Tuning Weber 32/26 on 22R went wrong. Engine Pressure Buildup
01-06-2014, 06:45 AM
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Tuning Weber 32/26 on 22R went wrong. Engine Pressure Buildup
I was tuning the weber 32/26 carb on my 87 pickup 22R, I had all the screws set to the starting point and when I turned the engine on it sounded like I had the gas pedal fully engaged, I couldn't stop it from idling that loud and it didn't look like exhaust was escaping out the muffler. I suddenly noticed oil coming up through the PCV valves and I cut the engine to check out what was going on. I found where two vacuum lines somehow came loose, once I got those plugged back in the truck seemed to run ok, I made the tuning adjustments, drove it around the block and it ran fine, the vacuum compression was around 4-5. However, I worked on some other items (non engine stuff) for a few hours and when I went to drive the truck home it ran really high idle again, high enough where I thought it would blow when it wasn't in gear. I just left it in the garage and drove my other car home.
I am wondering if I would of messed anything up with the engine oil coming up through the PCV valves or if that is ok as long as I fix the buildup issue? I think this time one of the adjustment screws on the carb is out of whack, I don't think its a vacuum issue this time around. However, I want to make sure I don't need to take the cylinder block off to clean up anything since the oil overflow?
Anyone else have an issue like this before?
Thanks
I am wondering if I would of messed anything up with the engine oil coming up through the PCV valves or if that is ok as long as I fix the buildup issue? I think this time one of the adjustment screws on the carb is out of whack, I don't think its a vacuum issue this time around. However, I want to make sure I don't need to take the cylinder block off to clean up anything since the oil overflow?
Anyone else have an issue like this before?
Thanks
01-06-2014, 07:25 AM
#2
From this thread:
https://www.yotatech.com/forums/f120...2-36-a-240521/
Other helpful links:
Subject: weber carb info
weber carb tuning:
http://www.clutchkitcenter.com/media...weber/K610.pdf
˟
http://board.marlincrawler.com/index.php?topic=62976.0
˟
trouble shooting guide:
http://www.webercarbsdirect.com/v/vs...ng%20Guide.pdf
˟
carb adjustment guide:
http://www.cjclub.co.il/files/Weber3236adjust.pdf
˟
jetting:
http://www.bmw2002faq.com/content/view/62/32/
˟
parts diagram/exploded view:
http://www.redlineweber.com/html/Tec..._breakdown.htm
http://www.webercarbsdirect.com/v/vs...3236DGAVEV.pdf
˟
˟
carb set up and lean best idle set up:
http://www.redlineweber.com/html/Tec...lean_best_.htm
˟
˟
https://www.yotatech.com/forums/f120...2-36-a-240521/
Someone please sticky this.
NOTE: This ONLY goes for the 32/36 DGV/DGEV/DGAV etc series of carburetors not the 38.
This procedure assumes no modifications have been done internally to the carburetor. Including but not limited to primary and secondary main jets, air corrector jets.
It also assumes you have no vacuum leaks ANYWHERE including the popular two-piece adapter that typically comes with the kits. I HIGHLY suggest using the Transdapt 1 piece adapter. Others have had decent results with the LCE spiral adapter as well, even though that is also a two-piece unit. Easy way to test for vacuum leaks at the adapter is to spray carb cleaner in and around the entire base of the carburetor. If a change in idle (usually a stumble) is noticed then the adapter is leaking air into the engine and needs to be fixed before any accurate tune is achieved.
Other common areas for vacuum leaks are Valve cover gasket, oil pan gasket and timing cover gaskets.
It is important to follow all linkage and lever installation instructions. The number one and two reasons for tuning errors are improper linkage installations and over tightened linkage nut, causing a binding in linkage assembly.
CALIBRATIONS MAY VARY DUE TO REGIONAL FUELS AND STATE OF ENGINE TUNE AND PERFORMANCE. POOR RUNNING QUALITY DOES NOT MEAN A DEFECT IN THE CARBURETOR. AN ADVANTAGE OF THE WEBER CARBURETOR IS ITS EASE OF ADJUSTMENT AND TUNING.
