offset442

Ok I spent the last several weeks unraveling tattered threads of what used to be an internet where people wrote nice little websites with lots of nice well placed data with good available photos and diagrams about all sorts of nice fun and useful technical topics, which has now degraded to what i call forum hell where you have to read through dozens of opinions form mostly people that are just adding to the thread so they can feel like they precipitated which sucks up hours of time and leads you down the horrible rabbit hole of searching for that one piece of information you need, i really miss the good ole days when everyone had a nice nice home page that they added lots of cool stuff too and we could all google it up and not have to get our information threw a third party conversation.

so for you off road porn pleasure I present: 140A underhood welder from scratch!

I had a job in which i needed to weld doors onto a strong box, on a remote hill top guess what i don't own a generator welder


as you can see i used a bank of 3 batteries and jumper cables from the truck moved around battery to battery. this arrangement worked to get the 24 linear inches of deep penetrating weld i needed but it sucked the weld current was way too hot and worse yet some of the batteries where not very good and i didn't really get good burn time between recharges I figured there had to be a better way i had heard about alternator welding and started to bring myself upto speed, I not the first but i feel i am not the few to actually do this from scratch soo if your not technical geet one of these for $1,200



personally I think this unit is nice but it was not for me. so i started to look into what high current alternators people have been shoe horning into toyota trucks and found the perfect alternator the remy-delco CS144 found on 88-95 Cadillac and firebirds look to the designation 140A on the rotor side of the case near the mounting hole for the version with the 140 amp stator you will need to remove the internal regulator, dont do like i did and try to work with it, i burned out 2 of them and had to rebuild the alternator 2 times because of stupid mistakes while figuring out and probing the wiring, finally i just setup the alternator like a 1G ford alternator with feild and stator output for control and used an 80's external ford solid state voltage regulator from the parts counter to solve the problem once and for all and i recommend you do the same



the modification to the alternator, sad to say my fault this is the second time i have had this alternator open, its hard to see but the black plastic part in the middle of all the silicone that i used to secure the field control wires, thats the voltage regulator, if you ever do a project like this throw it away and use an external regulator, i just installed this one today and already managed to burn it out again just one touch to ground and its all over!!! its really hard to see but the white plastic brush holder near the center ring has a metal pin that secures the brushes because they are spring loaded, i forgot to remove it when i was finished and you might too so, do yourself a favor and 86 the regulator, because tomorrow i will be opening this alternator up again to install wiring for external regulation i tired of the integrated module game.

the shiny metal part on the bottom is the new diode block required for welding Transpo p/n dr5180pf non-avalanche, to the left is the armature/exciter and to the right is the delta wound 3 phase high current stator coil

PS. why do i get logged out after 10 mins this is a forum not a bank HOW DO I SET THE TIME TO SOMETHING REASIONABLE LIKE 2 HRS?

offset442

I modified this CS144 remy-delco alternator with a new set of high voltage high current press fit diodes, because the stock ones are 18v avalanche diodes that literally smoke when the voltage is ramped up much more than 18 volts intended to protect the car from being fried by a bad regulator, i also installed taps to the stator and the field brushes so that i can disconnect the new external regulator and hijack the exciter to produce high voltages and currents, now pictured the unit crammed into a space designed for a unit half the size, had to make a custom belt tensioner and a spacer to make it fit the upper pivot bracket but its solid, i needed a bigger belt P/N(495k4) to drive it on 3.0L, the air intake had a big bubble of plastic used to tune the sound of the intake, its gone now to make room and the engine sounds manlier too...



front side of the control panel (unfinished) started sanding the black anodization off of the aluminium plate and decided i like the rustic look of the half sanded panel. still don't have the 200 volt / 200 amp digital meter for the upper right corner, its still in the mail.

switches from left to right 1. main pwr, 2 truck main bus disconnect, 3 charge/weld mode, 4 full over-excitation mode and the knob is variable excitation for fine control of output, the relay hanging free on the lower right disconnects the internal regulator when switch 2 is on, this protects the truck from being fried and acts as a failsafe if it looses pwr it automatically reconnects the 12v regulator. switch 3 is a bypass for this circuit and allows the welding cables to be used as 12v jumper cables incase someone needs a jump, ofcourse i now have a charging system that can rescue a semi truck with a dead 24v battery by using the variable regulator to adjust the voltage to whatever i want, lol



Yes Success, IT CAn Weld!!!!!!!!

it was actually too hot for the 6011 rod i was using i didn't have have the meter or throttle control yet so i couldn't really adjust the weld heat properly but it works really well for a brick on the gas pedal and a wild guess on the knob took some voltage measurements and guessed at the amperage by the arc behavior to be about 110 amps and calculated 4,100 watts weld heat lol way too hot.

