PirateMcgee

I just replaced the head gasket on my 86 runner 22re. Everything is hooked up and the truck starts but the engine stumbles and can barely idle. It eventually dies on it's own. If any gas (I mean a slight touch) the engine instantly dies.....

Timing is correct
Can't find anything disconnected or in the wrong spot
Can't hear any vaccum leaks
When key is on I can hear fuel being pumped or something similar from around the intake manifold area I do not hear this on my 93????

Any ideas?

PirateMcgee

anyone????

newbie93pickup

try disconnecting the battery for a little while to wipe the a/f settings from the computer. does the exaust smell strongly of un burned fuel? spak plugs wet or dry? did you take the disributor off? if so did you make sure you were at TDC when you put it back on? just some things too look at. if your possitive all the vac lines are back where they are supposed to be.

AJsArmor

You say the timing is correct, are you sure? Seems if it was near death idle, as soon as you jumped the connector to set timing it would probably die. That's my first thought is timing is waaay off.

chewie1014

Let's rule everything out in stages:

First, I'd pull the battery like Newbie suggest and reset the computer.

Next, I'd do a compression test or leak-down test to make sure the HG sealed.

Both above are doubtful, but take little time and can rule out those scenarios.

Next, bring #1 to TDC, reset the distributor and check the timing again. I'd also check for good spark on all 4 plugs. And look for unburnt fuel in the cylinders (wet plug). As Newbie asked, how does the exhaust smell and look?

Then I'd start looking for vacuum leaks. Did you use all NEW gaskets across the board? Some people try to reuse what looks like a good gasket and can't get it to seal. I did this once with an EGR gasket and had the exact same problem you described. Replaced the gasket and purred like a kitten.

I don't know what your hearing by the intake. I've never heard that by my intake, but then again I've never listened for it either. I'll do so over lunch and let you know what I hear. Cold start injector? Is it connected and sealed properly?

I'm thinking timing/firing order or vacuum and that's where I'd start. Nearly every problem I've ever encountered following a head gasket replacement has been solved by one of those two.

newbie93pickup

^bump.

i did a 22r swap with a friend and couldnt get the motor to stay running. would pop and fire oddly a million times but wouldnt run. turned out we didnt set the new motor to TDC when we put the distributor on and it was fireing so F'd up that it wouldnt even remotly run.

one thing to keep in mind when setting TDC is that just because you have the mark lined up to TDC doesent mean your #1 is at TDC. only way i ever know for sure is pull the plug and look down in there with a light. im sure there other ways but this works for me.

chewie1014

Exactly...many people think just lining up the notches puts it at TDC. You want it at TDC on the COMPRESSION STROKE not the exhaust stroke. To properly set TDC, pull the #1 plug (actually pull them all). Put a compression gauge on it and turn it over until it builds pressure. Once you're building pressure, you on the compression stroke. Now align the notches. Once aligned, the rocker arms should be loose. If not, turn one more revolution and realign the notches. Now you're at TDC. It's a bit tedious but it'll mean it's done right. Now install the distributor.

PirateMcgee

If the timing is 180 off though it shouldn't even run; correct?

So all sensors are connected correctly

Vacuum lines are all good

Exhaust show no smoke of any color but does smell slightly gassy not too bad but just barely noticeable, I have no cat though

Still sort of idles on it's own then almost dies then it catches again barely idles almost dies then catches again etc but eventually dies
any gas at all immediately results in it dying...

GorgeRunner

If you are 180 off, the engine usually will idle, if you can call it that, very roughly, it will seem like the engine is going to jump out of the engine compartment. When you give it gas, it usually dies or backfires.
I think everyone who has built or rebuilt an engine has done this. Make sure the #1 piston is at the top of the stroke and both valves are closed when you align the timing mark.

PirateMcgee

ok so I took the dist out turned it 180 and tried again and it would not even start

turned it back to where I had it and it ran but did the same thing

timing is fine

spark plug did smell slightly gassy

PirateMcgee

when I pulled the head timing mark was at 0, dist was pointing at #1, cam gear mark was aligned with the arrow on the rocker assembly, #1 piston was at top of the cylinder when the head was off....

PirateMcgee

I'm freaking puzzled!!!

thewjsand

I didn't read the very many of the posts above because they were telling you to do things that were much more difficult than what i would suggest.

My truck did this after HG job a few weeks ago. It sounds like your timing is slightly off.

Get a inductive timing light, clamp in on to you #1 spark plug wire and and you battery. on the harmonic balancer pulley make a mark with white paint or something on the small notch indiacting TDC. Turn on the truck as it idels rough shine the light just above the oil pump (there is degree. The light will flash when ever the cam is TDC,your white paint spot should show up on the degree reader. if your notch is not on the O degrees then your are retarded or advanced depending on which side your on. while it is running losen your distributer and gently twist that till it moves the paint mark to 0 degress, becareful when doing this. You turn the distributer a fraction of an inch to move the mark, if you go to far it will stall the engine. It is much easier with a friend to workt he distributer and you the timing light. The haynes or chilton manuals has this described.

If someone already said this above just ignore me.

My 0.02$

PirateMcgee

compression not gooood

1-154
2-152
3-135
4-115

crap!!!!

looks like my street truck is going to be my winter driver son of

chewie1014

#1 and #2 are good. #3 is marginally acceptable. #4 is bad. Do a leak down and make sure the HG sealed properly. One grain of dirt that you didn't catch can make it a PITA to seal.

That's what I'd do...after being 100% sure my timing was on. Remember, it doesn't have to be 180* off to run like crap...if you didn't catch it at TDC on the compression stroke, you're going to early detonate and it's going to run like crap. You may have it timed on the stroke up but not at TDC. When the notches are aligned, where is the rotor pointing?

Still think it's a timing issue. A dead #4 should still run...even though poorly. It shouldn't die.

PirateMcgee

pointing at number 1

PirateMcgee

I think I'll pull the valve cover again and see if the bright link is aligned at tdc too......

can I see the bright link with the oil pan off on the crank?

PirateMcgee

I concur that it could still be timing

but why would 1-2 be fine but 3-4 suck

chewie1014

With it at TDC on the compression stroke you should be golden.

I want to say no, at least not to line it up.

A number things...usually head, rings or valves. I'm more concerned with #4 than with #3.

A hydrolock can damage a cylinder in a number of ways...but I don't think that's it because it ran fine after drying it out and before the BHG. And it still doesn't explain the way the truck runs and wants to die with the slightest burp of the throttle. 114 is low but should still give you enough compression to get a bang...albeit weak. I'm thinking it was low before and just hadn't gotten bad enough for you to notice.

I don't think it's the cause of your problem.

thook

Did you reuse the headbolts? Not really a problem if you did, but they must be absolutely clean before you reinstall them. Otherwise, you'll get false torque readings and consequently uneven clamping force on the gasket.