shwuz

This is making me absolutely insane.

I know the valvetrain on the 22re is noisy, I can hear that. I can live with that. But that "tick, tick, tick" superimposed upon it is making me crazy.

The old guy at the place where I changed my oil was convinced it was the rear main bearing.

All the guys at the shop where I normally go think it is a single valve/rocker because of one worn lobe. They said the valve adjustment they did made it "much better". I didn't think it did.

My buddy at another shop says its totally normal, and not to worry about it.

Today at the toyota stealership (steering rod recall) they said it was "Heavy Valve Clatter (needs adjustment- 3hr). I said, "the valves were adjusted last week". They said, "oh, they were probably done wrong". That's possible, for sure. They need to be adjusted hot, right? I think they did it cold.

Anyway, getting to the point...

I was trying to use some hose to hear where the source of the noise was. Definitely not on the bottom end (oil pan, etc), and not so much on the very top of the valve cover. In fact, the loudest clicks I heard seemed to be coming from the space where the #2 and #3 sparkplugs are. Would that be consistent with the worn lobe? They did say it was #3 exhaust that was worn. And would a new camshaft in itself take care of that?

Here's the part that really screws with my head, that makes me doubt my conclusion that the problem is as simple as needing a new cam... The LOUDEST I ever hear this sound is with the hood closed, and then it seems to be coming from under the car, near the bellhousing. That just tweaks my brain.

Please someone give me some direction here, between this issue and the steering-rod recall I have literally spent 6 hours searching this forum today. Thanks a ton in advance!

trythis

Maybe it is an exhaust leak that is between the cat and the manifold, and it just sends the noise up the pipe to the manifold, or the other way around. That exhaust pipe runs under the frame. Maybe an exhaust mount it transfering the exhaust valve sound into the cab through that pipe hanger.

shwuz

Well, an exhaust leak is my second serious option I was considering. But its not particularly loud inside the cab, just standing next to the cab when its running.

Maybe I should do a cam and a header/catback? cover all my bases that way?

But seriously, I kind of need to pin this down best I can and fix it as efficiently as possible... Especially after getting that list from the stealership today of "unsafe" front-end components needing replacement.

ovrrdrive

They sell a stethoscope at Harbor Freight pretty cheap with a rod for listening to the engine like that.

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...emnumber=41966

I got one and modified it with some fuel line so I could actually hear sounds. I bought it to find a vacuum leak and after I used the hose I put my finger right on it.

One other remote possibility it that a rocker arm is tapping the valve cover. If the rubber grommets get crushed too badly they can allow a rocker to tap the cover. I had some marks on mine from that at one point or another.

The exhaust leak is a very distinct possibility... If a cat-back is in your pricerange it's not a bad idea. I'd probably change gaskets and retorque first though unless you just want a new exhaust.

Something else to consider is getting a remanufactured head with an aftermarket cam already in it. I got one from J and C Enterprises for $399 including shipping both ways (new head and core back). It has the engnbldr O/S SS valves, heavier springs, and a Crane Stage 2 cam in it. The Crane valve spec is a little tighter than the Toyota spec is (.008/.010 instead of .008/.012), and I have never, ever heard my engine run as quietly as it does right now in the 205k I have been running it.

I priced getting my head resurfaced with new stock valves at $260 locally, a remanufactured head off ebay for $300 + shipping, or this one from J and C for $399 including shipping.

I'm happy with my decision.

You have to pull the head anyway.

Here's the link to my head. I'm sure even if he doesn't have one at auction right now he can build you one.

link

Just another option...

shwuz

That's a good idea, overdrive... A little pricier than just the cam, but then you know it's all put together right. What about using the stock rockers and stuff with that? No issues there?


Only thing there, is I'm pretty sure all my head components are in pretty good shape, excepting the cam. No oil burn at all, not even a white puff on startup, so I'm reasonably certain I'm not losing any through my valve guides. I'd hate to fix it if it ain't broken... Of course, that's close to what I'm doing by thinking about throwing a cam at it when it's running just fine.

ovrrdrive

Well, my rockers supposedly only had 12k on them. It was a fresh rebuild engine.

If yours are worn too badly I'm sure it would be a good idea to get new ones too...

It really didn't make a huge difference in power. In fact you really can't tell much that I even got a hipo head.

Rather than run like a bigger engine, it runs like the same engine - but on a good day. It's running really good. There is a horsepower increase but I think it;s probably in the 10-15% range which really isn't that much.