i was even able to run power tools, though it takes a ton of engine rpm to get 90 volts because of the delta wound stator so i think i will just start buying odd battery tools i tried an 18 volt dewalt cordless saws-all that has been laying around useless for a long time, i put a cord on it some time ago and found that it is useless at 12v but a little turn of the knob and i had 18 volts and it worked perfectly and with the engine only idling i get 24 volts under full feild, all in all i added a hell of a tool to my collection, if you ever break your jeep in the boonies just give me a call!!!!!!!!!!



here you can see in installed layour of everything notice i had to relocate the ignition coil and driver circuit to make room for the welding control box whats really hard to see is i have a big fat relay that disconnects the alternator output from the charging system when the control panel is armed its a 6 terminal isolated 200 amp normally closed relay single throw dubble pole meaning that it has 1 normally closed 200 amp connection and 1 normally open 200 amp connection that are isolated from each other rated 200 amps continuous 900 amps 5 seconds, i also added a fly-back diode across the control terminals
because of its inductive kick when switched off

these part numbers should be usefull to you........
Cole Hersee 24401BX
Johnson Electric 5118840
Prestolite SBD4201G, 15-386
White Rodgers 70-910------mine is a whites rodgers

offset442

below is the unfinished underside of the control panel its really just a simple set of switches, plugs, 2 relays and 1 inline 12v 7 amp PWM light dimmer from an RV no need to a schematic its too simple



you can see the 200 amp relay mounted under the wiring bundle between the alternator and the control box, i used a spare threaded bolt hole to bring a welding ground directly from the alternator case into the control box



this is the finished control box with the meter installed I had originally intended to have an amp meter on the positive output of the alternator but i could not find a meter that provided for a positively charged shunt resistor, since they all have a common ground on the measurement that means that the shunt has to be on negative side of the load which would prevent me for getting a good reading so the meter will likely forever say 0 amps unless i build a shunt adapter so i can read the load current of the output cables but thats about it, i was wanting to read both output and charging current but i cant figure out a way to make it work without an isolated meter oops!


i would , share hint a second stage planed for this project thats kicking around my head, : Under hood plasma cutter!!!!!!

the idea is to bring out the the raw AC output of the delta stator from before the recitifier and run it threw a 3 phase voltage tippler that will deliver about 20 amps at around 250 vdc OCV limited by the size caps in the circuit, then all I would need is air/co2 and a cheap PT-51 torch head coupled to a simple HF arc starter, instiant plasma cutter just by adding 3 10 ga wires to the system i have built............... stay tuned!!!!!!!!!!!1

offset442

here is a good page that covers delco alternators

http://oljeep.com/AltTheory17/Altern...ersion17R1.htm

wyoming9

iTrader: (1)

Maybe if you paid to be on the site you won`t get logged out so quick I never had the issue.

I am glad your little project worked out.

rworegon

OP, click the Remember Me box when logging in to help prevent the quick log outs.

chuckross1957

I've gotten in to the habit of copying my message as I'm typing it. I copy it one last time before I post it. Then when I have to log back in, I can paste it and post quickly. Interesting project you have there. I'd like to modify my truck to use it as a small portable generator so I can run some 110 volt devices. The problem with all of these gas powered things like chainsaws and pressure washers is if you let them sit too long, the carburetor corrodes and then when you need to use it, it doesn't work. I bought an electric chainsaw a few years ago, I can let it sit for a year and it still works fine. I see the same problem with a gas powered generator, you are going to have to start it on a regular basis, or when you need it, it isn't going to work. I see some folks have installed inverters, but I was thinking of something more than just installing an inverter, like installing an extra alternator and battery.

scope103

I don't think gasoline is going to corrode anything. Unless you have a lot of water in the gasoline, which a bigger problem anyway.

But what will happen is that "varnish" will precipitate out of the gasoline over a few months, and that will keep those tiny carburetors from working. I make it a habit to pour all the gas out of the small engine back into the gas "can," then start the engine (chain saw, string trimmer, ...) and run it until it stalls. This doesn't pull out 100% of the gas, but it has made a very big difference for me.

Do you need to do this if you're going to use the engine again in a few days? No, but if you're like me a few days can easily stretch into a few months. When in doubt, get the gasoline out.

offset442

ok i am really pissed off i had written a very nice useful post and spent 30 min's doing it but i lost the whole dam thing because i took more than 10 minutes to write it, and when it asks you to login it throws your post away, if you hit the back button no luck there either, whats wrong with this forum??????????????? I have logged in 4 times now and there is no remember me button that i have seen yet this plain sucks!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

rworegon

Offset, where/how are you logging in? Desktop? What browser? Give some specifics and I'll start a thread for site admin to take a look.

As a backup, I do a copy of a long post before hitting the send button in case something weird happens. Easier to past it into a new post then retyping the post.

