Locker for Daily Driver - Page 3

Mr. Bob · 02-02-2006, 04:24 PM

This is right off the aussie locker web page:

"If only installing one locker should I install in the front or rear?"

"We "Do Not" recommend the installation of a locker in the front of a vehicle that will be driven on icy highways in 4WD without manual hubs.

* If a vehicle has an IFS (Independent Front Suspension) system then the front installation will result in a dramatic increase in 4WD capability. This is because all IFS vehicles have very limited suspension movement (wheel travel and articulation) resulting in easily lifted wheels and a loss of front traction. Installing a front locker will solve the deficiency.

* If a vehicle has LSD (Limited Slip Differential) in the rear, then a front installation provides a significant improvement over the existing LSD and open diff set-up.

* If a vehicle has constant 4WD then only a rear installation should be considered.

* A front installation will usually yield the greatest improvement in off-road capability. This is due to the general requirement of increased in traction under hill climbing or rock crawling. Under full climbing conditions, due to the angle of the vehicle, the rear wheels carry a much greater weight (weight transfer) and therefore, the front carries less weight and tends to break traction very easily.

Once one front wheel starts to spin the other wheel stops turning and the whole front diff ceases to provide traction. At this point the load is transferred to the rear diff as if the vehicle was a 2WD and due to the increased load the rear wheels tend to spin and the vehicle stops. If you can stop the front wheel from spinning you have solved the traction problem. In addition to the traction performance a front installation does not introduce any changes in handling characteristics. "

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JHupp · 02-02-2006, 04:29 PM

wow, so I will only notice a front locker when in 4wd, it really makes much more sense to me because in my truck with a center diff lock, there is a 50/50 split betweenthe front and rear, and the front wheels loose traction much easier. I just want to be sure, that the lcoker will only work when in 4wd, and not in 2 wheel. I want this vehicle to handle like stock in 2 wheel, but be as nasty as it wants in 4wd. Thanks, somebody just please confirm. Thanks,
Jason

JHupp · 02-02-2006, 04:37 PM

also, on all of the charts I see, the fitment chart for the front only goes up to 1999. I have allready purchased a 1620 model, but I dont think the front and rear diffs are the same, so I probably wont be able to install it in the front. I'm guessing I will have to return it to purchase a different model for the front. Anybody know what model lock-right is made for the front diff of an '01 Runner? Thanks in advance!!!

Mr. Bob · 02-02-2006, 04:46 PM

The ultimate setup would be the toy Elocker swap into the rear, and an aussie in the front....

That is the setup my buddy went with in his 1st gen runner and drives completly stock on road, and walks almost everything off road....

An aussie in the front will not lock untill powered... so as long as the drive shaft is not spinning, then it acts as an open diff.... that is why you cann't install an aussie into an AWD vehicle.... I have one in the front of my bronco.... and love it!! big time improvment!!!

Mr. Bob · 02-02-2006, 04:48 PM

and aussie goes 1986-2000

JHupp · 02-02-2006, 04:51 PM

Nice, it basically has to be a lockright, because that is what I bought, the part # for the lockright is 1611, do you know if it will also be unnoticeable in 2wd? I believe they all work the same, but just wanted to double check. Thanks!

amorphous · 02-02-2006, 04:57 PM

dued, do you have ADD or manual hubs?

"We "Do Not" recommend the installation of a locker in the front of a vehicle that will be driven on icy highways in 4WD without manual hubs.

Mr. Bob · 02-02-2006, 04:58 PM

It will work fine so long as it is not AWD.... Now that I think of it, my buddy is running the Lockright 1611 in his '88....

tc · 02-02-2006, 04:58 PM

Doesn't the ADD disconnect one of the axles out of the carrier?

Even if it doesn't, manual hubs would make the locker transparent on the road. If you live where it snows, manual hubs would allow you to avoid the apparently sketchy handling of a locked front in the snow by only locking one hub and having 3WD.