SET UP ADJUSTMENTS
Start set up by confirming carb base line settings. Do not depend on the factory delivered settings. Check them before the carb is installed.
All settings are done with choke disengaged or warmed up so that the choke is fully opened and disengaged. This is done on automatic choke carburetors by first opening the choke butterfly by hand and inserting a wood block or wedge of some kind to hold open while the linkage is cycled (linkage operated through its full movement ) to clear the choke cam. (You will hear a metallic click as the cam is released. You can check the fast Idle screw under the choke assembly to confirm that it is not in contact with the choke fast idle cam.)
Set the Idle stop screw (speed screw see fig 1) by backing out the Idle speed screw until it is not in contact with the throttle stop lever. Cycle the linkage again to be sure that the linkage comes to close without any assistance. (Checking for linkage bind) Now bring screw back into contact with the lever and continue to open or screwing in 1 turn no more than 11/2 turns.
Set the mixture screw (see Fig 1) by first screwing in until the screw stops, bottoms out.
DO NOT FORCE OR BIND AS THIS WILL CAUSE DAMAGE TO THE SCREW AND IT’S SEAT IN THE BODY OF CARBURETOR.
Back out the screw 2 full turns.
TUNING
Simple Rules for low speed calibration
If the mixture screw is more than 2 1/2 turns out turns then the Idle jet is too lean (too Small). When the mixture screw is less than 11/2 then the Idle jet is too rich (too large). These assumptions are based on the fact that the speed screw setting is not opened more than 11/2 turns. If the speed screw has to be opened 2 or more turns then this is also an indication of a lean condition usually requiring greater change. At times it may appear to be showing signs of richness or flooding it is really a lean condition. See pictures and notes in the tech 2 article supplied in the kit instructions, view and please understand the need to keep throttle plate as near to closed as possible so as not to prematurely expose the transition holes. This is what causes the visible rich condition, and confirms the need to increase the jet size.
JET KITS are available if needed.
EXAMPLE: With the speed screw set at no more than (1 1/2) turns in after contact with the stop lever; and the best idle occurring with the mixture screw set at 3 turns from bottom, indicates the need for a larger Idle jet. Achieving the best idle at under 2 turns indicates the need for a smaller idle jet.
The secret to understanding the critical nature of the carburetor set up and the advantages of a WEBER over other carburetors is the Idle circuit. Referred to as the low speed circuit by Weber, this circuit is responsible for 80% of the driving operation. This is the reason that the Weber should give a fuel economy improvement over most factory carbs along with significant performance gains. In the worst case you should not see a significant fuel economy loss over stock, while improving HP & Drivability.
The Weber Carburetor is a sequentially timed device to the motor like the distributor. Time taken in the setup will provide more fun later.
NOTE: This ONLY goes for the 32/36 DGV/DGEV/DGAV etc series of carburetors not the 38.
This procedure assumes no modifications have been done internally to the carburetor. Including but not limited to primary and secondary main jets, air corrector jets.
It also assumes you have no vacuum leaks ANYWHERE including the popular two-piece adapter that typically comes with the kits. I HIGHLY suggest using the Transdapt 1 piece adapter. Others have had decent results with the LCE spiral adapter as well, even though that is also a two-piece unit. Easy way to test for vacuum leaks at the adapter is to spray carb cleaner in and around the entire base of the carburetor. If a change in idle (usually a stumble) is noticed then the adapter is leaking air into the engine and needs to be fixed before any accurate tune is achieved.
Other common areas for vacuum leaks are Valve cover gasket, oil pan gasket and timing cover gaskets.
Carburetor Set Up and Lean Best Idle Adjustment
Base line Settings
Speed Screw 1 to 11/2 turns
Mixture Screw 2 turns
Your settings with engine runningMixture Screw 2 turns
Speed Screw ____________
Mixture Screw ___________
Mixture Screw ___________
It is important to follow all linkage and lever installation instructions. The number one and two reasons for tuning errors are improper linkage installations and over tightened linkage nut, causing a binding in linkage assembly.