Update: Site admin is upping the logout time which should help.

offset442

Ok i finally found the remember me check box i have been logging in thru the weird looking "you have been logged out relogin" page that doesnt look anything like the forum site layout. hopefuly i not going to have this problem again

I'm linux mint, with google chrome browser, latest updates.


so i was saying before i so rudely lost my post:

fouled carberators are a good point and not really off topic I understand the pain of small gas engines that have an unreasonably cheap quality of construction, i have had new stuff that I used once and never again because the second time it was melted by the gasoline, i have had parts disslove in the gasoline, i have had brass metal floats that are glued togather instead of soldered, which dissloves and leads to a horrible tar inside of the carburetor. needless to say i prefer electric tools now myself because small gasoline powered products are no longer of viable quality.

that being said forget using an alternator to get 60 cycle ac, they output in the kilo cycles 1500- 4000 HZ you could if you had enough room install a small belt driven ac gen set if your dead set on having 120v 60 cycles.

an easier choice is to make an alternator exciter control that will allow you to dial up any voltage you want to run any type of battery operated tool, there are lots of battery powered tools that get abandon because its not worth it to spend 100 bux on a new battery, but you can put a cord on these so called cordless tools, dial up the appropriate voltage on you alternator and run them to you hearts content, most alternators can be adjusted to 22-36 volts with the engine just idleing, just make sure you dont have avalanche diodes, there is nothing more effective for example than a yard sale 10 dollar 36 volt hilti hammer drill running on an extension cord hooked up to a universal dc power supply (alternator). I just use standard 120v wall outlets and regular extension cords for this purpose, just dont forget and plug the junk into the wall at home or you will let the smoke out!

so far i have

10$ 36 volt hilti hammer drill (now the beefiest drill i own i think)
5$ 18 volt mikita grinder
8$ 18 volt mikita light drill
2$ 18 volt dewalt light hammer drill
2$ 18 volt mikita impact wrench
free 18 volt dremal tool
free 18 volt dewalt sawsall (nicer than my 120v skill sawsall) comes in extra handy at the junk yard
free chop saw with a 24 volt battery powered lawn mower motor
free small table saw with 3/4 hp dc brush motor from tred mill

most of this stuff only takes a few minutes and a good 12 ga cord to convert, im very happy with my collection

chuckross1957

There was a company that made a 12 volt chainsaw. It seems no one makes one now. It is called a "mini-brute". I think there are common aspects to all of this. I saw where some folks have installed a more powerful alternator in place of the original factory unit. Others have installed inverters. I would think someone with experience working on rv electrical systems might know how to pull this off. I know I read that you can't use your inverter while the engine is running? If you set it up correctly, you should have enough power to run a "mini-brute" or other dc tools. But the other thing I had in mind was having an inverter that isn't permanently mounted to the truck. May be an inverter mounted to a dolly. I'd like to have some back up power to run the fan for my gas furnace if I lose power in the winter time.

offset442

i actually have 2 1500 watt trusine inveters ($600 still) that i got from a military base when a service company was closing out a maintenance contract, they where left over and i was told to dump everything in the conex box before the new company took over the contract, well i dumped most of into the back of my truck go a a ton of cool solar power and some super long range surveillance cameras with 5 inch dia lenses.

so i now actually one have those inveters rigged to 8 ga jumper cables, it works ok but they draw a scary 60 amps peak from the battery, the inveter is an ok plain as long as you can back it up with an alternator, i probly would not hesitate to idle one of my vehicles during a power outage to keep things running.

a better pain would be to pair an alternator with a lawn mower engine which is a quick and easy project, i had originally tried to pair 2 ford 1g alternators with a 10 hp Briggs engine i had laying around but it didn't work out because i could not get the engine running right without spending a ton of money in parts repairing the junk, it leaks a ton of oil and needs an all new carburetor, this was my first attempt at generator welding , was able to a lay a bead or 2 with both 60 amp alternators paralleled before i wanted to hit the engine with a sledge hammer, would also make a really good 12v backup generator by adding a few $15 ford style voltage regulators. perhaps one day i will revive this projects but i doubt it i live in a desert and the only motors i come across are from pressure washers with corroded pressure pumps and they are not enough hose power lawn tractors are a rare find around here but it takes about 10 hp engine to get 120 amps of welding current, way less hp say 1/4 if you stay regulated at 12 volts


seems like every company in the world now is making a cordless chain saw most of them are in the 40 volt range and would perfectly off my setup

google search cordless chainsaw

https://www.google.com/search?q=ryob...less+chain+saw

you not going to see many 12v tools anymore because you just can't engineer horse power very cheaply using 12 volts as a starting point, from an economical stand point it just takes too much thick gauge copper, if you raise the voltage you can use less copper and get more power to the shaft so thats why voltage keeps going up on codless tools and why they have been getting better.......