Welder ?'s

toybota · 02-28-2009, 03:06 PM

I am considering buying a welder and was wondering what would be some things to look for? I was thinking possibly harbor freight? Garage sales, or craigslist would work too. I just was thinking like is a mig a must or what to look for. Some guidelines would help a lot so please let me know. Thanks guys

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Ed H. · 02-28-2009, 03:12 PM

i have never heard anything good about a harbor freight welder, i have worked with lincoln and miller and both worked excellent mig and tig,

1. What are you going to be welding?

2. How often are you going to use the welder?
it could be cheaper to have someone do it, or borrow/rent one

3. Do you absolutely need/want a mig welder?

stick welders are cheaper and easier to come by, they weld thicker materials in price comparison to a mig machine. I have seen some really nice welds dont by a stick welder as well it just takes practice.

tc · 02-28-2009, 04:10 PM

Garage sale, Craigslist, and pawn shops are great places to look for a welder. Stick to the name brands - Miller and Lincoln. I think Hobart welders are built by Miller.

I would really recommend getting a 220V 180A or bigger welder for the kind of fabrication we do for our trucks.

**waskillywabbit** · 02-28-2009, 04:56 PM

Type WELDER in here

Lots of varying opinions on welders, but stick with a name brand.

**4x4Fink** · 02-28-2009, 05:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by waskillywabbit

Type WELDER in here

Lots of varying opinions on welders, but stick with a name brand.

I also moved the thread to the Tool Time sub-forum.

Fink

yotaofdoom11 · 02-28-2009, 10:00 PM

if the welder is just ment for fab work on your rig 110v with high amp output will do you just fine, just remember the thicker the material you may have to prep your steel a little differently rather than just tacking and burning wire. If your mind is set on heavier fab work a 220v machine is what you want. Lincoln, Miller, or Hobart, cant go wrong with either one of those three.

saitotiktmdog · 04-20-2009, 09:47 AM

Hobart 187 mig Welder. Anyone have one or used one? I ordered one from TSC. Was tired of trying to fool with upside down stick welding.

gary96360 · 04-20-2009, 10:45 AM

lol try to use a mig without gas.

904_runner · 04-20-2009, 10:54 AM

I don't have a problem with flux core.

I ended up buying a lincoln 140c and i really love that little welder.

toyNG · 04-20-2009, 12:09 PM

look on craigslist. Because of the economy, tons of people are selling their non-essentials. I guess welders are not essential to most people, since I've seen a bunch of them on craigslist lately.

wyoming9 · 04-20-2009, 03:15 PM

Not knowing your age and economic status I don`t know if you have an account with any of the tool truck people. Long time ago I bought my first welder from Matco tools it was built by Century and still going strong. 25 plus years later.

I would say get the biggest output wise you can afford. You can cry about how hard it is to stick weld but they are so flexible you can go from 3/32 electrode for steel to a cast iron electrode to a stainless steel electrode. while you are still changing out that first spool of wire.

slcpunk74 · 04-21-2009, 08:13 AM

The hobart is a good welder (140 or 187) but I went with the lincoln 180 because the spool gun for aluminum was a lot cheaper. Miller makes a good welder that a fab buddy of mine uses and its just a plain 180 self set. It just comes down to what you will use it for. I have been doing more and more tubing lately and all I can say is if you can get the 180 mig then do it but if not just make do with the 140 because I can rarely find tubing that I need more juice then a 140 would do. Get gas for whatever you buy... Better looking welds will leave a positive note on the project and make you feel more professional.

VSU_4runnin · 04-21-2009, 08:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gary96360

lol try to use a mig without gas.

call me dumb, but can that seriously be done? Im looking into buying a welder too, but mig, tig, flux, im so lost with it all

wyoming9 · 04-21-2009, 12:01 PM

Yes you can run a self shielded wire. I have heard that it has gotten a lot better since it first came out. i just am not a big fan of it.

slcpunk74 · 04-21-2009, 07:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VSU_4runnin

call me dumb, but can that seriously be done? Im looking into buying a welder too, but mig, tig, flux, im so lost with it all