CALIBRATIONS MAY VARY DUE TO REGIONAL FUELS AND STATE OF ENGINE TUNE AND PERFORMANCE. POOR RUNNING QUALITY DOES NOT MEAN A DEFECT IN THE CARBURETOR. AN ADVANTAGE OF THE WEBER CARBURETOR IS ITS EASE OF ADJUSTMENT AND TUNING.
SET UP ADJUSTMENTS
Start set up by confirming carb base line settings. Do not depend on the factory delivered settings. Check them before the carb is installed.
All settings are done with choke disengaged or warmed up so that the choke is fully opened and disengaged. This is done on automatic choke carburetors by first opening the choke butterfly by hand and inserting a wood block or wedge of some kind to hold open while the linkage is cycled (linkage operated through its full movement ) to clear the choke cam. (You will hear a metallic click as the cam is released. You can check the fast Idle screw under the choke assembly to confirm that it is not in contact with the choke fast idle cam.)
Set the Idle stop screw (speed screw see fig 1) by backing out the Idle speed screw until it is not in contact with the throttle stop lever. Cycle the linkage again to be sure that the linkage comes to close without any assistance. (Checking for linkage bind) Now bring screw back into contact with the lever and continue to open or screwing in 1 turn no more than 11/2 turns.
Set the mixture screw (see Fig 1) by first screwing in until the screw stops, bottoms out.
DO NOT FORCE OR BIND AS THIS WILL CAUSE DAMAGE TO THE SCREW AND IT’S SEAT IN THE BODY OF CARBURETOR.
Back out the screw 2 full turns.
TUNING
- BE SURE TO FOLLOW THE NEXT INSTRUCTIONS IN THE PROPER SEQUENCE, DEVIATION WILL CAUSE THE CARBURETOR TO NOT FUNCTION TO ITS IDEAL SPECIFICATIONS AND MAY NOT PROVIDE THE PERFORMANCE AND FUEL ECONOMY AS DESIGNED.
- Start the engine, the engine will run very slowly more like a tractor. As long as the engine stays running idle speed is not important at this point.
- The first thing to do is not set up the idle speed, but to set the Idle mixture screw to lean best idle setting. First, turn in the mixture screw until the engine dies or runs worse, then back out the screw (recommend turning ¼ to ½ turn at a time). The engine should pick up speed and begin to smooth out. Back out ½ turn more, or until the screw does nothing or runs worse then turn back to the point where it ran its best.
- Use your ear, not a scope or tuning instruments at this point. You want to tune the engine by sound. Adjust to best, fastest and smoothest running point.
- Now that the mixture screw is at its best running location, you can adjust the Idle speed the screw. The screw will be sensitive and should only take ¼ to ½ turns to achieve the idle speed you like.
- Check and set idle to your driving preference. Put the car in gear and apply slight load, (AC on) and set the Idle as you like it. Don’t set it too high, as this will cause causes excessive clutch and brake wear. The Idle only needs to be 7 to 900 RPM with light load or AC on.
- Recheck timing and vacuum hook ups. Recheck mixture screw to lean best idle again. If all is still best and smoothest idle then confirm and note the final settings.
- To confirm settings with the engine running. Start by screwing in the mixture screw and count the number of turns it takes to bottom out and note if the engine dies. If Idle Mixture screws are with in ½ turn of base line setting then all is well and have fun. Also check the speed screw and note how many total turns from initial contact. You may have opened (turned in) the speed screw. Your final setting should be under 2 full turns. Reset the screws (back in) to the best final settings (Per your notes) and go on a test drive and have fun. If the settings are other than described then you may want to recalibrate the Idle circuit (low speed circuit) to your engines needs. This is done by following the rule of thumb BELOW.
Simple Rules for low speed calibration
If the mixture screw is more than 2 1/2 turns out turns then the Idle jet is too lean (too Small). When the mixture screw is less than 11/2 then the Idle jet is too rich (too large). These assumptions are based on the fact that the speed screw setting is not opened more than 11/2 turns. If the speed screw has to be opened 2 or more turns then this is also an indication of a lean condition usually requiring greater change. At times it may appear to be showing signs of richness or flooding it is really a lean condition. See pictures and notes in the tech 2 article supplied in the kit instructions, view and please understand the need to keep throttle plate as near to closed as possible so as not to prematurely expose the transition holes. This is what causes the visible rich condition, and confirms the need to increase the jet size.
