they could be worn in the middle - it can go either way. By checking it you'll get some peace of mind and be able to make an educated decision. You can ask the best engine builders in the world for advice, but it's still better to check your core!

Last I checked, cylinder boring was around $20/cyl. IE - less than the cost of a cam on 4 cyl. I know this would add in the cost of new pistons, but you're talking under $300 for a complete rebuild kit (with pistons) from engnbdlr.
Under $500 is cheap for a rebuild.. :-)

It's true that some people just slap a new set of rings in there and go - I think most of that comes from the old pushrod V8 days. I've seen Chevy 305s run with cam lobes completely ground off. You'll also note that those motors don't typically make 200k miles like a 22R series.

Injectors, although ugly - usually don't come back clogged up in my experience. There are some exceptions of course. If I was on a budget, I'd skimp on the injector cleaning and apply that money to other things.

If you do get them cleaned, witchunter replaces all the rubber and pintle caps as part of his fee. It's generally a value over other cleaning services. The darn rubber gaskets at toyota will end up costing you a fortune if you go OEM.. I *think* they're included in engnbldr's kits though....


Cam hp: Dyno runs I've seen show peak hp improvement in the 3-5hp range. The good news is that you'll get that improvement across the RPM range with a good cam...

Good luck on your rebuild!

thook

Neither have I. I wished I'd known or thought to look for it when I had the valve cover off a little while go. I'm definitely using thread lock on the new timing set. And, of course, chase the threads.

Skippy? LOL! That's funny.....sport...hahaha!

TNRabbit

Hang in there, Matthew. I'm here for morale support if nothing else...you were there for me when I went thru all my with my 3vze last year....

I feel your pain about the cold (my knuckles ache from your description!); I HATE working on a vehicle when it's cold outside, unless I'm in a heated garage at the time....

You can clean the injectors out yourself with a length of rubber hose that fits over the top of the injector & some T/B cleaner. Fill the hose with the cleaner, apply pressure with a balloon blown up over the end of the hose, then apply 9 volt battery to the terminals of the injector in a "chattering" fashion (holding too long will burn up the injector electronics). This will run the cleaner thru injector and works great! Of course, it requires three hands... I blew into mine, but the balloon idea came later (tastes like HELL!)

Good Luck & clear/warm skies!

thook

In non-profit organizations....even small ones like ours....things like vehicles can be considered a business expense. That equates also to tax exemption. Money is money and it always comes. I trust that we're always provided for by the creator, universe, etc....whatever one wants to call It...but, I've also learned to be frugal, not wasteful, and spend unnecessarily. It's all energy exchange. Of course, I make mistakes, but I really try to be careful about it. We don't know when or where financial support will come from, so we still have to play the game of balance. If I can bypass something unneccessary I will and at the same not skimp/cut corners. That is possible, ya know. I mean, I've already had people suggesting an entirely different motor...used or new. Is that really necessary? No. Besides, if it's any indication, you can still clearly see the crosshatching on the cylinder walls.

The shop where my vehicle is at the moment....plus Don Clarke who's less than a mile from there....all have experience when it comes to blocks and what not. I'll have it checked from there.....for free. Honestly, when it comes down to it, we do what we have to do, but if don't HAVE to spend $300 more I won't just because someone's opinion says I SHOULD. $300 would help fund our Hawaii vacation, anyway.... (Ha....I've not had a vacation in almost ten years! And so what....)

After talking with the machine shop having explained everything going on....and getting best advice and possible scenarios....I'm looking at right around $240.75 minus tax. This is for complete bottom and top end gasket set (minus headbolts....reusing them, even after debating) plus all new valves and any head work. That even includes getting out the busted exhaust manifold stud. Not bad, eh? I'm going with their gasket set because they use Hasting's rings and Fel-Pro gaskets. I know there has been debate about Fel-Pro, but honestly this shop's reputation is equal to their quality of work. They did a fantastic job on the heads for my '92. If that's anything to go by, the parts they use would be trustworthy. They've never had problems with the Fel-Pro on the 22r's. (And neither has the shop where my truck is....nor Don Clarke) Anyway, going through them means they prefer to use the parts they supply and that saves me on shipping. Which means...YEAH MAN!!!...I have to dough to get the injectors rebuilt.

The place where I'm sending them is the place I mentioned already. I corresponded with the fellow via email sometime back, so I still have the business' name and service info. He/they do the same thing Witchhunter does. As I recall, Witchhunter was about twice the cost.....reputation all the same, though.

The cam is in great shape. It stays stock as will the valves. From talking with aformentioned persons, it's unlikely the head will need to be linebored. But, in the end, we'll see and plans may changed accordingly.

Do what you gotta do, when you can if you can.

thook

Thank you much, Gary. I'm actually quite upbeat about the whole thing. No sense in a furrowed brow with things like this. No fun in that.... I'm looking at the whole thing as an adventurous challenge. Life's too short to not look for the silverlining. Some people spend their whole lives and never look for it. Me...I'm going to come out with a squeaky clean zoom, zoom. It's just a vehicle, but it's also life and what we make of it...big or small, bad or good....is entirely up to us. I'm going to enjoy myself, thank you.....

The sun is out today. Good day for splitting wood.

Thanks all.

thook

Oh.....Gary, thanks for the injector cleaning tip. I will remember that one for the future. Might save me $90 against the "professional" cleaning I've had before. For that, I've could have had them rebuilt. Lesson learned.

thook

This is the injector service I mentioned:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...TQ:MOTORS:1123
Looks like their price has gone up a bit since I last checked. There's a place in the same town of the machine shop I'm going to call and check with. Consolidate a bit more.

thook

Nope....they only do diesel injectors. Mr. Injector it is.

TNRabbit

Do they replace all the injector gaskets? Those will cost a damn mint by themselves...

thook

Which injector gaskets are those, Gary?

Here's what the ebay ad states:

The injectors are cleaned and tested on the ASNU flow bench and ultrasonic cleaning machine. After cleaning new filter baskets, o-rings, spacers and pintel caps are installed. They are returned with a before and after flow report.

I will ask him, though....if I knew what gaskets you're talking about...

thook

Wait....are you talking about the ones with the groove in the middle of the injectors just before it widens? I guess where it fits into the fuel rail?

TNRabbit

Sorry, I meant o-rings/pintle caps. It probably wouldn't hurt to replace the o-rings around the outside of the bakelite cup they sit in, either.