Like I said go mig, get some gas and learn to weld and never look back. Stick is ok for thick stuff, but weld quality just wont look as good in most situations. If you look on ebay you can grab a lincoln 180 pretty cheap if you can handle the 220v230v?) in your shop. If not go for a lincoln 140 or even a comparble hobart unit. For a beginner mig is easy and simple to learn.

slcpunk74 · 04-21-2009, 07:44 PM

Here is a link to a buddies build. Most all the welding was done with a miller 180... Nothing special but it just works good. It all comes down to skill and the mig has the versatility to make anyone a jack of "most" trades when it comes to welding.

http://www.race-dezert.com/forum/showthread.php?t=54157

scuba · 04-21-2009, 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VSU_4runnin

call me dumb, but can that seriously be done? Im looking into buying a welder too, but mig, tig, flux, im so lost with it all

Get a mig, tig is for aluminum, flux is basically mig just without the gas, the gas is the shielding gas, and in flux core wire its integrated into the wire..
It produces a much more messy, I would strongly advise getting a gas setup welder.

Quote:

Originally Posted by wyoming9

Yes you can run a self shielded wire. I have heard that it has gotten a lot better since it first came out. i just am not a big fan of it.

I am not a big fan of it either, my welder came with it so im just using it up..
after that ill spend the money on a gas setup..

bigt · 04-21-2009, 08:03 PM

me too im using the flux cored sire cause my lincoln mig pak has it in it but once its up ill get the stuff for gas.. it works good worknig on body work.. i have a sand blaster and a grinder to clean welds

tc · 04-21-2009, 08:16 PM

Wow, for a kid still welding his first project, you became an "expert" awful fast ...

CORRECTIONS

Quote:

Originally Posted by scuba

Get a mig, tig is for aluminum,

This is absolutely not true. Aluminum can be welded with either TIG or MIG. TIG provides much more accurate control over the heat, and when done properly, a better weld. It is also MUCH more difficult to learn, MUCH slower, and the machines are MUCH more expensive (like, try and find one for <$2k).

You can weld ANYTHING with TIG.

Quote:

Originally Posted by scuba

flux is basically mig just without the gas, the gas is the shielding gas, and in flux core wire its integrated into the wire..

MIG stands for Metal Inert Gas. So flux is NOT MIG. "Flux core" and welding are both technically SMAW (Submerged Metal Arc Welding). Flux uses a slag material to protect the molten weld pool, where MIG uses an inert gas. Flux is essentially the same as stick welding.

Note: TIG is more properly named GTAW (Gas Tungsten Arc Welding)

Quote:

Originally Posted by scuba

It produces a much more messy, I would strongly advise getting a gas setup welder.

Agreed, but flux DOES have its advantages - better penetration, better tolerance for dirty surfaces, etc

scuba · 04-21-2009, 08:20 PM

I wasnt trying to sounds like an expert, I was simply stating as much as i knew..

And my kart is not my first project.
Also I just finished my second project old man.

86toylet · 04-21-2009, 08:22 PM

Another weld Topic !

OK, Flux core (FCAW), set up right, will penetrate better then mild steel (with gas) MIG (GMAW).

Scuba:

You can do anything with a TIG as long as its AC/DC

(aluminum, steel, titanium, 4130, you name it).

Choice, get a mig its easier. Set yourself up for Flux and shielded welding. If you can afford it (and have the supply)buy a 220 machine with a minimum of 50% duty cycle.

tc · 04-21-2009, 08:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 86toylet

Choice, get a mig its easier. Set yourself up for Flux and shielded welding. If you can afford it (and have the supply)buy a 220 machine with a minimum of 50% duty cycle.

x2 - it's nice to just work on your project and not be setting off thermal shutdown in your machine or blowing breakers in your house!

CyMoN · 04-21-2009, 09:16 PM

stay clear of the CHItown electric welders from harbor freight AkA china mart.

I used one and the welds are still holding a year later but it was a major pain compared to the Lincoln 140 I have now it is at least 300 times better and 400$ more,I could only imagine how nice it would be to get my hands on a high end Miller.

another thing to think of when buying a welder a empty 40lbs or 50lbs tank to buy is going to cost you around 160$ new.

I had a co2 tank but i had to buy a adapter for my gas regulator to fit my 100% co2 tank and it ran me 17$

buy the large 12 lbs roll of wire you will save about 20 bucks compared to the 2 lbs rolls.