JHupp · 02-02-2006, 05:45 PM

I am not sure what I have up front, it is definately not Manual Hubs. I NEVER run in 4wd, unless it is very very snowy on the side streets in my neighborhood. In this sitation a front locker would probably be better. The only other time I use 4wd would be offroad, where I think the locker would make a huge difference, hopefully in a good way. The lockright says that it ratchets, so the wide turns shouldnt be bad at all. And for tghter technical sections, if I really had to, I could take it out of 4 wheel really quick. On road, if I ever had to use the 4wd, it would be in the snow, but like I said, I have NEVER had to use 4wd at above 20mph on the streets here,and even if I did, the ATRAC in my Runner should be able to help with any kind of slide or skid. I think this locker would be the bet choice, and I am trying to get the guy to change my order. Like I said, I just want the front locker to be completely unnoticeable in 2wd, it can be as nasty as t wants in 4wd.

Silver_Truck · 02-02-2006, 05:49 PM

I wouldn't lock the front of my DD with a full time locker unless you have manual hubs. Just put the locker in the rear, you already bought it and it really isn't that noticeable, you'll get used to it in a couple days and you'll automatically adjust your driving style to make it work, you won't even notice the adjustment it'll become natural very quickly.

Mr. Bob · 02-02-2006, 05:55 PM

get them both!!!! hehehehe... then you will out wheel all your friends!!!

JHupp · 02-02-2006, 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silver_Truck

I wouldn't lock the front of my DD with a full time locker unless you have manual hubs. Just put the locker in the rear, you already bought it and it really isn't that noticeable, you'll get used to it in a couple days and you'll automatically adjust your driving style to make it work, you won't even notice the adjustment it'll become natural very quickly.

This is what I thought originally too, but In the front, I am guessing that I would never even feel it at all. I am always in 2wd, unless I go wheeling, which is when I will need it. Makes perfect sense to me, because in NJ I get into some hairy situations on the road, and in parking lots, a lot of sharp turns, and quick acceleration. I am still thinking tht the front is the best way to go.

TEPUI · 02-02-2006, 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JHupp

This is what I thought originally too, but In the front, I am guessing that I would never even feel it at all. I am always in 2wd, unless I go wheeling, which is when I will need it. Makes perfect sense to me, because in NJ I get into some hairy situations on the road, and in parking lots, a lot of sharp turns, and quick acceleration. I am still thinking tht the front is the best way to go.

Lock the rear first, you may realize you never needed to lock the front to begin with.

My $0.02

JHupp · 02-02-2006, 07:29 PM

damn, well if this isnt one of the most confusing descisions ever!, TEPUI, didnt you say you had a lockright in the rear and you hated it?? It doesnt even matter to me if I don't get as much off-road gain, some is better than what I have now, especially for $200, and I really really really don't want it to act weird on road, at all, like I said, in Jersey, I don't think some of the stuff I have been hearing will work. Any gain offorad like I said is worth it to me for $200, I just don't want to feel it on road.

Silver_Truck · 02-02-2006, 07:30 PM

but (from what I've heard from everyone with one) you WILL feel the one in the front even in 2wd. The general consensus from almost everyone is to lock the rear first and to avoid things other then selectable lockers up front unless you're going to be wheelin it alot and spend the majority of your time off the pavement.

Jeffires · 02-02-2006, 07:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silver_Truck

The general consensus from almost everyone is to lock the rear first and to avoid things other then selectable lockers up front unless you're going to be wheelin it alot and spend the majority of your time off the pavement.

I have lockright in the rear- for what I do, it is ALL I need. I will get a selectable in the front when I can afford it. A Lockright in the rear is easy to drive with on pavement.

amorphous · 02-02-2006, 07:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JHupp

This is what I thought originally too, but In the front, I am guessing that I would never even feel it at all. I am always in 2wd, unless I go wheeling, which is when I will need it. Makes perfect sense to me, because in NJ I get into some hairy situations on the road, and in parking lots, a lot of sharp turns, and quick acceleration. I am still thinking tht the front is the best way to go.

seriously with ADD, i'd reconsider doing the front and do the rear first.
I know of ZERO people with a front locker and ADD (other than ARBs) Sounds like trouble to me.

