phorensic

94 pickup with the 3vze. Driving to work, everything running good, going downhill about 40mph in 4th just cruising. Blam, total loss of power. Would not start, but cranks good. Reset ECU by pulling fuse, still won't start. Cranks good, smell fuel in exhaust...must be spark?

Weird symptom: Even after resetting ECU when I first turn the key to ON my battery light and CEL will be lit, even before cranking. Jumping E1 and T1 show no code (CEL flashes like everything is OK), until I crank 6+ times, then I get DTC 14--
Coil measures fine. Apparently there is no way to test the ignitor, but it's frickin expensive, so I haven't swapped one in yet. I had nobody to help me crank while checking for spark from a plug wire held close to ground, so I'm not even sure if I have spark, yet. Replaced distributor cap, rotor, plug wires are brand new, reseated all ignition connections, wiggled wires on ECU...no dice. Still cranks, smell fuel, no fire whatsoever, not even a stumble.

I hope to god it's not the timing belt....

76ANTHONY

THERE IS A WAY TO CHECK THE IGNITOR, you need to get a haynes repair manual...

Team420

Also... If uyou want to check for spark... just pull the coil wire from the distributor, and ground it against the body where you can see it while cranking.

phorensic

My Haynes manual had no procedure to test the ignitor, only the coil, and the coil tests perfectly.

phorensic

I'm going to do this tonight after work when I can get someone to go out to the truck with me and help. I think that will tell me if it's timing belt or not...spark=timing belt, no spark=ignitor/coil combo.

I have heard motors with broken timing belts and you can tell they sound funny when cranking. My motor sounds normal as can be when cranking...so I dunno.

SEAIRESCUE

Electrical. If you don't know what is the problem, start cheap and work towards expensive if you plan on replacing parts, though not my suggestion. I agree ignitor or distributor. Validate belt by putting crank on TDC and pull rotor cap to see where rotor button is pointing. I am assuming all fuses are good?

phorensic

Yeah checked all the fuses and even the wiring going to the chain of ignition devices. Everything looks good, everything is in really good condition, connectors and all. After reading the 20 or so stories on this forum about DTC code 14 I think the ignitor is the only explanation. The symptoms from their situations just line up too perfectly.

phorensic

Dumb question, but would the rotor on the distributor stop spinning if the timing belt is broken (while cranking)? I'm trying to think of the easiest way of ruling out the belt, and short of drilling a damn hole in that convoluted over-complicated timing belt cover, I don't know what would be easiest. There is an engine cage covering the top of the motor, so even pulling the cam covers off is out of the question. Your suggestion is great, but I don't think I have the tools to spin the motor by hand.

phorensic

It's the igniter for sure. Had my brother crank it while holding the wire from the coil (that goes to dizzy) by chassis ground and then body ground. No spark whatsoever. $220-250 new at auto parts stores and online, and all the auto wreckers/pick-a-part's are closed after my 14 hour work days, frickin' hell.

Why is the igniter more expensive than any other electrical component on the truck?

phorensic

Alright, got it fixed, it was the igniter.

So, here are some words of wisdom to anybody else with this problem. If you are driving along in your 3vze toyota and you all of a sudden lose power completely, then the engine won't start but cranks good, you smell fuel in the exhaust, sounds like you have compression, you have a Check Engine Light that's flashing code 14 and there is no spark coming out of the coil when you hold the wire near ground....you probably have a bad igniter, or as I learned recently it's listed as the Ignition Control Module at the auto parts stores.

Case closed, thank god it wasn't the timing belt.

tc

In my case, it was a blown EFI fuse from melting through the insulation on the O2 sensor wire.

My ignitor problems showed up as vapor-lock type sysmptoms (engine would stumble and quit when hot and under heavy load)

mrddk92

i recently rebuilt my 3.o and now it will start and idle fine but when i go to drive it it will barely go and die easily. im getting a code 14 also. i need to check the sprk from the coil wire and i guess if i dont see anything then i will get a new ignitor.....damn. i f anyone has any other suggestions let me know. thanks

fourthaxis

This thread has been a huge help to me, and I just wanted to say thanks to everyone who has contributed, and also post my story in case it may help someone else.

I was driving down a long ass hill into an Indian reservation when I lost all power on my 1991 4runner V6 3.0. The tach was at 0, and we're dead. I coasted into a pull-off to access the situation. The car would crank and crank, but no fire. About 30 miles earlier, I had finished removing a second gas tank that the P.O. had installed. I thought perhaps I messed up the fuel gauge since it was reading 1/2 tank, and the truck ran fine for the 30 miles since the repair.