The quieter valvetrain is nice though...

And like I said, if you loosen the head bolts to do the cam you have to remove the head and clean it and replace the gasket when you put it back on. If you fo that far it wouldn't be too hard to go ahead and replace the head.

A new cam will probably need new cam guides too in a worn head...


But as you know, sometimes when you fix things that aren't broken you break stuff.

shwuz

Yeah, you got that right (about breaking stuff)...

Another "problem" I run into... Once I look at close to $500 for a head and all the associated gear, I'm only looking at another $500 for a whole new reman engine!

That's why I'm trying to talk myself into just doing the cam... Maybe a header... Catback... All that front-end stuff, of course... Maybe a body lift.

Stupid slippery slope. :pat:

Flash319

I have the same tick that I can't find either. If you lift the hood it is not to bad and sometimes goes away if reved up and down. It is loudest outside the truck. All my head stuff checks out good. I have come up with 2 possibilities.
1. Oil pressure is low or passage blockage in the valve train causeing the tick.
2. Spark knock in one of the cylinders that could be caused by many things but from all the talk about these engines ticking, I think it is a known fuel map lean condition once the engine starts to ware. I think this is the actual problem.

I am just going to drive it until it gets worse and shows me what it is, or the engine goes by by.

shwuz

You know, I am very close to just doing that same thing. I make a couple of road trips to mexico each year though, and I'd hate for it to show me what it is somewhere in the middle of the sonoran desert.

spirtlanimilbus

the fuel injectoes are noisy also....

shwuz

Ok, listening carefully on my way home from work last night, it sure seems like it is loudest right after starting it up (like someone tapping on a can), then a bit quieter once I'm sitting in my driveway after the 5-mile freeway drive home...

That points towards an exhaust leak, right?

I guess since I have to pull the exhaust manifold no matter what route I take, I should start by replacing the gasket there and see if it clears some of the noise. Make sense?

kyle_22r

definitely sounds like an exhaust leak to me. it'll sound like a nasty valve tick, and get quieter as the engine warms up, due to the head and exhaust manifold expanding and sealing off the leak.

pull your manifold, and also remember to replace the exhaust donuts on the downpipe flange, if the bolts loosen at all they seem to burn out and make noise.

Toyopnoy

Definately an exhaust leak I have the same problem and am getting ready to put in my new headers and exhaust mani gasket. We'll see if that solves the problem...

stock87

Although things are pointing to an exhaust leak, I'll throw this in there...


Don't forget that the valve adjusters get a wear pattern in them that will lead to extra noise once they finally do get adjusted.

They are replaceable, PN# 9091305019, $2.41 apiece from http://www.1sttoyotaparts.com/ last I checked. Might as well replace all 8 before you go for a new head (if the exhaust leak doesn't check out).

Flash319

I may try changing the exhast manifold gasket but how does this cause a tick? It does not sound like escaping gas?

TNRabbit

I don't personally have a 22re but I've heard of the exhaust "tick" problem many times.

Also, as ovrrdrive mentioned above, tightening the valve covers down too much can make one or more of the rocker arms conact the cover and make a ticking sound. ensure your gaskets are thick enough and covers weren't overtorqued.

Several years ago I had a fried who owned an old old Yota pickup and it had the loudest dang engine I ever heard (ticking) but it ran like a scalded dog and didn'st seem to have any problems except for a humongous valve cover oil leak (I'm convinced the ticking would have been louder if not for the engine being covered in about an inch of oil-soaked crud!).

spirtlanimilbus

You Know The Egr Valve Can Also Make Noise If Its Leaking On The Valve Itself Or The Plumbing. Im Going To Guess If Its Not Exhaust Its Just Normal Wear And Tear.

Sonofmayhem

what about a tick when light throttle is applied, and you can feel it in your pedal on the clutch. especially when i shift, when i go to let the gas out it does it as soon as the pedal passes a certain point. i just replaced my exhaust manifold gasket and it helped but im worried that its the timing crap. Ive done it before, but its just Time consuming.

Sorry for the hijack.

spirtlanimilbus

throwout bearing, input shaft or pilot bearing worn out... ? im leaning towards the noise comming from the truck somewhere... id put money on that... :pat:

Sonofmayhem

well, i hope not! lol, its strange, but i also read if i have a leak before the O2 sensor, it makes the mix. richer and i can easily smell the damn stuff so im leaning towards exhaust. thanks.