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Question about spring length and weight for no-cut Zuk mod.
My 1986 stock (not lifted) pickup is sagging in the rear (measurements below), and I'm hoping to do a no-cut Zuk mod. I have a few questions.
I would like to return my truck to stock riding height in the rear, but also be able to support the fiberglass camper shell and gear in the back (I've built a living set up in there with mattress, etc).
1. What size and weight of springs should I get for the mod? I will be purchasing Black Magic Springs. I heard that #125 at 11-13" is ideal, but I'm unsure about what would be the best length for a stock ride height, as I won't be cutting into the frame at all.
2. I am replacing my rear shocks at the same time, hoping to go with Bilstein 4600s, which from what I understand are a replacement for the stock, non-lifted trucks. Would these be a good length choice if I return the rear to a stock height with the Zuk mod?
Thanks.
Measurements of sag (photo below):
Rear: Center of hub to trim: 18.5", Gap between bump stop: 2"
Front: Center of hub to trim: 21.75"
I did it a couple of years ago. I used Jeep Wrangler springs that were take offs from a 4x4 shop. They sold them on eBay. I paid $9.99 but I see them going for more these days. IIRC they were about 14" or 16" but we cut them down to 12" with a $14 Harbor Freight grinder. I also used their McPherson Strut compressors that cost about $30. I was going for stock appearance and it really gave it that. My tips are to do one side at a time. Jack it up by the frame rail so the leaf spring sags. Also use a jack stand on some scrap timber. You put a jack between the leaf and the body to widen the separation. Compress the Zuk spring as much as you can and insert it. IIRC there was also a big hammer involved. The ride is no worse than before.
On your second question I have replacement length shocks. They are Gabriel Max Control. They are silver with no decals so they look like Bilsteins. I have Bilsteins on two other Toyotas and they're kind of stiff. The Gabriels are supposed to be similar to stock. They are cheaper.
Why not get OME medium springs and shocks and skip the Zuk mod? It will fix the sagging and carry the load.
I don't know much about zuk mods, which was actually the reason I clicked on this post, hoping to learn more about them. But, I have tried several things to attempt to level various toyota trucks. I love my toyotas and have owned and driven toyotas since I first got my drivers license over twenty years ago, but their suspension has always been toyotas weak point. I realize that a lot of people regularly drive their trucks empty and seldom carry a load, so they have considerably less issues, but I always have a load in mine and neither stock springs nor OME springs will hold anywhere near level (actually only had OMEs on a Tacoma, but assuming that the ones for an older toyota are not any stiffer). I usually have a spare twenty gallon fuel tank, loaded tool box and a dog box with half a dozen 40-50 lb hounds in the back of my truck; plus they get more miles pulling a small trailer than not. I have broken springs absolutely every time I have ever tried add-a-leafs so I absolutely will not recommend them; if you have a load in your truck and drive it anywhere you are flexing the suspension regularly, and it doesn't have to be wheeling (going over waterbars or potholes at any speed is as bad or worse) you will eventually break the longer springs where they bend over the end of the add-a-leaf. I've had a custom spring set made by an outfit in Oregon that I don't believe is any longer in business; they worked better, slight sag after a couple years, but not as bad as factory. Tried a couple different aftermarket spring packs, but they are either too soft from the get go (improved ride and suspension flex on an empty truck are what they are usually designed for) or very quickly (within months) develop a sag. I've even put larger lift springs (superlift) in a truck that I lifted, and lift springs are even worse for being soft and sagging than factory height. I have seen pretty good results from airbags and was thinking about going with them in my 89 (which has a flatbed, which in addition to the regular load is heavier than the stock aluminum can bed) but was reading up on zuk mods because a)air bags are expensive and b) can be punctured by sticks. On the plus side I know several guys who have went with them and are very happy with the flexibility of being able to add or release air depending on the load in their truck that day.
In short this long winded diatribe is to say that while OME springs are quality they aren't stiff enough to hold up if the author of the original post is going to be hauling that much of a load.
I don't know much about zuk mods, which was actually the reason I clicked on this post, hoping to learn more about them. But, I have tried several things to attempt to level various toyota trucks. I love my toyotas and have owned and driven toyotas since I first got my drivers license over twenty years ago, but their suspension has always been toyotas weak point. I realize that a lot of people regularly drive their trucks empty and seldom carry a load, so they have considerably less issues, but I always have a load in mine and neither stock springs nor OME springs will hold anywhere near level (actually only had OMEs on a Tacoma, but assuming that the ones for an older toyota are not any stiffer). I usually have a spare twenty gallon fuel tank, loaded tool box and a dog box with half a dozen 40-50 lb hounds in the back of my truck; plus they get more miles pulling a small trailer than not. I have broken springs absolutely every time I have ever tried add-a-leafs so I absolutely will not recommend them; if you have a load in your truck and drive it anywhere you are flexing the suspension regularly, and it doesn't have to be wheeling (going over waterbars or potholes at any speed is as bad or worse) you will eventually break the longer springs where they bend over the end of the add-a-leaf. I've had a custom spring set made by an outfit in Oregon that I don't believe is any longer in business; they worked better, slight sag after a couple years, but not as bad as factory. Tried a couple different aftermarket spring packs, but they are either too soft from the get go (improved ride and suspension flex on an empty truck are what they are usually designed for) or very quickly (within months) develop a sag. I've even put larger lift springs (superlift) in a truck that I lifted, and lift springs are even worse for being soft and sagging than factory height. I have seen pretty good results from airbags and was thinking about going with them in my 89 (which has a flatbed, which in addition to the regular load is heavier than the stock aluminum can bed) but was reading up on zuk mods because a)air bags are expensive and b) can be punctured by sticks. On the plus side I know several guys who have went with them and are very happy with the flexibility of being able to add or release air depending on the load in their truck that day.
