BlackNite3

I have an electrical gremlin that just reared its ugly head today. It started this morning when I went to start the truck.

Timeline of events:

1.) It usually takes a crank or two to get it to start and stay running, but it always starts. This time, I cranked it the first round, let it catch, then it sputtered and died (as usual). The second time I went to start it it cranked over VERY slowly as if it had a very dead or dying battery. The dash lights flickered dimly and the CD player cylced like it does when the battery is disconnected (tries to eject a disc, if there is one). I stopped cranking, turned the key all the way to "lock," then tried again. Voila! Life was back to normal, it started right up. The dash lights had the usual bright glow about them and all was well. My son and I headed to the grocery store as planned.

2.) After finishing in the store, we went back out and attempted to load the groceries in the back. I didn't let the window get more than 1/2 an inch down before coming to my senses. It was CREEPING so slowly that I thought the battery had drained while we were in the store. Fortunately the truck started, but unfortunately I don't remember the details of how it started, so I don't know if it had similar troubles or not. I don't specifically remember it being an issue though in contrast to what the rear window was telling me would happen. I vaguely remember an initial pause before cranking that was remedied by adjusting the key, but can't be certain.

3.) Fast forward to 10 minutes ago: All loaded up in the truck again (toddler strapped in), and find no life in the truck when I turn the key. The only sign of life is the "Normal" indicator light for the trans on the dash blips on as the key passes from "Acc" to "On." Then when you turn back to "lock," the CD player cycles again. Also, when you turn on the headlights, the buzzer gives a very faint cry for help without turning the lights on.

I don't have time right now to look into it since I'm headed to work (ride is on its way), but other than a power drain, are there any other things I should look for? I tested the battery about 3 weeks ago and it came back 100%, but I guess it could still be the problem. My thoughts are more with electrical wiring (grounding) and other components (Relay?). Any thoughts?

I should also add that the previous owner bypassed the "Start" position on the ignition switch for a push button. While this could be related, it seems unlikely since its function did not seem affected this morning. (P.O. was quoted $500 to fix the ignition switch. I just haven't had time to address that.)

milehigheric

500 to fix an ignition switch? Wow I should be a sparky...It is very hard to say what the problem is, but I am guessing it is a poor connection with this push button start. Throw up some details of how this is wired and maybe some pics of it if you can. A battery voltage check should be enough for now, dont get a load test just yet. Getting a voltage reading from the starter coil is a good idea too

BlackNite3

I haven't looked at the push button wiring in detail but will after work tomorrow. This truck was well maintained by the previous-previous owner, but in the 4 months or so that the last person had it, their friends' husbands' sisters' cousins' nephew the mechanic "fixed" a lot of problems that I have since undone and fixed properly. The starter button is on the to-do list.

I do have some more info to add to the mystery. My wife was driving the 4Runner yesterday (we fight over whose truck it actually is ;-) ) and after she turned the ignition switch off ("Lock") she was able to roll the window up and down. If memory serves correct, this was not yet an option in 1988 ;-). The radio turned off so she was sure that the switch was off. I didn't believe her either and went out to check for myself. By the time I got out there, there was no power to the windows until I turned the ignition on and back off. Weird. I haven't yet looked at the service manual, but is there a relay that might be sticking open (or closed) long enough to send power to the windows?

As I'm thinking through this, if that ignition switch is questionable enough, it could explain a lot. I'll try to look tomorrow, but any suggestions are appreciated.

Thanks!

milehigheric

Yes, essentially everything on the vehicle is switched by or gets power from the ignition switch. A little re wire can effect a whole lot of things...

Just so I have a little idea of how it is wired and operates, does the push button only start the engine? As in you start the vehicle with the button but turn it off using the key?...Secondly, does the key (when turned to start) still work or is it ONLY the button that can be used to start the vehicle.

Im assuming he has cut the stock starter solenoid wire, shoved a momentary push button inline and connected it to AM1 directly or to either the ACC1 or IGG1 circuits. As I said, a poor connection in either of those three circuits will effect a lot of things. And then there is always the question that if he touched this what else did he modify.

When you have a look, I would probably expect to see oozy electrical tape and twisted together wires...prepare yourself haha

BlackNite3

You nailed it with the oozy electrical tape and the twisted wires as his M.O. That's how the rear window was "fixed" (a toggle on the dash pretty much wired straight to the motor where a few more top bolts would have fixed it ;-) ).

And yes, the push button only replaces the momentary starter function of the ignition switch. The switch still does all the rest. I'm not sure what the abbreviations you gave mean (ACC1, AM1, etc.)

I'll be outside taking a peek at it in the AM so I hopefully won't have to leave my wife without a car all day.

Mountain Cop

My first step with electrical problems is often as simple as beefing up the grounds. If you are running "clean" power, you have a better shot of everything working. I have been surprised by what it has fixed. You might give it a shot.

I think you are dead on with the window relay staying open (or closed, I suppose). Again, if the ground is bad, then that might happen. Good luck!

milehigheric

AM1 is the name given to the circuit that provides power to bassicly everything in the cabin, as well as the starter solonoid. It ends at the ignition switch where it is split into ACC (first position), IGG (second position, on) and start (third position).

annoyingrob

Start with the basics, and make sure your battery terminals are clean. I've had a dirty terminal before that would completely kill the car after a hard discharge (like cranking the starter), only to come back to life by wiggling the connection.

BlackNite3

Yeah, I'm starting to think it may be a ground issue. It started just fine with only a little help from the battery charger, and then worked without help after work. The cables look questionable and even look a little fraid at the connectors. I'll try and clean all that up tomorrow and see how it goes, especially the ground.