MNBOY

While we're talking absurdity....

So now I need a crawler because I have a 5-speed? What a bunch of crap. Schaeffer has you guys brainwashed. You're gonna have to be a lot more specific about what you consider "real wheeling" for me to believe this.

Jonathan

Who was the first "absurdity" mention directed towards,Flygenstein?

Robinhood150

One more thing to note...a crawler does not equal an auto. A manual with a crawler is better than a stock auto.

Robinhood150

I think the opperative word flygenstein used is 'comfortably".

ravencr

A good test would be to go get in your 5-speed 4runner, put it in first gear, and basically let it idle itself. If that speed is comparable to what you can travel on the trails you ride on, then you are probably okay with just the 5 speed for off-roading. But, when you can't go that fast, or it's uphill, and you 4runner won't idle it's way up the trail, you either stall, give it more gas with the clutch partially compressed (burns clutch), or you give it more gas and hold on.

Or, the other option, is to get a crawler, which allows you to be able to tackle obstacles slower and with more control, and less clutch usage. Either way is doable to some extent, and it just depends on what you prefer.

Chris

Flygtenstein

For rock crawling, or as much crawling as one can do with IFS, a crawler is best. It does not matter if that is behind a stick or an auto.

Stock, in my cheesy opinion, an auto is better than a stick. That is for the wheeling that I do and have done. Wheeling where you need at least one locker and the stick means that you have to hammer it to get through. An auto will let you go slower without killing the engine or stinking the clutch.

As Steve, (Robinhood?) said, a crawler is not the same as an auto, but you can almost fake a crawler with an auto. You cannot fake a crawler with a 5spd.

I hate watching and smelling people with 5 spds hammer up things. It is hard on the truck and painful to watch. I know that people have to wheel what they have, but you asked me what I thought about an auto and I told you, as did a lot of qualified, experience wheelers and pontificators.

MNBOY

Yes.
I had to go back and reread the post to make sure he wasn't being sarcastic. I just hate to see threads take this direction. The original question was from someone wanting to know the pros and cons of an auto transmission for off-roading. Somehow, like in other posts, the answers get around to someone saying that you need to have a crawler and SAS for off-roading. I know for a fact that this is crap. I'll be the first to admit that low range gears, lots of articulation, and big tires are lots of fun, and can help get you through situations that would otherwise be tough, but they are not needed. An inexperienced person will read this stuff and think they have to have these mods to take their rig anywhere but paved roads. It just frustrates me that this could turn people off to 4x4s and turn them away from something I consider a lot of fun.

rimpainter.com

Do you guys really think he is going to be rock crawling anytime soon?

I highly doubt it.

Jonathan

I'm not trying to start anything here. I just didn't find anything that was said, absurd, by any means. I think Flygtenstein has a vallid argument. But for NORMAL wheeling conditions, I have found that you don't need crawler gears. I don't climb rocks seeing that I leave in the southeast. We see a lot of steep climbs and slippery mud here. I admit crawler gears would be a great setup ,but for most, it is not needed. All i have left to say is that it is left up to personal preference. You can build either one just as capable as the other, I'm not downing one or the other by any means. Just figure out what works for you. Sorry about the long post but I just want to see if we can clear things up. There's no need to fight about a things said in this post. Respect goes a long way and just remember there are more important things in this life to get your panties in wad over.

*stepping off my soapbox, exit stage left*

Regards,
Jonathan

Flygtenstein

Question posed:
Is an automatic good for wheeling?

Answer from me:
Yes, it is great. It is a lot better than people think. In stock form, it is better than a 5 spd for control. Add a tranny cooler and you are golden.

Opinions offered directly and insinuated by others:
Sticks are great, blah, blah, blah...

Thoughts offered by me:
People without crawlers behind their sticks beat their trucks in the sort of wheeling that I do. I do not like to watch or smell that.

Assorted other things mentioned to justify automatic use:
Lots of comp buggies use autos. Most stick wheelers have crawlers. In order to wheel on rocks with a stick comfortably and avoiding catastrophic damage you ought to have a crawler. Subtitles included in the above statement, crawlers are expensive and do not come in the truck you are mentioning.

Besides, everyone knows you need a solid axle and a winch to really wheel.

Jonathan

Originally posted by: FlygtensteinHAHAHA!!! Yeah that's what I heard makes you a "real wheeler"

WATRD

I find the concept that you guys are having the age old auto v manual argument on the net a bit absurd... with posts saying things like; for "normal" offroading... hehehehhe I can't help but laugh. What is "normal" wheeling again? heheheheh

For the original poster; There are advantages and disadvantages to both auto and manual trannies off road. Neither is a clear hands down winner, as has been illustrated by this thread. When choosing, it helps to have some experience with both backing you up, as well as some idea of your wheeling style and the terrain you will be wheeling.

Personally, over my wheeling "career", I have had several of both. I can argue the strengths and weaknesses of either when pressed. As will almost everything else on your rig, it's really immaterial when you remember that MOST of the off-road-ability of ANY vehicle is in the seat to steering wheel interface known as the driver. A good driver can wheel either to it's advantage. A bad driver can make either perform poorly off road.

Now, with that said, when I bought this truck new, I specifically chose an automatic transmission.

MNBOY

Finally the sarcasm I was looking for.
Didn't want to start a fight, just venting an annoyance of mine. Now I'll go back out into the rain and finish replacing the cooling fan studs I broke yesterday.

Jonathan

Group Hug anyone?

rowan

for the kind of wheeling i do the 5 spd is fine. 4 low gets it plenty low enough so i can just idle along. im not doing steep hillclimbs and rockcrawling.

mtnkid85, it really depends what kind of offroading you are doing. sometimes i do wish i had an auto though. i could go either way, as long as i could push my tires up hills on the road with the auto tranny.

44Runner

I think this is something like so many other things in our sport that comes down to personal perference. Plain and simple.

I dig manuals, always have, probably always will. Now for your normal everyday off road experience, you probably don't need a crawler. I get the impression that most of you don't do the type of wheeling that requires a crawler. If you did, you would probably get one, simple as that.

I think that stock to stock, the autos have the advantage on the tuff stuff.

Now lets take my group at the EC4RJ. On Chicken Run there is a steep rock climb where you need to make a sharp left at the top and there is a tree on the left toward the top. A TON of people tagged that tree, HARD, and not just in my group. The only one with a manual that ended up missing it, was me. I was also the only one with a crawler. It boiled down to control...

Gadget

Damn, you must of been in the slow group. Not one person in my group hit that tree on chicken hill....

Gadget

www.GadgetOnline.com

WATRD

Now Gadget, what have we told you about describing other members as "slow"? It's not very polite. It is much more politically correct to refer to them as "riding the short Tacoma to school". hehehehe

Got your seventh injector yet? hehehhehehe I bet that one has got a slow burn going at your house... I can feel the heat from here.

44Runner

I think it was the exact opposite. We went faster. In fact I think everyone in the hardcore group resurfaced that tree.

John w/ the SAS Taco flatbed on 38s was in my group and he tagged the hell outta that tree. It was definately an example of a truck not being able to go slow enough to stay in control. Come to think of it though, 4 the Hard Way was in my group too and I think he has a manual and a crawler and i think he slammed that tree too. Sometimes you can't just do anything about it. Hmmm, who knows...

Gadget

I am still looking forward to getting a close look at that front end of yours.

We need to set a date for the Fall Colors Ride.

Gadget

www.GadgetOnline.com