OFN is a good place to find info on welders and a good source to learn about metal fabrication.

wyoming9 · 04-22-2009, 02:02 AM

I would guess if you never learned to weld in the SMAW process that ones welds could look pretty bad out of position.

There is no reason for that.

If at all possible spend the money go to school learn the basics. I see so many GMAW welds with cold lap sometimes on both legs.

If you really want to get picky all metals can also be welded in the SMAW process if one really had to and had the correct electrodes on hand.

You can never have enough welders just like you never seem to have enough clamps and grinders.

saitotiktmdog · 04-22-2009, 05:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wyoming9

Not knowing your age and economic status I don`t know if you have an account with any of the tool truck people. Long time ago I bought my first welder from Matco tools it was built by Century and still going strong. 25 plus years later.

I would say get the biggest output wise you can afford. You can cry about how hard it is to stick weld but they are so flexible you can go from 3/32 electrode for steel to a cast iron electrode to a stainless steel electrode. while you are still changing out that first spool of wire.

Quote:

Originally Posted by wyoming9

I would guess if you never learned to weld in the SMAW process that ones welds could look pretty bad out of position.

There is no reason for that.

If at all possible spend the money go to school learn the basics. I see so many GMAW welds with cold lap sometimes on both legs.

If you really want to get picky all metals can also be welded in the SMAW process if one really had to and had the correct electrodes on hand.

You can never have enough welders just like you never seem to have enough clamps and grinders.

Although I have never gone to school for welding (self taught) I can weld quite well with my lincoln stick. I just have not mastered upside down welding, which is the hardest to master. Ive done some reading on the Miller welding forum and all the experienced guys say that upsidown welding is the hardest regardless of welder and that stick upsidown welding is especially difficult. I had been thinking about getting a MIG for a while anyways and I found a smokin deal on one at Tractor supply. $599 $649 delivered to my door. Normally the Hobart 187 is $849 (at least thats what the website says) I am still going to keep my lincoln stick as versitility is great and if I ever need more than 187 amps of power. Plus you can never have too many welders. As far as CyMoNs comment about Chinese welders. A friend of mines cousin bought a harbor freight plasma cutter and it works great. Also I have a Chinese plasma cutter that I got from eshipyards off of ebay. Best 450 bucks ive spent. Its a 40 amp and it has cut everything I have attemped to cut without even a hicup. There are a lot of people who have had good results with them. And 450 bucks compared to 2 grand from miller etc is worth the gamble.

02-28-2009, 03:12 PM	#2 (permalink)
Ed H. Registered User Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Oakley Ca Posts: 247	i have never heard anything good about a harbor freight welder, i have worked with lincoln and miller and both worked excellent mig and tig, 1. What are you going to be welding? 2. How often are you going to use the welder? it could be cheaper to have someone do it, or borrow/rent one 3. Do you absolutely need/want a mig welder? stick welders are cheaper and easier to come by, they weld thicker materials in price comparison to a mig machine. I have seen some really nice welds dont by a stick welder as well it just takes practice. __________________ i am pretty much open to anything, atleast until i get lockers.

02-28-2009, 04:10 PM	#3 (permalink)
tc Contributing Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Longmont, CO Posts: 8,372	Garage sale, Craigslist, and pawn shops are great places to look for a welder. Stick to the name brands - Miller and Lincoln. I think Hobart welders are built by Miller. I would really recommend getting a 220V 180A or bigger welder for the kind of fabrication we do for our trucks. __________________ Check out www.coTTORA.org to hook up with great Toyota 'wheelin' folks! Current - 93 4Runner: 3VZ 33"x10.50" no lift ARB F/R 96 Impala SS: My own personal cop car Previous - 89 2WD Pickup 22R, Fabtech "Ivan Dan" lift, 31x10.50, IASCA World Finals 4th Place Stop with the mods and get on the trail! Pix at www.4wheelingoh.shutterfly.com/action

02-28-2009, 04:56 PM	#4 (permalink)
waskillywabbit Super Moderator-Sponsoring Member Staff Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Tuscaloosa, AL Posts: 14,546	Type WELDER in here Lots of varying opinions on welders, but stick with a name brand. __________________ WabFab Off-Road, LLC MySpace Twitter Facebook 7th Annual South East 4Runner Jamboree, 2010 The toughest part of a Jeep is the chick driving it. WabFab Off-Road 4th Anniversary Sale

