bamachem

You need to read this, print off a copy, take it with you and request that the Dealer PROVE to you that the ARB Locker CAUSED the ring gear to break. If they can't PROVE that the mods caused the failure, and they STILL deny you warranty coverage, then they are in violation of Federal Statutes.

http://www.magnusonproducts.com/magnusonmoss.htm

Biff

Great info. I'll have to keep a copy of that when I go to the stealer next.

LarsDennert

That is useful but not applicable if the axle was not reassembled properly. That would point to negligence of the installer.

ahriman

thanx andy! i thought i was dead in the water, now i have another avenue to explore!

ok, so i am back home now and the rig was fine on the return trip. i basically went w/o tunes the whole way back because i wanted to listen for any weirdness -- i am so paranoid.... whattan odyssey...

bamachem

True, but ONLY if the dealer can PROVE that the ARB was installed incorrectly or that it in itself was the cause or contributed to the problem. They admitted that they had never worked on a rear third w/ an ARB installed, so I seriously doubt that they could be considered experts on whether or not it was properly done. If they can't PROVE it, then they can't deny coverage.

Good Times

glad to hear you're back home michael.

Biff

Michael, I would do that maybe you can get your money back on the install from that dealer.

bamachem

You can also argue that they offered a e-locker for the toyota 8" rear end for years in the taco's and 3rd gens and therefore their argument of "the rear end wasn't made for a locker" becomes invalid on principle.

bwillie

Glad to here that you made it home in one peice. I am glad that we got to meet up with you guys at the "crack" so we could see it in action. Did they say that it was caused by the shimming (or lack there of)?

bulldog-yota

Good to hear you are back home, no go sort out the guys who installed your locker and the dealer. Let us know what happened.

ahriman

the truck is running fine now, the ring and pinion appear to have been installed correctly. the locker seems to engage ok, so at least the truck is in good shape.

i have made the first attempts at a warranty claim, toyota "customer care" says they cannot do anything except facilitate communication between me and the dealership, so it appears they are pitting us against one another. the rep even mentioned i may want to get a 3rd party involved, hmm, wonder what their position is?

bulldog-yota

SO what did the installer say?

Good luck with the dealer.

sschaefer3

If you put it on a Credit Card you may want to dispute the charge and use the CC company as the 3rd Party.

Also som ammo against the dealer. I know 2 Toyota Master Techs with 12+ and 25+ years of experience. If the R&P goes out they would get a prebuilt 3rd from Japan. What I'm getting at is that will all the time these guys put in, neither have set up gears. They would always order the pre-setup stuff.

With the ARB that was not possible. So there is a good chance the guy who set yours up was reading the Service Manual the entire time.

Maybe he got it right, maybe he did not. Possibly you want to present this to the dealer and ask how many R&P's the Tech has setup in his life and question the work.

The best gear guys I have met all worked at "aftermarket" type 4WD places and have always done so many they could do them in there sleep.

LarsDennert

That's a good point. Besides the fact takes really good care in building and matching parts, the master techs time is probably equivalent to just buying another 3rd.

There are plenty of aftermarket techs that don't have a clue too. It's like rolling the dice if you don't know someone.

ahriman

ok, let us assume for the moment the shop who installed the locker did it incorrecly, i.e. caused the damage. then how does one approach the shop to get them to fess up? exactly what are they fessing? i guess one question i could ask is: have you done this before? but they already assured me they have and they come highly recommended, so i guess the next question is how did you do it? by the shop manual? toyota's? arb's? both? the wear pattern on the teeth appears to be slightly toward the heel (see here ) of the ring, and you would assume the factory shimmed it correctly to get the wear in the middle, so maybe that is where to start with the shop.

steve, good suggestion. i will ask the cc company tomorrow what my options are.

Flygtenstein

I would agree this is not warranty work. It appears pretty straightforward that someone messed with the gears after the factory which shifts the liability to them.

I would call the shop, show them the teeth and tell them to make it right.

Someone with more experience than me could look at that and say pinion was set too deep or bearings were not torqued evenly.

Most dealers do not set gears.

FirstToy

Michael, first let me say good luck with everything.

I think Steve had a good suggestion with the CC. I had a wheel dispute (set of wheels were out of round) and the shop said it was the wheel co's fault. The wheel co. didn't do anything and said they were "straight"= the runaround.

I went to my CC company and they had me do a written explaination, receipts, etc. a couple months later, I was refunded my money. It took a ton of hassle off me chasing down the wheel place, etc.

Anything with regards to expert written opinion to include with your CC company docs would help your case since this is a very technical issue and your CC co investigator won't know truth from fiction when they call the involved parties.

Flygtenstein

The way I read what Steve says is despute the dealer charge with the guys who did the ARB install.

If you could get the dealer to cover something that is presumably the ARB guys fault, you are a better man that me.

Robinhood150

You might want to post your pictures on pirate and ask the opinions of the gear experts there. You may have a 4th gen, but gear carnage isn't really a newbie question. Just be prepared for flames...just in case.

ahriman

yep, i have been a lurking member there for just that reason. but they will have to accept us some time...

ZUK

iTrader: (1)

ahriman----I already responded to the POR post......what you are finding is that a shop that can do a good install is a hit/miss thing......many shops are not aware of how important carrier bearing pre-load is. Your damage is on the heel....so typical of deflections. Here's what happens....you are climbing up something...putting increased loading on the ring gear tooth. Normally not an issue with tight carrier bearings but when loose or perhaps only snug, the ring gear walks away from the pinion..... the contact pressure point walks towards the heel and to the tip then kaboom. So, by tightening the hell out of the carrier bearings, the ring deflections can be minimized. How tight? 50~100 ft/lbs. Yes, the bearings will live a long and happy life with that kinda pre-load.
So why don't you quiz the installer and casually ask how he sets the CB pre-load and how tight. And see how vague his answer is. Go to my webpage and read the top 4 or 5 links....I even mention CB pre-load numerous times there ZUK

PS----I think you're kinda screwed trying to prove that the install was bad....but I could be wrong.

ahriman

whatever the result, thanx for the input zuk. i appreciate the effort you have put into this. i will read your site and see what this provides as well.

the real zinger is that his shop came highly recommended by an org i trust!