YotaJake

Hello to all,

just want to say this site rocks. I've found some great info when it came to fixing my truck. I learned how to test my TPS sensor that turned out to be faulty. Learned about the noisy spindle bushings and speedo cable (made the spindle tool to remedy the spindle bushing noise). Also, found a thread pointing to the oil cooler as possible leakage problems. It was the problem and I kept thinking I messed up the new rear main seal when I put in a new clutch.

My problem is on a 1990 Toyota 4Runner with the 3L, 5sp, and has 4wd with 244,000 miles. I just put on a new lower right ball joint because I suspected play there. I could move the tire when holding at the 12 and 6 o'clock positions. To feel it even better I would push the tire in to eliminate the play. Then, I would take a pry bar and wedge it between the lower ball joint and the control arm and apply pressure. You could see it move back out. Does any body think that maybe the control arm hole where the ball joint press fits in could be out of spec? That is the only thing I can think of for my play issues.

YotaJake

abecedarian

the ball joint does not press fit into a hole on the control arm

YotaJake

How else would the fit be?

iamsuperbleeder

ummm, the ball joint's bolted in buddy; did you make sure all them bolts on it are still there and tight?

YotaJake

The three bolts that attach the lower bj to the steering knuckle are all tight. The large stud that goes through the lower control arm end is also torqued. I always thought this stud had a slight interference fit with the control arm end hole. This is why it takes a puller to separate the two, same goes with tie rods and such. I just wonder if the fit has become slightly worn and resulting in play. I just can't find any info on this particular problem.

abecedarian

three bolts? there are four bolts that secure the ball joint to the steering knuckle and the ball joint stud has a slight taper and has a castle nut and cotter that secures it to the lower arm.. so we're probably having a disconnect between what you're seeing and what we are thinking.

Here's the ball joint from the rear and front, notice there are 4 bolts, and see the castle nut:



Here's the lower arm, notice the three rivets securing the ball joint support to the arm:


So where is the slop you see?
If it's in those three rivets, you MAY be able to drill them out and replace them with bolts, but I wouldn't do it. I'd replace the lower arm.

YotaJake

Sorry I meant four, I didn't have my cup of coffee yet. How do you post your pics. In the last pic, there is that small gap between the bj and control arm. I could insert a pry bar here and see the ball joint move. It's weird because this bj is new. I can definitely feel this play when driving, especially on uneven roads. Great pics by the way.

abecedarian

Thanks. I took them this morning just for you!!
I run my own server so I can host my own pics. You can get an account at photobucket.com or some other sites which allow you to upload pics and then all you need is the link to the picture. Worse case, you can email me the pics and I'll host them for you.
Then you would do something like this:
but you're saying that you put a prybar between the arm and the BJ and you could see motion? was the movement between the BJ body- the part the 4 bolts go through- and the steering knuckle, or was it the BJ stud you could see moving where it goes into the lower arm?

YotaJake

It looks to be the bj stud where it goes into the lower arm. It's a TRW bj from advance auto and the previous one was a Moog. Both exhibit the same play. Can you also upload a small video in photobucket. I might try that and show the play. I also tried tightening the bj even tighter than the 105 ftlb of torque and still the play. Anyone have bad experiences with these brands of balljoints?

YotaJake

I was also thinking if it is the lower control arm could you just buy that small control arm extension that attaches to the bj. Has anybody tried this before? It might be easier than replacing the lower control arm. I'm just worried about those cam bolts being a pain to get out.

abecedarian

I don't know if photobucket allows vids. maybe... but youtube does- then you could use the youtube function in the forums to post the vid.

If the bj stud is rocking in the lower arm, not the ball itself loose in the joint, there's not much you can do other than replace the lower arm because likely the socket in the lower arm is worn from a previous ball joint not being torqued properly.

Now, I'm NOT saying this will work, but... in a pinch... and you'll probably have to replace the BJ AND lower arm if it doesn't work, but MAYBE a bit of JB weld in the socket, where the BJ goes in would 'shim' up any slop and make it solid again. Like I said though it MIGHT. And at best, it'd be a temporary fix.
(on second thought maybe just wrap the BJ stud a few turns with aluminum foil- would save you from replacing the BJ if it fails)

abecedarian

the cam bolts are easy to pull. just remove the nut and tap the bolt out with a brass drift. changing the bushings is a whole-nother-can-o-worms though.

YotaJake

I'll have to pry that boot up to see if it is rocking in the control arm. The aftermarket boots on these bjs are such crap. Any place to get a used control arm and do you have to put on new bushings. Thanks for your replies. Off to go do some stump shooting in the Upper Peninsula.

YotaJake

So I gently lifted the bj boot and used a pry bar in between the bj and control arm (arrow in pic shows where I pryed). No play between the bj stud and control arm hole. The play is the bj itself. Has anybody experienced TRW bjs being poorly built. The previous one was Moog which lasted a year and a half. I think this one was Chinese made. The left lower bj is also a TRW, but it was Japanese made and had a better quality boot (spring clip on the top). This one has lasted around 4.5 years with no problems. Also, does anyone have upper bjs that have tons of miles on them and show no signs of wear. I have no play in my uppers and I don't think they have ever been replaced. They also have huge grease boots, they look to hold 3 times the grease of my lowers. It's amazing if they are original.



Here's a Pic of the old yota. It's all stock with just 31s Bridgestone Dueler AT tires, which have 54,000 miles and still has good tread. I went with a Dynomax Turbo muffler that is completely rusted out in only 2 years. Will be getting a stainless Magnaflow soon.

YotaJake

Well I have an update to my problem. I replaced the upper and lower ball joints and still have play on the passenger side. wtf!!! I also see no movement in the stud that goes into the lower control arm. I am lost as to what else it could be. Any suggestions please???

Junkers88

The Moog that was in there before, did you replace it or was it done by the previous owner? If you did it then what caused the replacement? What I mean is "why" was that one replaced?

I also noticed you said that the Moog only lasted a year and a half and that in itself is strange. You might be looking at a wallowed out hole in the lower control arm.

Now take that with a grain of salt since I haven't actually had to work on that part of my truck....... yet.

Let us know.

YotaJake

All is good. I jumped the gun when I said I did both. I just did the upper today and now it looks all tight. It was funny because it looked like the lower was bad. Lesson learned is that next time I ever have to do ball joints I will do all four at the same time and not one here and another next year etc.. It will save a lot of headache I think.