04-20-2009, 09:47 AM	#7 (permalink)
saitotiktmdog Contributing Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Indiana Posts: 679	Hobart 187 mig Welder. Anyone have one or used one? I ordered one from TSC. Was tired of trying to fool with upside down stick welding. __________________ 1994 toyota 4x4. 22re turbo (sds em4, intercooler, steedspeed manifold, garrett t3) 4 inch procomp stage two lift front, t-bar crank(small), trail gear 4 inch rear lift with 6" shackles. ARB bull bar and warn winch, Quick lock rear, tru trac front 35x12.50 Pro-Comp Mud Terrains, 5.29 gears, snorkel, rock sliders Planned mods. , T-case gears, ditch ifs Beware the groove Man, its a shame when folks be throwin away a perfectly good white boy like that.

04-20-2009, 10:54 AM	#9 (permalink)
904_runner Registered User Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Chico, California Posts: 3,782	I don't have a problem with flux core. I ended up buying a lincoln 140c and i really love that little welder. __________________ Mike 1990 4runner: 3.4 swapped, 5-speed, sas'd, Rear leaf swap, Locked, 5.29's, 39.5" iroks on Beadlocks, Armor'd Longfields, Duals coming soon: My build thread http://www.yotatech.com/f152/904_run...thread-158746/ http://www.treadlightly.org/ http://www.pirate4x4.com/tech/billav...ery/index.html

02-28-2009, 10:00 PM	#6 (permalink)
yotaofdoom11 Registered User Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: SLO Town Posts: 6	if the welder is just ment for fab work on your rig 110v with high amp output will do you just fine, just remember the thicker the material you may have to prep your steel a little differently rather than just tacking and burning wire. If your mind is set on heavier fab work a 220v machine is what you want. Lincoln, Miller, or Hobart, cant go wrong with either one of those three.

04-20-2009, 12:09 PM	#10 (permalink)
toyNG Registered User Join Date: May 2008 Location: Redlands, CA Posts: 563	look on craigslist. Because of the economy, tons of people are selling their non-essentials. I guess welders are not essential to most people, since I've seen a bunch of them on craigslist lately. __________________ 1986 pickup 4x4 SR5, 5-spd, 33x10.5 BFG KM1 muds, 2" body lift, front and rear lockrights, 4.88s, 4.7 t-case with Dave'z twin stick, BudBuilt crossmember with 1" drivetrain lift, Downey grille guard and skid plate, TG sliders Still needed: rear bumper (Marlin, TG, or Dave'z)

04-20-2009, 03:15 PM	#11 (permalink)
wyoming9 Contributing Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: I live in New Tripoli Pa out in the woods Posts: 262	Not knowing your age and economic status I don`t know if you have an account with any of the tool truck people. Long time ago I bought my first welder from Matco tools it was built by Century and still going strong. 25 plus years later. I would say get the biggest output wise you can afford. You can cry about how hard it is to stick weld but they are so flexible you can go from 3/32 electrode for steel to a cast iron electrode to a stainless steel electrode. while you are still changing out that first spool of wire.

04-21-2009, 08:13 AM	#12 (permalink)
slcpunk74 Registered User Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: SL,UT Posts: 125	The hobart is a good welder (140 or 187) but I went with the lincoln 180 because the spool gun for aluminum was a lot cheaper. Miller makes a good welder that a fab buddy of mine uses and its just a plain 180 self set. It just comes down to what you will use it for. I have been doing more and more tubing lately and all I can say is if you can get the 180 mig then do it but if not just make do with the 140 because I can rarely find tubing that I need more juice then a 140 would do. Get gas for whatever you buy... Better looking welds will leave a positive note on the project and make you feel more professional. __________________ 1994 yoda jd fab lt front,62" deaver back,full glass, and kings. 1997 xj the DD/prerunner 1974 bronco 5.8 EFI 4r70w np205 "IN PROGRESS" With the navigation arrow pointed straight at Ihop Aunt Jamaima really likes me cause my syrup is so hot!

