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86-95 Trucks & 4Runners 2nd/3rd gen pickups, and 1st/2nd gen 4Runners with IFS

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Old 03-09-2008, 02:27 PM   #1
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Finding TDC (compression) 22RE

Well, I'm tearing down my engine to do a headgasket change. Before I pull the distributor, I want to get the engine set to TDC compression so that I can be sure that everything is aligned when I"m putting it back together.

Cutting to the chase: I was under the impression that at TDC the distributor would be in roughly the 11 oclock position and the #1 cyl would be at the top. However, I'm finding that when I put the crank indicator at 0 on the belt cover timing mark, the distributor is a far cry from 11 oclock. Could anyone shed some light on this for me?

At 0 degrees
Click the image to open in full size.

Corresponding distributor position:
Click the image to open in full size.

1 revolution of the crank:
Click the image to open in full size.

And resulting positiong of the distributor:
Click the image to open in full size.

Any help would be appreciated. As noted in the title, this is on the 22RE.

Thanks,
Kyle
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Old 03-09-2008, 03:38 PM   #2
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#1 piston is at the top and both rockers are loose on number 1. or you can take the spark plug out and put your finger over the hole and turn the motor with a wrench, when air pushes out you are coming to tdc. were the wires in the right hole on the dist. cap?
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Old 03-09-2008, 04:57 PM   #3
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I assume the wires going to the distributor cap were accurate. I can't see it working otherwise. For reference, the #1 cyl (the one closest to the front bumper) plug goes into the "11 oclock" position.

Sorry for the newb question, but by "both rockers are loose" what do you mean, or how would I check this?

Thanks
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Old 03-10-2008, 03:18 AM   #4
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they may have been a tooth off on the dist. install and move wire to compensate.
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Old 03-10-2008, 04:24 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by My99 View Post
I assume the wires going to the distributor cap were accurate. I can't see it working otherwise. For reference, the #1 cyl (the one closest to the front bumper) plug goes into the "11 oclock" position.

Sorry for the newb question, but by "both rockers are loose" what do you mean, or how would I check this?

Thanks
pull the valve cover, and look at the 2 forward rockers (intake & exhaust for cyl 1)
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Old 03-10-2008, 05:19 AM   #6
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You say the engine was running like this? Has it always been like this as far as you know? And, you ran a compression a test?
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Old 03-10-2008, 06:15 AM   #7
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Yeah- ran great. And I did do a compression check and all cyl dees were within minspec, except that one was too far below the other cylinders for consistency spec. Did a leakdown test and found that cylinder was pushing air into the coolant.
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Old 03-10-2008, 06:19 AM   #8
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Yeah that definately doesn't look right. Here was mine at TDC on the compresssion stoke last weekend when I pulled the head:
Click the image to open in full size.

You can tell if you are on the compression stoke if the crank is hard to turn with a ratchet. It will go easy, hard, easy, hard, etc. You must be off a tooth on the distributer. I'm surprised it ran well. I had it off one tooth last winter when I did my head gasket and I wasn't able to get the timing right. When you go to put it back in, make sure the engine is at TDC and insert it with the rotor at 12 o'clock and it will rotate counterclockwise where it needs to be so it will idle and you can set your timing.

Rob
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Old 03-10-2008, 09:32 AM   #9
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Yeah- ran great. And I did do a compression check and all cyl dees were within minspec, except that one was too far below the other cylinders for consistency spec. Did a leakdown test and found that cylinder was pushing air into the coolant.
Amazing. That's exactly where my rotor was sitting when my timing chain failed. Bent 6 valves and it wouldn't fire at all. No compression....atleast on cyl. #1. Didn't bother to test any further than that.

So, good you're having the head checked. That rotor is way off.
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Oh...that was me thinking...then stopping mid sentence...then some more babbling and such. LOL
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Old 03-10-2008, 09:57 AM   #10
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#1 piston is at the top and both rockers are loose on number 1.

This has been the most reliable way for me...

