Intermittent NO start.
 

Vehicle: 1991 Toyota 4Runner/ 22RE/ 4WD

Problem: A few months ago my 4runner started not starting. It would click (sound like a click from the starter) every time I would turn the key in the ignition. But sometimes it would actually turn over and start right up like normal. It would go days without doing this or it would do this every other time I shut it off.

History: I replaced the starter (with the upgraded OEM Toyota starter) and installed a new battery. After this it seemed to be good for a week or so then started doing the same thing.

I thought it was a low Voltage issue as the battery was in the low 12v range (about 12.1v at one point). Since charging the battery with my battery tinder it seemed to fix it.. I decided to bring it to the local shop to troubleshoot a draw in the system and any other possible starting issue it might have.
The shop said they found a draw on my master window switch. I had them replace it with a used one I got from my father-in-law. They charged the system and couldn't find any other issues.

That seemed to fix it for about two weeks.

I then brought the car to the local auto parts place to have a charging system/load test on it. It passed with no issues.


So here I am wondering what to do next. Could it be the starter relay? I could hear a click and I think the one click is coming from the starter...

This issues has deemed my once rock solid 4runner unreliable. Please help!

The Starter Relay does fail. Usually cleaning the contacts will help but does not alway fix it. https://www.yotatech.com/forums/f199...l#post51994693

I got tired of the click only and used Rads fix for it https://www.yotatech.com/forums/f199...l#post51975700 never has failed me since.

Thanks! Now I just need to locate it. Some say drivers kick panel and some say by fuse/relay box under hood on battery side. I have a manual so I'll find it.

I just about replaced every other thing it could be except for relay and ignition switch.

It is the box on the left side of the picture on the passenger fender, closest to the firewall.

Attachment 120919

Awesome! I'll check that out this weekend. Thanks!

This problem is been ongoing to this day. It's almost winter and I really want to fix this before it starts to snow in another month or so.

I have re-build the new starter: both solenoid contacts and starter motor brushes. My battery tested good. When it happens I get a normal *click* (just one click every time I turn the key).. then nothing. I repeat this process multiple times with no of the starter motor turning. I tried tapping on the starter motor with no luck. I try starting it about 30 times (at this point I'm worried the battery is getting low). And randomly it decides to start! (A healthy quick turn of the starter motor as it should).

My guess at this point is either the ignition switch or cable going to the starter motor. I checked and verified the cable connections to the starter.. all clean and tight. Sometimes it'll start right up and sometimes it nearly kills the battery with all the attempts to start. It doesn't matter if it's cold or hot.. Please help!

I'm pretty sure a Hot Shot remote starter relay kit will do the trick. It almost seems like a resistance issue at the relay. And instead of buying a $70 OEM starter Relay, I might just upgrade the Relay (low resistance relay) and upgrade all the cables (Power, Ground, and signal). After doing more research, it seems other people with '86 to '92 Toyota (22re) have similar issues as me and sometimes decide to opt for the bypass method. Also, My starter relay is located behind the drivers kicker panel by the fuse block.. I was thinking about routing the ignition signal wire (white/black) by extending it to the passenger fender behind the battery and setting up the relay under the hood like the early models and going with 8 AWG and maybe #2 on the power lead.

Vehicle: 1991 Toyota 4Runner 22RE 5speed manual 4X4

Recap: Vehicle will not start at times, just a strong click every time and eventually starts right up after 50+ attempts. Not a battery voltage issue. Replaced and rebuilt new starter with no correction to original issue.

Update: Brought it to the Toyota dealership and they determined it was a bad starter.. they replaced the new/rebuilt factory starter with another Toyota OEM starter. I noticed the issue wasn't corrected the moment I tried picking it up from the dealership and it wouldn't start. Round 2 at the dealership they determined the new starter they just installed was defective so they replaced it with another Toyota OEM starter.. a couple days later it started doing the same thing! 3 new Toyota OEM starters and I request their best master mechanic to troubleshoot the issue. Round 3 and they kept it for a full week while their "master" mechanic looked over the starting issue (and yes, he was able to duplicate the issue). He determined the door control module was somehow causing the issue.. I would get a random clicking sound from under the dash at times I thought was a completely separate issue that only affected the power window/lock system. There was a contact issue on the control module plug that would blow the fuse rendering my power windows and locks to not work. I found the exact module on ebay and it did the same thing. He suggested I keep it unplugged if it gets too bad so I don't experience the no start issue. I tried keeping it unplugged.. I didn't have power windows or locks, but the electrical clicking from the module went away, but the intermittent no start was still happening. Now in the hotter weather it seems to happen almost every time!