04-21-2009, 12:01 PM	#14 (permalink)
wyoming9 Contributing Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: I live in New Tripoli Pa out in the woods Posts: 262	Yes you can run a self shielded wire. I have heard that it has gotten a lot better since it first came out. i just am not a big fan of it.

04-21-2009, 07:44 PM	#16 (permalink)
slcpunk74 Registered User Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: SL,UT Posts: 125	Here is a link to a buddies build. Most all the welding was done with a miller 180... Nothing special but it just works good. It all comes down to skill and the mig has the versatility to make anyone a jack of "most" trades when it comes to welding. http://www.race-dezert.com/forum/showthread.php?t=54157 __________________ 1994 yoda jd fab lt front,62" deaver back,full glass, and kings. 1997 xj the DD/prerunner 1974 bronco 5.8 EFI 4r70w np205 "IN PROGRESS" With the navigation arrow pointed straight at Ihop Aunt Jamaima really likes me cause my syrup is so hot!

04-21-2009, 08:03 PM	#18 (permalink)
bigt Registered User Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: chippawa niagara falls ontario Posts: 3,200	me too im using the flux cored sire cause my lincoln mig pak has it in it but once its up ill get the stuff for gas.. it works good worknig on body work.. i have a sand blaster and a grinder to clean welds __________________ 1991 HILUX SURF SSR-X turbo diesel right hand drive toyota imported in 2005 from japan, 130,000 km 31 bfg a/t auto current build 1987 LWB suzuki samurai. turning 2 into one.. yota axles welded front to back, yota springs , ifs steering box,, this bad boy will not only eat jeeps but toyotas aswell \m/

04-21-2009, 08:20 PM	#20 (permalink)
scuba Registered User Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: WHEELIN BIG BEAR Posts: 6,968	I wasnt trying to sounds like an expert, I was simply stating as much as i knew.. And my kart is not my first project. Also I just finished my second project old man. __________________ Screw you guys I'm goin to TTORA Mods, please be mature and leave my sig alone, thanks. No, I will not be your friend.

04-21-2009, 08:22 PM	#21 (permalink)
86toylet Banned 'cause I was 4runnerchevy also banned Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Santa Cruz Mountains Posts: 196	Another weld Topic ! OK, Flux core (FCAW), set up right, will penetrate better then mild steel (with gas) MIG (GMAW). Scuba: You can do anything with a TIG as long as its AC/DC (aluminum, steel, titanium, 4130, you name it). Choice, get a mig its easier. Set yourself up for Flux and shielded welding. If you can afford it (and have the supply)buy a 220 machine with a minimum of 50% duty cycle.

04-21-2009, 09:16 PM	#23 (permalink)
CyMoN Registered User Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: INDIANA Posts: 2,164	stay clear of the CHItown electric welders from harbor freight AkA china mart. I used one and the welds are still holding a year later but it was a major pain compared to the Lincoln 140 I have now it is at least 300 times better and 400$ more,I could only imagine how nice it would be to get my hands on a high end Miller. another thing to think of when buying a welder a empty 40lbs or 50lbs tank to buy is going to cost you around 160$ new. I had a co2 tank but i had to buy a adapter for my gas regulator to fit my 100% co2 tank and it ran me 17$ buy the large 12 lbs roll of wire you will save about 20 bucks compared to the 2 lbs rolls. OFN is a good place to find info on welders and a good source to learn about metal fabrication. __________________ my rigs 89 4runner 1989 4runner v6 5 speed everything factory +4susplift running bfg 31s and a aux gas tank and more aux lights than needed 86 pickup 1986 stock pickup 22r 31.10 BFG ATs flatbed a sad day for the 4runner "One moment of patience may ward off great disaster. One moment of impatience may ruin a whole life."

04-22-2009, 02:02 AM	#24 (permalink)
wyoming9 Contributing Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: I live in New Tripoli Pa out in the woods Posts: 262	I would guess if you never learned to weld in the SMAW process that ones welds could look pretty bad out of position. There is no reason for that. If at all possible spend the money go to school learn the basics. I see so many GMAW welds with cold lap sometimes on both legs. If you really want to get picky all metals can also be welded in the SMAW process if one really had to and had the correct electrodes on hand. You can never have enough welders just like you never seem to have enough clamps and grinders.

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