Contrary to what the Aussie site says, I've been told by countless peeps with more real experience than I, that the rear is where you want to start...and it's more transparent for DD

Find someone - anyone - any vehicle with a rear locker - ride with them - or see if they'll let you drive their truck - you'll see it's not a big deal.

I live in the city, my 4runner is my DD (my ONLY vehicle) - rear locker rocks, just keep your foot out of it and learn when/how it locks/unlocks

JHupp · 02-02-2006, 07:50 PM

Ok, I'm gonna call the guy that sold it to me tomorrow, and ak him what he suggests. It seems that most of the people that says it rides rough, have a manual. Mine is auto, so I'm hoping that if I do lock the back it will ride smother. I always though that if you put one up front you wouldnt be able to notice it unless the truck was in 4wd, unless I am mistaken. I'm also going to ask him his suggestions, and post what I hear for your verification. Thanks again for being so patient with me here, I know most of you must be sick of this thread and my indecisiveness by now. Thanks,
Jason

amorphous · 02-02-2006, 07:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JHupp

damn, well if this isnt one of the most confusing descisions ever!, TEPUI, didnt you say you had a lockright in the rear and you hated it?? It doesnt even matter to me if I don't get as much off-road gain, some is better than what I have now, especially for $200, and I really really really don't want it to act weird on road, at all, like I said, in Jersey, I don't think some of the stuff I have been hearing will work. Any gain offorad like I said is worth it to me for $200, I just don't want to feel it on road.

I drove Cherry Hill, DC, Philly and NYC traffic this summer - with the locker - with mud terrains. With the Soft Locker it was cool - totally manageable- But, you ARE going to feel it with any full time locker. AND you will notice off road - you'll crawl where you used to have to mash it to make it up stuff.

If you want "zero drive vibe" save your duckets for the ARB (or maybe OX will come out with one soon?)

....just remember to keep your U joints full of grease!

JamesD · 02-02-2006, 08:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JHupp

damn, well if this isnt one of the most confusing descisions ever!, TEPUI, didnt you say you had a lockright in the rear and you hated it?? It doesnt even matter to me if I don't get as much off-road gain, some is better than what I have now, especially for $200, and I really really really don't want it to act weird on road, at all, like I said, in Jersey, I don't think some of the stuff I have been hearing will work. Any gain offorad like I said is worth it to me for $200, I just don't want to feel it on road.

Simple solution. If you off-road alot, put the locker in the rear. If you off-road every now and then and you need the extra traction a couple of times, put it in the front. So how much you off road a month/year? You got to ask yourself this. My opinion on what you are describing, I would put the locker in the front.

James

JHupp · 02-02-2006, 08:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SRV1

Simple solution. If you off-road alot, put the locker in the rear. If you off-road every now and then and you need the extra traction a couple of times, put it in the front. So how much you off road a month/year? You got to ask yourself this. My opinion on what you are describing, I would put the locker in the front.

James

This was my newest plan, but a few people were saying that you will still feel it in the front. I offroad once every other month. I would like to put it in the front, but like I said, I do not want to feel it on road in 2wd.

ecchamberlin · 02-02-2006, 08:40 PM

The way I understand our drivetrains, with ADD front drive system our CV's, and diff's are always spinning. Both in 4wd and 2wd. The 4wd engages in the transfer case with auto hubs. So this would mean that a front full time locker would have the negative streetable effects all the time. The only way that this would not be the case is if the hubs were converted to manual. (which would cost more than doing an ARB locker) With manual hubs in the off setting the cv's do not spin which also means that the diff will not spin unless in 4wd.
All this aside the front drivetrain is not nearly as strong as the rear. A locker puts way more stress on the parts and I would rather slip a bit in the front and get a good bite in the rear than break in the front while slipping in the rear.

JamesD · 02-02-2006, 08:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JHupp

This was my newest plan, but a few people were saying that you will still feel it in the front. I offroad once every other month. I would like to put it in the front, but like I said, I do not want to feel it on road in 2wd.

You WILL NOT FEEL IT IN THE FRONT if you have MANUAL HUBS!! The axles shafts are not spinning when the hubs are unlocked! I don't know why so many people have a hard time with this. The ADD with spin the passenger axleshaft but not the drivers intermediate shaft, at all times when in 2wd.