If it ran fine how it was don't change it...mark the dis. bolt where it is now...mark the rotor where it is now...slowly pull it out and mark where the rotor ends up(makes it easier to put back in) That's how I've done it quite a few times
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Old 03-10-2008, 03:03 PM   #11
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When the engi e really is at tdc the distributor is indeed at the 11 oclock position. That would mean the crank pulley indicator is out of whack. That is the correct "notch" in the pulley I should be looking for, right?
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Old 03-10-2008, 04:41 PM   #12
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When the engi e really is at tdc the distributor is indeed at the 11 oclock position. That would mean the crank pulley indicator is out of whack. That is the correct "notch" in the pulley I should be looking for, right?
The notch should be on 0 when both #1 valves are closed..IMO it's more likely that the dis. is a tooth off than the crank pully notch is wrong.
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Old 03-10-2008, 09:10 PM   #13
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This has been the most reliable way for me...

If it ran fine how it was don't change it...mark the dis. bolt where it is now...mark the rotor where it is now...slowly pull it out and mark where the rotor ends up(makes it easier to put back in) That's how I've done it quite a few times
Are you suggesting that he not set the distributor to the #1 spark terminal? Leaving it where it is?
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Old 03-11-2008, 06:26 AM   #14
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Are you suggesting that he not set the distributor to the #1 spark terminal? Leaving it where it is?

I think he was getting too caught up in where that rotor was when the valves and timing mark will tell you for sure when your at tdc..by marking it at least he has a reference to put it back how it was(sais it ran great)

edit.. to add to that..every time that I've thought the timing mark was off I've found that I overlooked something
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Old 03-11-2008, 04:13 PM   #15
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I think he was getting too caught up in where that rotor was when the valves and timing mark will tell you for sure when your at tdc..by marking it at least he has a reference to put it back how it was(sais it ran great)

edit.. to add to that..every time that I've thought the timing mark was off I've found that I overlooked something
I see what you mean. Well, it will all be real obvious when the head comes off. That is, whether or not the timing mark is off.

I think what's scary here is that with the rotor way out of time like that, the motor even ran without doing valve damage.
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Oh...that was me thinking...then stopping mid sentence...then some more babbling and such. LOL
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Old 03-11-2008, 07:00 PM   #16
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Hey guys, I did remove the head, I believe in TDC position. The crank sprocket was in the right spot, as was the distributor pointer. The crank pulley notch however was in about the 7 oclock position rather than pointing at 0* on the timing cover. I went ahead and made my own notch though before removing the chain and sprocket at the top and marked them accordingly so that I can hopefully get the right timing when I put things back together. Here's a picture of the head when I removed it, so I think everything is in the "correct" position.

Click the image to open in full size.

Pretty isn't it. I'll be starting another thread that's more of a "help me" thread complete with pictures and comments from along the way. I'll come back here and link to it for reference. Thanks again for the comments!

Link to updates/snags as I continue the headgasket procedure
http://www.yotatech.com/f116/head-ga.../#post50776338

Kyle
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Old 03-16-2008, 12:56 PM   #17
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Alright, Kyle!

That is TDC....and that would mean the pulley notch was off. Weird. But! That also means your timing wasn't actually off and no bent valves. Well, the fact that it was running great was a good indicator regardless.

Anyway, good news, eh?

Looks like #4 piston got a little steam cleaning....
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Context is everything....
Quote:
Originally Posted by abecedarian View Post
freckles, shmeckles... that was your acne reflecting on my pearlescent skin.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HighLux View Post
Oh...that was me thinking...then stopping mid sentence...then some more babbling and such. LOL
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Old 03-16-2008, 05:10 PM   #18
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If your pulley reading is off, get a new one.

http://www.damperdudes.net//index.ph...e0cbfd8d12d097
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Old 03-16-2008, 08:57 PM   #19
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If your pulley reading is off, get a new one.
ditto. I have an '88 POS runner in my garage now that has the same issue including the lack of compression on all four cyls. Turns out two owners prior to me had the crank timing gear break and locked up the valve train and kissed the pistons. It sure looks like the crank pulley has a rubber layer between the center portion and pulley groove that somehow slipped. If you're going through the work to replace the HG (chain too) replace the pulley as well. Do it right the first time.
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Old 03-16-2008, 08:57 PM
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