Work-around: When the vehicle wouldn't start I would have to try a couple methods to get it to start: 1.) Bump starter by banging on it with a wooden stick. 2.) jump start (even though the battery voltage is good and passed load test, it seems to do the trick). 3.) Bump starter by popping the clutch while in gear with a little push or rolling down hill.
I would thing that it's obviously the starter, but after 3 new starters I'm confident the issue lies somewhere else. The Toyota dealership supposedly determined it isn't the starter relay or ignition system, but the issue was never corrected.. so I'm not so convinced on what they think it is or isn't at this time.

I can only speculate at this time and my next instinctive move is to focus on the ignition switch.. mine is so worn out that the key falls out sometimes. I know the key tumbler doesn't directly affect the starting unless the key can't turn. So I need more guidance on what to check or focus on next. I don't want to completely bypass my ignition system to the starter, but I'm about ready to. This has cost me nearly $1,000.00 in this issue and I'm not willing to dump more money into it unless I'm 100% sure. I have since purchased a reliable commuter, but the 4Runner will always stay and will be used in the winter when we get snow. or when I want to do a little wheeling. Thanks!

Post too wordy
 

POST TOO LONG TO READ.
A dealership that says door control module has something to do with starting and could not solve a problem for 2 years is a STEALERship.

Let's eat the elephant a little bit at a time. Check
EXACTLY what;s clicking when you try to start?
Starter relay? Starter solenoid? Does the starter solenoid click energetically? Did you do this check?

Did you check as Terry suggested above?
Do you have schematic of your truck so we can check if it was wired wrong at the factory like the 1986-1988 4Runners were?

Thanks for your reply. The issue started just a few months after replacing my battery. I had it tested with a load test.. O'rileys says it's good. I figured it isn't a battery issue because after multiple attempts it would usually start right up. When I checked it this morning my battery voltage was at 12.24V. I setup my battery tender to charge the battery this morning.

The 'Clicking' noise is coming from the starter solenoid. I can only guess the plunger is fully extending but not spinning.

My starter relay is located behind the drivers side kicker panel. It's a green plastic square relay and I'm pretty sure I replaced it last year. This is a project I rarely have time to address, but I'm fed up with my rig being unreliable for this one issue. I have the Factory Toyota repair manual (Vol.2).. I don't have Vol.1 that addresses the starting system.

Sorry for having such a long post.. It's a 1991 Toyota 4Runner 22RE 5spd 4x4. Had 3 OEM starters over the past 2 years. Battery tested good, starter relay was replaced (I'm 99% sure now), and wires from the starter and battery seem good (no corrosion or loose connection).

I just tried starting it after charging the battery to 13V. It started right up! At this point I would say it's the battery, of course... but in the past it has had no problem turning over after multiple attempts or a little bump/hit to the starter (especially in hot weather). Would it make sense it could still just be the battery? All other (older) vehicles I've owned in the past would turn over but slowly with low voltage. Could there be more to this issue such as too small gauge of wire to the starter/battery? or am I just over thinking it?

Attachment 109640

Here's a page from my factory manual, I know its the wrong year, but 4Runners and Pickups have minor differences if any. There are 3 switches/relays. 1. The clutch pedal switch might be getting stuck and slowly coming back out when while you are trying to start the truck with the pedal pressed. 2. The clutch start cancel switch, does the truck have one by chance? 3. The Starter relay is getting stuck, but since you are hearing a click, it would mean it's working, it could be bad. But it looks like you already had it replaced.

Other than those 3, I would say the engine isn't properly grounded, the ground wire behind your kick panel is loose or not clean, or you got something that frayed/damaged some wires. These truck are so old, you might wanna check your starter wires for corrosion. If the switch in the starter solonoid doesn't get enough electrical current to switch the starter over to grab power from the battery, then that might be a possibility I guess. A bad alternator can cause electrical problems too, but they mostly take out the battery if anything.