James

amorphous · 02-02-2006, 08:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ecchamberlin

The way I understand our drivetrains, with ADD front drive system our CV's, and diff's are always spinning. Both in 4wd and 2wd. The 4wd engages in the transfer case with auto hubs. So this would mean that a front full time locker would have the negative streetable effects all the time. The only way that this would not be the case is if the hubs were converted to manual. (which would cost more than doing an ARB locker) With manual hubs in the off setting the cv's do not spin which also means that the diff will not spin unless in 4wd.
All this aside the front drivetrain is not nearly as strong as the rear. A locker puts way more stress on the parts and I would rather slip a bit in the front and get a good bite in the rear than break in the front while slipping in the rear.

Eric- you hit the nail on the head.

Aaron

02-02-2006, 04:29 PM	#52 (permalink)
JHupp Registered User Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: New Jersey Posts: 1,159	wow, so I will only notice a front locker when in 4wd, it really makes much more sense to me because in my truck with a center diff lock, there is a 50/50 split betweenthe front and rear, and the front wheels loose traction much easier. I just want to be sure, that the lcoker will only work when in 4wd, and not in 2 wheel. I want this vehicle to handle like stock in 2 wheel, but be as nasty as it wants in 4wd. Thanks, somebody just please confirm. Thanks, Jason __________________ Jason '06 F250 Super Duty Daily Driver '01 Toyota 4Runner Sport 265/75/16 BFG ATs, OME 881s w/ spacers front, OME 891s rear, SS roll bar, and some other stuff. Out of Commision njttora.com

02-02-2006, 04:37 PM	#53 (permalink)
JHupp Registered User Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: New Jersey Posts: 1,159	also, on all of the charts I see, the fitment chart for the front only goes up to 1999. I have allready purchased a 1620 model, but I dont think the front and rear diffs are the same, so I probably wont be able to install it in the front. I'm guessing I will have to return it to purchase a different model for the front. Anybody know what model lock-right is made for the front diff of an '01 Runner? Thanks in advance!!! __________________ Jason '06 F250 Super Duty Daily Driver '01 Toyota 4Runner Sport 265/75/16 BFG ATs, OME 881s w/ spacers front, OME 891s rear, SS roll bar, and some other stuff. Out of Commision njttora.com

02-02-2006, 04:46 PM	#54 (permalink)
Mr. Bob Contributing Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Vancouver BC Posts: 402	The ultimate setup would be the toy Elocker swap into the rear, and an aussie in the front.... That is the setup my buddy went with in his 1st gen runner and drives completly stock on road, and walks almost everything off road.... An aussie in the front will not lock untill powered... so as long as the drive shaft is not spinning, then it acts as an open diff.... that is why you cann't install an aussie into an AWD vehicle.... I have one in the front of my bronco.... and love it!! big time improvment!!! __________________ 97 Stellar Blue Pearl 4Runner, 3.4L 5 Speed, Elocker, OEM Lift, 285/75/R16 Cooper Discoverer STTs on FZJ-80 rims, TRD clutch, TRD Headers, Borla cat back exhaust, Deck plate and ISR mods. mods waiting for truck: FJ40 logo for satoshi mod "Amber" corner lenses Hilux Surf emblem

02-02-2006, 04:48 PM	#55 (permalink)
Mr. Bob Contributing Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Vancouver BC Posts: 402	and aussie goes 1986-2000 __________________ 97 Stellar Blue Pearl 4Runner, 3.4L 5 Speed, Elocker, OEM Lift, 285/75/R16 Cooper Discoverer STTs on FZJ-80 rims, TRD clutch, TRD Headers, Borla cat back exhaust, Deck plate and ISR mods. mods waiting for truck: FJ40 logo for satoshi mod "Amber" corner lenses Hilux Surf emblem

02-02-2006, 04:51 PM	#56 (permalink)
JHupp Registered User Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: New Jersey Posts: 1,159	Nice, it basically has to be a lockright, because that is what I bought, the part # for the lockright is 1611, do you know if it will also be unnoticeable in 2wd? I believe they all work the same, but just wanted to double check. Thanks! __________________ Jason '06 F250 Super Duty Daily Driver '01 Toyota 4Runner Sport 265/75/16 BFG ATs, OME 881s w/ spacers front, OME 891s rear, SS roll bar, and some other stuff. Out of Commision njttora.com

