edeslaur

SOLVED - read on!

My 4runner's rear window would originally not go up or down when I bought it. I redid the connections at the relay and got it to work with the interior switch, and now the rear gate key will bring the window down, but I can't get it to go up with the key.

The keyed tailgate switch tests good with my meter (continuity when in "go up" position). No click or other noises to indicate something is trying.

Any suggestions where to look next?

edeslaur

Bump. Pulling the gate apart today to check continuity, etc. Any input appreciated!

XtraSlow_XtraCab

If the interior rocker switch works flawlessly then it is either an issue with the key cylinder, or The same relay actuates all of that guff, regardless of which switch... Water probably started leaking in and corroded a terminal on the keyed switch... but you sai the continuity checked out.

Perhaps the conduit between tailgate and body (left side jamb) is de-funked and the right wire rubbed itself into grounding out... then again the window breaker would have tripped and nothing will work.

Check the harness as it runs down the tailgate and "behind" the rear window (in its down position). There is a plastic anchor that lures the harness away from the window's path. The plastic anchor tends to break, allowing the harness to get caught by the window. THe wire could have been tugged/broken from the main plug.

cman1

iTrader: (1)

make sure all your bolts that hold down your top are in...if the one is loose or missing second forward from the back left there is a safety switch that will not let you use the window,if say you take your top off,that switch will not activate power and the window wont work!

edeslaur

OK, pulled the side panel off, the tailgate apart, and started troubleshooting.

PROBLEM
The switched Blue/Black-stripe thin wire to the tailgate has power at the relay, but not at the tailgate switch, checked where it exits the body and enters the tailgate, and again at the tailgate switch. If I ground it at the relay, the window goes up (trips the relay, and ta-da!).

I also tried a different tailgate switch, supposed to be good - same behaviour.

Since I don't want to pull the whole side of the truck apart... anyone have some suggestions on where the power may be getting lost?

Things I learnededed
Anywhere I say "ground ... wire X" below, I mean I used a test lamp and it kicked the relay.
Example: I "grounded" the blue/black thin wire (tailgate switch wire) at the relay, causing the rear window to go down, ignoring interlocks - I was able to extend the window with the gate open. I only extended it a couple inches since breaking it is not high on my list of to-do's. Using the switches, interlocks work as intended.

Some wire color notes for my '87 SR5, colors at the master window relay, and before the center-console interior switch pigtail (chassis-side).

Any of the thin wires below grounded with a test light will actuate the rear window.

Rear window down:
- Blue/White stripe : wire to tailgate, 12v at the relay
-- Thin one actuates relay, goes from relay to tailgate switch. 12v at the relay, 12v at the tailgate switch.
-- Thick one powers motor only, 12v at relay when relay is tripped
- Green/Yellow : center console switch. 12v at the relay at all times

Rear window up:
- Blue/Black stripe : wires to tailgate.
-- Thin one actuates relay/ goes from relay to tailgate switch. 12v at the relay. I suspect it's supposed to have 12v at the tailgate switch.
-- Thick one powers motor. 12v at all times
- Red/Yellow : center console switch. 12v at the relay at all times

Relay (found in the side panel behind the driver's seat)
Back


Front


Tailgate apart


This is the connector to the tailgate key switch. Hang onto the non-switch side, it will fall into the tailgate when you have the the tailgate up (and glass up), making it fun to fish out. I have one of the little claw-dealies, works great for when I drop something non-magnetic.

Watch your fingers if you pull the connector apart and poke around with a test lamp, the window will go up or down depending on the wire you poke.


Wires where they come out of the body into the tailgate. No voltage here in the Blue/Black wire. Break is somewhere between here and the relay.

RAD4Runner

Thanks for sharing your findings. So I gather you were able to find and fix where the disconnect happened? Schematic is on my post here. You're correct; control relay takes Up/Down signals from the console and key switches. Switches switch ground on or off, hence, switched ground. aka "sinking" inputs.

a51young

I had a similar problem a while back. The switch in the cab worked fine but the key in the back only worked one way, forgot which one. I ended up running a new line from the relay box to the key switch, taping it to the original wires. I tested it before hand to make sure that would fix it by slicing the insulation near the connection. Ran the new line and problem solved. I also replaced all the relays while I was in there.

edeslaur

Excellent thread, I'll have to curl up and read through the whole thing.

I haven't figured out where the "disconnect" is yet. My 88 Blazer never had problems with the rear window at all. I'm finding it strangely aggravating I can't put the 4Runner's window up with the key. LOL

According to this, the ground goes through the cover top sensor switch, so the fact it goes down means the problem appears to be only on the blue/black (L-B in the diagram) between the relay and the tailgate mounted window switch.


I'll pull the rest of the side panels tomorrow and look for a break in the wire... The loom I've seen so far looks great, so I'm quite curious.

edeslaur

Well, that was easy.

Given the relatively unmolested state of the truck, I originally assumed it had to be a switch, or the relay, which I'd had to monkey with before (contacts were corroded on the high amp connections due to arcing from a couple poor connections - the connectors Toyota used are not great).

As soon as I pulled the jack panel (which I'd completely forgotten about), I found my first clue - earlier in its life, someone had spliced in a trailer hitch plug. Apparently they thought the way to check if they had the correct wire was to slice off a piece of the insulation. Sigh. I suspect the radio wiring will be equally "well" done.


Since I had power going into and out of the plug to the tailgate loom, it had to be between that part and the gate.

Once clued in, I realized the fat part of the wire loom below the rear quarter probably held additional clues. I'd originally thought it held only extra wire for the trailer connector. Bzzzt! The 4-pin flat trailer connector wiring will be replaced with a 7-pole setup to match my trailers. The wiring is run amazingly badly.


They had fixed the Blue/White wire for using the key to go down. Guess they cut way too deep on that one. Like the green wire you see cut completely through. The Blue/Black wire had only 2 strands remaining, both of which were highly corroded.



After some repairs, including using liquid electrical "tape" on the wires which were sliced and diced (including the ones inside the jack compartment. You can see some of the liquid tape on the white wire.

I needed little stubs for 2 of the wires as there wasn't enough slack to just use 1 butt connector. Short of replacing the whole wire, or using butt connectors elsewhere, this was my approach. I also sealed the ends of the butt connectors with liquid tape since they're outside the truck and will be submerged from time to time.



The window goes up and down now. Amazing how much better that feels!

Everything's all taped up, wire loom reinstalled, and it's good for the life of the vehicle...

Thanks everyone, especially Rad4Runner!

RAD4Runner

MoFo's! It sucks that many do not realize that they have a classic on their hands and they cut corners.

Quote:

Thanks everyone, especially Rad4Runner!

Most welcome! Would like to see the truck sometime. A San Diego Yotatech get-together.

edeslaur

Re classics:
Yeah, I'm torn about the Total Chaos kit I'm about to install. Oh, wait.

Re SD Get-together!
I'm on board! Maybe we do it near Vista/Carlsbad so we can drag down some LA folks.

edeslaur

Cleaning the tools out of the back, got interrupted, went back out there and forgot to mention my son found this sucker in the tailgate. I suspect I'll have one less rattle on rough roads. And less risk of smashed glass with it down and humping.

From the wear on it, it'd been in there a while...

edeslaur

OK, last post!

Final product. Not too fat to get caught between the bed and gate/gate torsion bar, but obviously containing something. Fully taped under the loom.



And my #1 helper using my truck in new and unique ways.