bruzer1123

crap...just saw your reply...what do you think I have done....and why did it run?

abecedarian

I'm mulling over what possibly could've caused this and I can't really come up with a sound theory other than everything wasn't installed properly meaning that the cam and crank weren't timed together and that meant the gear didn't go on properly but you torqued everything down and it was close enough to start.

abecedarian

let's get a picture of the cam without the gear on it, from as straight on / looking down the bolt hole as possible.
so we can see how bad the pin is in the cam.

superjoe83

you probably had the cam dowel close to the hole in the gear, thats why it started, but it slipped and went out of time, if it only moved as far as it shows in the pics your valves should be ok.

don't worry, we all make mistakes

bruzer1123

alright guys...sorry it took awhile to get pics (gotta keep the wife's camera clean!).

pulled the timing cover...



bottom stuff (slack due to the cam gear not being on the cam)



cam gear-chipped teeth & funny wear marks on the back



crankshaft gear-seemed to be sitting normal & no abnormal wear



and the photos we have all been waiting for....cam w. alignment pin....

abecedarian

okay, it looks like the cam shaft is going to be salvagable. the pin is bent but not out of place so it should still locate the cam gear.
but cross our fingers and let's hope the valves are still good.
the cam gear looks like it took several trips around the cam without the cam moving.
so reinstall the chain with your oil gear. make sure the cam gear goes all the way back to the flange on the camshaft
and make sure the timing dots on the gears and chain are lined up.

bruzer1123

so, re-use the old cam gear and see how it goes? That sounds alot better than buying a cam...since I would be totally screwed installing that. I guess, I had better get my butt to the parts store so I can get a new timing cover gasket or could I use RTV?

bruzer1123

okay...just ran outside and tried to get the old cam gear on the cam. The pin is a bit misshapen and doesn't allow the cam gear to seat properly. I suppose that I could use a dremel and grind the pin on the cam shaft?

abecedarian

if you're talking about grinding off the little pinch sticking out past the end of the cam, yep. don't grind any more than necessary.

bruzer1123

what the heck is up with the water outlet line? It has two bolts that get attached to nothing? Why doesn't this leak? I can pull the little bastart out without any effort? What am I missing....

bruzer1123

well-it is all back together...leaking coolant from the stupid water outlet (so there are clamps holding it down for now). Turned it over and nothing. It almost sounds like just the starter is going. I am beginning to think that I cooked the motor. So...tomorrow (maybe) I will check for spark and compression. I don't think I have been this frustrated with myself for a long time. I go back and forth between sending it to a mechanic (which I didn't do in the first place to save money) or just selling the bastard. If I need to replace the engine I don't think that I have the knowledge to do that. But obviously that didn't stop me from doing a timing chain..................

abecedarian

If you're double-sure that the cam timing is correct, verify the distributor is in correct also- you may be off a tooth, or even 180 out.
Let's see what happens today.

bruzer1123

alright...new day...what is the method for checking for a bent valve? My plan today is to check compression. I pulled #1 plug and it smells like gas and is slightly wet. I am going to check for spark (had it before so I doubt I wouldn't now) and then compression. Does the compression let you know about bent valves?

Best way to see if the dist is off by a tooth is to pull it and move it over one tooth either way? What is being off my 180 degrees mean (that the rotor is pointing to the 5:00 instead of 11:00 position?

abecedarian

If you try the compression test and get low numbers, squirt a couple tablespoons of oil into the cylinder and try the compression test again. if it doesn't get better, you're likely looking at a bent valve.

and by being 180 off, I mean that the sparkplug is trying to fire when the piston and valves are at the top of exhaust stroke, when the exhaust and intake valves are both slightly open, instead of the compression stroke. where both valves are closed.
the easiest way to get the dist correct is to put the #1 cylinder at the top of the stroke where both intake and exhaust valves are closed (you can check that by wiggling the rocker arms- there should be some play in them, they should not be tight) then make sure the rotor is pointing at the #1 terminal on the dist cap.

bruzer1123

okay-thanks abecedarian. I just checked and I am getting spark but no compression from #1 (but that it using a compression tester that is probably 20+ years old that I have never used before and don't know if it works). I turned the crank by hand and everything seems to rotate relatively smoothly. It sounds weird when it turns over, like I don't have compression or something is missing...I guess that could be due to not getting a spark at the right time.

bruzer1123

Also checked all of the fuses by the diagnositc box and the ds kick panel. None are blown. (you can't remove the EFI relay can you?)

abecedarian

have you done a compression check on all the cylinders?

bruzer1123

no compression on all 4-I am not confident that the compression tester works...no parts stores open here today. I think I might just bring it to the local mechanic.

Took a quick video (sorry about the massive size-how do I get it smaller?) of what it sounds like trying to start. Doesn't sound right to me....

http://s333.photobucket.com/albums/m...t=MVI_1799.flv

abecedarian

I listened to the video. Actually sounds like the timing isn't right, like it's 180 degrees out. Double check that the distributor rotor is pointing at #1 cylinder in the cap when the #1 intake and exhaust valves are closed.

abecedarian

you're not getting any attempt by the engine to start.