02-02-2006, 04:57 PM	#57 (permalink)
amorphous Registered User Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Eugene, OR Posts: 839	dued, do you have ADD or manual hubs? "We "Do Not" recommend the installation of a locker in the front of a vehicle that will be driven on icy highways in 4WD without manual hubs. __________________ 98 4runner sr5 33"s and locked with the usual suspects

02-02-2006, 04:58 PM	#58 (permalink)
Mr. Bob Contributing Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Vancouver BC Posts: 402	It will work fine so long as it is not AWD.... Now that I think of it, my buddy is running the Lockright 1611 in his '88.... __________________ 97 Stellar Blue Pearl 4Runner, 3.4L 5 Speed, Elocker, OEM Lift, 285/75/R16 Cooper Discoverer STTs on FZJ-80 rims, TRD clutch, TRD Headers, Borla cat back exhaust, Deck plate and ISR mods. mods waiting for truck: FJ40 logo for satoshi mod "Amber" corner lenses Hilux Surf emblem

02-02-2006, 04:58 PM	#59 (permalink)
tc Contributing Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Longmont, CO Posts: 8,372	Doesn't the ADD disconnect one of the axles out of the carrier? Even if it doesn't, manual hubs would make the locker transparent on the road. If you live where it snows, manual hubs would allow you to avoid the apparently sketchy handling of a locked front in the snow by only locking one hub and having 3WD. __________________ Check out www.coTTORA.org to hook up with great Toyota 'wheelin' folks! Current - 93 4Runner: 3VZ 33"x10.50" no lift ARB F/R 96 Impala SS: My own personal cop car Previous - 89 2WD Pickup 22R, Fabtech "Ivan Dan" lift, 31x10.50, IASCA World Finals 4th Place Stop with the mods and get on the trail! Pix at www.4wheelingoh.shutterfly.com/action Last edited by tc; 02-02-2006 at 05:11 PM.

02-02-2006, 05:45 PM	#60 (permalink)
JHupp Registered User Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: New Jersey Posts: 1,159	I am not sure what I have up front, it is definately not Manual Hubs. I NEVER run in 4wd, unless it is very very snowy on the side streets in my neighborhood. In this sitation a front locker would probably be better. The only other time I use 4wd would be offroad, where I think the locker would make a huge difference, hopefully in a good way. The lockright says that it ratchets, so the wide turns shouldnt be bad at all. And for tghter technical sections, if I really had to, I could take it out of 4 wheel really quick. On road, if I ever had to use the 4wd, it would be in the snow, but like I said, I have NEVER had to use 4wd at above 20mph on the streets here,and even if I did, the ATRAC in my Runner should be able to help with any kind of slide or skid. I think this locker would be the bet choice, and I am trying to get the guy to change my order. Like I said, I just want the front locker to be completely unnoticeable in 2wd, it can be as nasty as t wants in 4wd. __________________ Jason '06 F250 Super Duty Daily Driver '01 Toyota 4Runner Sport 265/75/16 BFG ATs, OME 881s w/ spacers front, OME 891s rear, SS roll bar, and some other stuff. Out of Commision njttora.com

02-02-2006, 05:49 PM	#61 (permalink)
Silver_Truck Contributing Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: B'ham, WA Posts: 1,818	I wouldn't lock the front of my DD with a full time locker unless you have manual hubs. Just put the locker in the rear, you already bought it and it really isn't that noticeable, you'll get used to it in a couple days and you'll automatically adjust your driving style to make it work, you won't even notice the adjustment it'll become natural very quickly. __________________ -Geoff *1991 Toyota Pickup Ext. Cab SR5 4x4 V6 5 spd K&N intake, port & polished heads with OS valves, port & polished intake manifold and plenum, NWOR headers and crossover, NWOR catback, Denso Iridium plugs, Redline Fluids, 4.88s, Rear LockRight, Aisin hubs, Chevy springs, BJ spacers, 2" RB body lift, 34x10.5 Swamper LTBs, WolphisWorks Sliders and bumpers, 400,000 mi.