In short this long winded diatribe is to say that while OME springs are quality they aren't stiff enough to hold up if the author of the original post is going to be hauling that much of a load.
You used the wrong OMEs then? I mean like half of Australia uses them and have beds full of crap
I do agree if you have constant variable loads that an airbag setup would be kinda cool.
Just last week I did a Zuk mod for my truck (1994 4wd xtra cab, 22RE) in a slightly (or radically) different way from what I've read on various posts about it.
Instead of going the other brands coil springs way, I sourced a pair of 2nd gen 4Runner rear coil springs and used those, as I figured, both my truck and a 4runner have simliar vehicle weight. My truck wasn't sagging, but my objective was to slightly increase somewhat its payload capacity and minimize rear sagging when hauling heavy stuff. In short, lend it a hand when hauling.
So those 4runner coil springs, we cut 1 1/2 turn off each of them, and simply positioned them (while having the truck lifted on a platform) between the leafs and the frame, without needing to compress them. When lowering the truck, its weight compresses them and keeps them in place.
This way, the truck gained aproximately 6 cm worth of lift, which I wager is exactly what I'm substracting of sag when loading it up. I'll later post a photo to illustrate visual results.
Just last week I did a Zuk mod for my truck (1994 4wd xtra cab, 22RE) in a slightly (or radically) different way from what I've read on various posts about it.
Instead of going the other brands coil springs way, I sourced a pair of 2nd gen 4Runner rear coil springs and used those, as I figured, both my truck and a 4runner have simliar vehicle weight. My truck wasn't sagging, but my objective was to slightly increase somewhat its payload capacity and minimize rear sagging when hauling heavy stuff. In short, lend it a hand when hauling.
So those 4runner coil springs, we cut 1 1/2 turn off each of them, and simply positioned them (while having the truck lifted on a platform) between the leafs and the frame, without needing to compress them. When lowering the truck, its weight compresses them and keeps them in place.
This way, the truck gained aproximately 6 cm worth of lift, which I wager is exactly what I'm substracting of sag when loading it up. I'll later post a photo to illustrate visual results.
You know those whoops in the road that if you're not watching give you a bit of a butterfly feeling in your gut?
What do you think happens to this spring you placed between the axel and frame when you hit one of these?
Kill someone... how?
Hundreds of 1st gen owners have done the Zuk mod... I've never read, or heard of any kind of failure of the spring coming out...
Wow!
So, i quit posting on any forums because of the stupid things people say...i thought the last forum I'd hear such ridiculous claims would be on the 1st gen forum...
See y'all...
Last edited by 87-4runner; 03-27-2019 at 10:41 AM.
Why not get OME medium springs and shocks and skip the Zuk mod? It will fix the sagging and carry the load.
If I had the budget and time (adventure gets in the way of funds and time to make the truck pretty), I might consider the OME's but then I'll have to mess with the front to level it. Meanwhile, my Zuk mod has been working well for me.
Originally Posted by ev13wt
It will pop out and kill someone, that is what will happen.
My springs are not going anywhere, but ugly truck has been going to pretty places since I bought it in 2012.
Not a zuk or a debate.
It's a way too small spring or he wouldn't have been able to just slip it in uncompressed. This means when the frame floats at the top this too short spring is just floating around and is hopefully holding onto one of the bump stops.
There are lots of ways to do a good Zuk-mod, but this isn't one of them.
Well, those coil springs worked flawlessly during a +1000 km road trip, carrying +650 kg on the truck bed, truck barely sagged an inch. Without a load, truck is even front and back:
BEFORE:
NOW:
However, after unloading the truck, there has been "some" evident floating around (they probably haven't uncompressed fully), but only from the lower part of the springs (where they sit on the leaf springs). Everytime I've stopped to check, they sit perfectly where they sat just after installation. So probably, they are only bouncing a bit at their base, as the upper part is firmly held around the top bump and the frame.
Here are some photos:
As can be noticed, we had to somewhat bend upwards the lines just above the end of the passenger side spring coil.
Now, I'm not saying this is the safest way to do the Zuk mod, but I seriously doubt it will ever "pop out". As I stated, we drove more than a thousand km at highway speeds with heavy load; we already drove offroad without any load, and it only bounced somewhat in the way I described. I'm just sharing my experience on using a pair of 4runner coil springs for a Zuk mod.
Thanks for the replies, everyone. I'm hoping to do a Zuk mod to hold me over until I can afford leaf springs. Still unsure about what size spring to get. Seems to be either 11 or 12" is best. Any suggestions?
Originally Posted by se7enine
Why not get OME medium springs and shocks and skip the Zuk mod? It will fix the sagging and carry the load.
I would love to replace them with OME stuff, but I can't afford new shocks and new leafs at the same time. I was hoping to do the Zuk to hold me over until I can get new leafs. Maybe OME shocks and then add leafs when I can?
I may be able to make it work, though.. Can you send a link of where I can go to buy OME stock replacement kits for an 86? I'm having a bit of trouble finding where to buy them//how much they'll cost.
This is interesting. Are people inadvertently fixing a "sag" that is actually stock? I can't imagine that 2" between the bumpstop is normal for these trucks. I can clearly see on mine that they have hit before.
03-24-2019, 01:48 PM