If you need something specific from my volume 1 manual, lemme know.

Attachment 109638

This is the troubleshooting page which lists other possibilities. One of em says faulty ignition switch, that was one of my other guesses as well, and more often than not, does happen. Worth a try if all else fails.

Thanks for this detailed response! This is what we need from everybody.

YES. First time I've heard of a starter relay in the kick panel. WTF was that Toyota engineer thinking? This means that, EVEN if it's wired right, power has to go over thin wires from battery, diagonally across the engine compartment, back through the firewall into cabin to kick panel, then back through the firewall to engine compartment, then DIAGONALLY ACROSS to where the starter is!
This problem and improper wiring of starter solenoid (on some models) may be masked by combination of healthy battery, good relay and switch contacts, smooth operation of starter solenoid plunger, light tension on starter solenoid plunger return spring. HENCE, INTERMITTENT.
If you want your cranking to be as reliable as my 1896's :) let's figure this out.

Could your truck be wired wrong like this V6 2989-1992 4Runner?
Do you have access to pins of your starter relay so we can check?
https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.yot...aefd134ba0.png


Let's find schematic for your exact year and model.

I was thinking the same thing, but with a good strong click coming from the starter solenoid I would have to think the starter relay and clutch switch is good. I do have a 'Clutch Start Cancel' switch and honestly never use it (I was always under the impression it's porous is to bump the starter when in gear without having to press down the clutch pedal). I thought about the alternator especially because it would just click and not start immediately after trying to start after a long trip. (i.e. after driving 3 hours I stop for gas and it doesn't want to start up again especially when it's hot out).

It seems the solenoid doesn't get enough current..but why. is it the wiring? I have no corrosion, but the guy I bought it from was a complete hack who would flip old Toyota's for a living. He had spliced into the wire harness to get the power windows to work instead of fixing the issue properly. I removed some splicing under the drivers dash after buying it and got the windows to work after replacing the master door switch.

Bottom line is there could be a ton of issues from grounding to an open in the system. I might be better off to replace my wire harness instead of working each and every bug out.

I'll trace out the system and see if there's anything obvious like a loose ground or an open in the system. Thanks for your reply!

WHOOOA! Slow down Then, you'll give us more work. - LOL!
How sure are you that you're gonna get a good harness?

Thanks cr@ves4wheelin!
There are very minor differences between models from 1988 to 1989, and some of them could cause exactly the problem we're looking into.
IF, and only IF, this schematic applies to O.P.'s then we know it is wired wrong from the factory. I explained it on my thread... or show this to your trusted electrical engineer.

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/dB...o=w585-h776-no

Other valid guesses:


Let's find exact schematic to O.P.'s truck AND verify by probing pins to starter relay.

Okay, well if you do find damaged wires, especially if he used those plastic clips with blades that cut into said wires to splice em together, then I would invest in a cheapo $20 soldering gun, and a roll of solder, and possibly some wire strippers. That's the only thing that's gonna give you a reliable wire connection. Anyways, take on the easy stuff before the hard stuff. My buddys tacoma had the same problem, and I swore up and down it was his shotty 3rd party security chip slot thing. Turned out to be a bad ignition switch. Good luck.

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.yot...df57991c66.jpgClose up of Starter Relay behind drivers kick panel inside vehicle.
https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.yot...7d4f41d57e.jpgoverview of fuse block inside vehicle (drivers kick panel) w/ starter relay removed.
Hope this helps. I must have an odd production year/model combo. Could it be a Japanese model vs US model thing? (My gas cap is located on the passenger side and I've seen others with it on the drivers side).

I'm in the process of removing the fuse block inside the vehicle so I can see/trace the wires behind the starter relay. Also, I don't think I ever got the 'Clutch Start Cancel' switch to work (it lights up, but doesn't allow me to turn over the starter without the clutch pressed)

I know it's kind of a pain, but could you look at post #13, and list off everything you checked/replaced that you are almost 100% sure is not the issue. Just wanna be on the same page, so we're not goin in circles.