So I hoof it about a mile in the 90 degree heat to buy a rip-off plastic tank, and a gallon of gas. Get back to the truck, dump it in, still cranks, no fire. By this time, it was getting hotter and hotter, so I had a buddy put it on his flat-bed and tow it off the reservation. (What you gotta understand here is that the reservation is like martial law. They have a casino for the gringos that they keep in check, everywhere else, you're on your own.)

Now that I can work on the truck, I start checking the obvious stuff. Fuses, Fuel and pressure at the rail. good connections. Check. Spark...nope. Since I hadn't read this thread yet, I bought everything I'd need for a new ignition system for my next trek into the desert. I read up on here, then went back out into the desert the next day for another round.

I unhooked the distributor from the coil and checked for spark. Nothing. So, I switch out the coil (because it seems that's the most likely cause). No spark. I hadn't check to see if the distributor was spinning, but I assumed that even if the dizzy wasn't spinning I would get a spark from the coil.

From here, I decided to pull the dizzy cap, and see what's going on. Pull the cap, hit the ignition, no spin. Damn! Timing belt, right? Upon closer inspection I realize the inside of the distributor looks jacked. Like some parts that should NOT touch have been, hard. I pull the distributor, and realize it's seized. Somehow the rod slid farther down into the engine that it was supposed to, and the rotor shaft started tearing up inside the diz. Thankfully I have a new distributor with me. I drop it in, hit the key, and it spins!!! Put the rotor back on, put the cap back on, hit the key, sparks!! It's fixed, right? Put all the wires back, etc. Hit the key.....it sparks, turns over, chugs, tries to fire, but won't. At this point, exhausted, hot, and pissed off, I call a tow.

But, on my way home, I start thinking....If the engine was turning, but the dizz wasn't, how do I know the timing is still correct? If the timing was jacked, the car wouldn't run, right? Did I just waste $40 on a tow??? The answer is I don't know, but probably. I called the shop, and asked them to check the timing first, and go from there. There was no way in hell I was making another trip to the desert to do it myself. I'm still waiting on a call back, but hopefully I'll get off with the diagnostic fee and maybe a few minutes of labor. I'd be interested to hear any comments, and will post again once it's fixed.

Bigblock

Timing belt is cheaper.
Bigblock

Pishnak

This thread helped me fix my Land Cruiser. Seems one of my O2 sensor harnesses decided to loosen up and rub the wires raw against the drive shaft.

My engine just died one day at a stop light.

I had replaced the coil, distributor cap, rotor, and then the engine would work ... intermittently. I started blowing the EFI 15a fuse sometimes when I put it in gaer other times when I would hit a bump, all of them no more than a few feet out of the driveway.

Replaced the EFI relay and then searched these forums for EFI Fuse and found this thread. Sure enough that pesky O2 sensor wire was the issue much like TC posted.

Course it all makes sense now concerning the hows and whys behind the problem, but who knows how much longer it would have taken me to find the prob w/o reading these forums! My thanks to everyone who contributes!

Regards,
Paul

frozenwave

would a faulty igniter cause weak spark? i've been having issues as well. i get spark, but it seems weak. doesnt have a loud snap, or strong color. should it? coil is brand new. ran fine one night, and now it will only barely jump fire when trying to turn over.

Mtngoat9

Hi folks, been trying to nail this exact problem but also been resisting the ignitor fix because I didn't feel like spending hundreds on something to find out it wouldn't fix it.

Truck is not dead, but very, very hard to start, smells way rich. when you finally get it running it has zero power and still running way, way rich. 60 in 4th is pedal to the floor territory, and passing? Fuggedaboudit. Climb any hill at any speed in any gear taller than 2nd? Same.

I did replace cap n rotor, plugs, o2, found a bunch of intake leaks messing up my idle and that my fuel ressure regulator was faulty. Now once it's running it's smoother than it's been for a long time...but still, nearly impossible to start and still zero power, horrible mileage, like 10 mpg. However, no knocking, temp is fine.

. So after reading this thread and out of options, I guess since I've got the stinkin 14 code flashing, I'll buck up and spend the money for an ignitor. 91 'runner with 265,000 miles (2nd 3vze), I guess the ignitor could be bad after all. It had better be!

But it sounds likely given this thread and others. Is it worth it getting a hotter coil too? Not much more to add given the price of the danged ignitor.

edit: decided to take the plunge, i've already replaced everything else and I am showing a 14 code after all.

230 bucks at Rock Auto, should be here Tuesday. Will I say more bad words or jump for joy? Tune in Wednesday.

scope103

Before you put it on, use your timing light for a before and after shot. I'm going to guess that the light will barely fire with the old ignitor.

Mtngoat9

Good idea. I'll try it. I was going to play with the advance some anyway.

ej1bullet

haw do you restart the ecu??