JET KITS are available if needed.
EXAMPLE: With the speed screw set at no more than (1 1/2) turns in after contact with the stop lever; and the best idle occurring with the mixture screw set at 3 turns from bottom, indicates the need for a larger Idle jet. Achieving the best idle at under 2 turns indicates the need for a smaller idle jet.
The secret to understanding the critical nature of the carburetor set up and the advantages of a WEBER over other carburetors is the Idle circuit. Referred to as the low speed circuit by Weber, this circuit is responsible for 80% of the driving operation. This is the reason that the Weber should give a fuel economy improvement over most factory carbs along with significant performance gains. In the worst case you should not see a significant fuel economy loss over stock, while improving HP & Drivability.
The Weber Carburetor is a sequentially timed device to the motor like the distributor. Time taken in the setup will provide more fun later.
Subject: weber carb info
weber carb tuning:
http://www.clutchkitcenter.com/media...weber/K610.pdf
˟
http://board.marlincrawler.com/index.php?topic=62976.0
˟
trouble shooting guide:
http://www.webercarbsdirect.com/v/vs...ng%20Guide.pdf
˟
carb adjustment guide:
http://www.cjclub.co.il/files/Weber3236adjust.pdf
˟
jetting:
http://www.bmw2002faq.com/content/view/62/32/
˟
parts diagram/exploded view:
http://www.redlineweber.com/html/Tec..._breakdown.htm
http://www.webercarbsdirect.com/v/vs...3236DGAVEV.pdf
˟
˟
carb set up and lean best idle set up:
http://www.redlineweber.com/html/Tec...lean_best_.htm
˟
˟
Last edited by dropzone; 01-06-2014 at 07:26 AM.
01-06-2014, 04:09 PM
#3
Registered User
I had the 32/36 (now have a 38) and I have to agree with the other reply, make sure you follow the setup instructions to the letter. These are a PITA to tune correctly but run great and are well worth the effort. I also agree that a one piece adapter is the way to go as the stock adapter can cause serious vacuum problems such as what you describe. I bought the LCE spiral one piece adapter when I went to the 38 but I had no problems with the stock adapter using Hylomar gasket sealer. I don't think there is any way to have the problems you describe by simply setting the mixture screws. The choke will cause it to rev high if it's not set correctly though.
01-08-2014, 07:24 PM
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I purchased one of the weber books so I was trying to follow that to throughly tune it all but it was tough to understand what screws they kept referring to. I dont know how I managed to loosen two different vacuum lines but when I was trying to adjust that throttle screw I didnt have a small screwdriver so it was a pain and must of knocked them loose.
I have it running now, I was just worried if I did any damage to it when the oil boiled out. I just cleaned it up and replaced the PCV valve. Whats ironic is I already ordered and waiting on a Weber 38 with the LCE header kit so I dont know why I was even messing with it. I am going to have a shop install the new carb, header and exhaust, mainly because I want to get it done quickly and its always better for resale purposes to have licensed professionals do the engine work, at least in my mind. I am a newbie to this stuff and I want to get the most out of this costly investment.
Thanks for the help!
I have it running now, I was just worried if I did any damage to it when the oil boiled out. I just cleaned it up and replaced the PCV valve. Whats ironic is I already ordered and waiting on a Weber 38 with the LCE header kit so I dont know why I was even messing with it. I am going to have a shop install the new carb, header and exhaust, mainly because I want to get it done quickly and its always better for resale purposes to have licensed professionals do the engine work, at least in my mind. I am a newbie to this stuff and I want to get the most out of this costly investment.
Thanks for the help!
01-09-2014, 01:57 PM
#5
Registered User
If you're like me you will LOVE the 38. Much quicker throttle response and you don't have to bury your foot in the throttle all the time. I doubt you hurt anything......
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