02-02-2006, 05:55 PM	#62 (permalink)
Mr. Bob Contributing Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Vancouver BC Posts: 402	get them both!!!! hehehehe... then you will out wheel all your friends!!! __________________ 97 Stellar Blue Pearl 4Runner, 3.4L 5 Speed, Elocker, OEM Lift, 285/75/R16 Cooper Discoverer STTs on FZJ-80 rims, TRD clutch, TRD Headers, Borla cat back exhaust, Deck plate and ISR mods. mods waiting for truck: FJ40 logo for satoshi mod "Amber" corner lenses Hilux Surf emblem

02-02-2006, 07:29 PM	#65 (permalink)
JHupp Registered User Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: New Jersey Posts: 1,159	damn, well if this isnt one of the most confusing descisions ever!, TEPUI, didnt you say you had a lockright in the rear and you hated it?? It doesnt even matter to me if I don't get as much off-road gain, some is better than what I have now, especially for $200, and I really really really don't want it to act weird on road, at all, like I said, in Jersey, I don't think some of the stuff I have been hearing will work. Any gain offorad like I said is worth it to me for $200, I just don't want to feel it on road. __________________ Jason '06 F250 Super Duty Daily Driver '01 Toyota 4Runner Sport 265/75/16 BFG ATs, OME 881s w/ spacers front, OME 891s rear, SS roll bar, and some other stuff. Out of Commision njttora.com

02-02-2006, 07:30 PM	#66 (permalink)
Silver_Truck Contributing Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: B'ham, WA Posts: 1,818	but (from what I've heard from everyone with one) you WILL feel the one in the front even in 2wd. The general consensus from almost everyone is to lock the rear first and to avoid things other then selectable lockers up front unless you're going to be wheelin it alot and spend the majority of your time off the pavement. __________________ -Geoff *1991 Toyota Pickup Ext. Cab SR5 4x4 V6 5 spd K&N intake, port & polished heads with OS valves, port & polished intake manifold and plenum, NWOR headers and crossover, NWOR catback, Denso Iridium plugs, Redline Fluids, 4.88s, Rear LockRight, Aisin hubs, Chevy springs, BJ spacers, 2" RB body lift, 34x10.5 Swamper LTBs, WolphisWorks Sliders and bumpers, 400,000 mi.

02-02-2006, 07:50 PM	#69 (permalink)
JHupp Registered User Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: New Jersey Posts: 1,159	Ok, I'm gonna call the guy that sold it to me tomorrow, and ak him what he suggests. It seems that most of the people that says it rides rough, have a manual. Mine is auto, so I'm hoping that if I do lock the back it will ride smother. I always though that if you put one up front you wouldnt be able to notice it unless the truck was in 4wd, unless I am mistaken. I'm also going to ask him his suggestions, and post what I hear for your verification. Thanks again for being so patient with me here, I know most of you must be sick of this thread and my indecisiveness by now. Thanks, Jason __________________ Jason '06 F250 Super Duty Daily Driver '01 Toyota 4Runner Sport 265/75/16 BFG ATs, OME 881s w/ spacers front, OME 891s rear, SS roll bar, and some other stuff. Out of Commision njttora.com

02-02-2006, 08:40 PM	#73 (permalink)
ecchamberlin Contributing Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 1,917	The way I understand our drivetrains, with ADD front drive system our CV's, and diff's are always spinning. Both in 4wd and 2wd. The 4wd engages in the transfer case with auto hubs. So this would mean that a front full time locker would have the negative streetable effects all the time. The only way that this would not be the case is if the hubs were converted to manual. (which would cost more than doing an ARB locker) With manual hubs in the off setting the cv's do not spin which also means that the diff will not spin unless in 4wd. All this aside the front drivetrain is not nearly as strong as the rear. A locker puts way more stress on the parts and I would rather slip a bit in the front and get a good bite in the rear than break in the front while slipping in the rear. __________________ Eric 2001 4Runner with stuff: http://www.ultimateyota.com/index.ph...6&topic=1098.0

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