Ericj359

I have a 93 4runner sr5 4x4 auto v6 it shakes at idle and has a bad miss pulled the wire off cylinder 3 nothing changed theres my problem same as number 4 the injectors are all good as well before you go and tell me i just need injectors been there done that i have also replaced timing belt cap and rotor wires and plugs it starts rite up just shakes and misses. I have no idea what i need to replace to fix this. crank position sensor? ecm? efi relay? wiring harness? this is my dd so i could really use some help

scope103

Put the inductive pickup for your timing light on the plug wire to each of the two non-working cylinders. Does the timing light flash? If not, the plug isn't firing. (While you're at it, be sure you've got the right wire to the right plug.)

Ericj359

i have fire to those cylinders ive pulled the plug layed it on a bolt and cranked it perfect spark. I have been working on it now and before those two plugs were bone white now they have color so im sure im getting fuel now. However when its idling i can hear a hissing noise like a vacc leak at my valve covers and im hoping that is why i have a rough idle but more advice would be helpful i am new to these 3.0s

scope103

Even if the plugs are firing, if they fire at the wrong time that's no good at all. So do check that the wires go to the right plugs.

sb5walker

Have you checked compression? A cyl won't fire without enough of it. The proper procedure on a 3VZE involves:

1. Warm up the motor to operating temp, then shut off.
2. Remove the air hose between air meter and throttle body.
3. Unplug the cold start injector.
4. Unplug the igniter.
5. Remove the plugs.
6. Attach the compression tester and have a helper crank the motor while holding gas pedal to the floor.
7. Watch the needle as it climbs with each compression stroke. Take the max reading, or the reading after a maximum of 6 compression strokes. Take the reading after the SAME number of compression strokes for all the other cyls.

http://www.ncttora.com/fsm/1993/engine/66compress.pdf

If you find low compression, a leakdown test can often pinpoint the source of the leak.

All injectors should have power all of the time when ignition is on; the ecu fires them by grounding them. Power goes from terminal IG2 of the ignition switch to all the injectors (black wire with red stripe), then injectors for cyls 1, 3 & 5 are wired together to ecu terminal #10 (white wire with red stripe); 2, 4 & 6 to terminal #20 (solid white wire). (IG2 also powers the ignition coil and igniter, also with a black wire w/red stripe.) When ignition is on, you should see power on both terminals #10 & #20 on the ecu (use backprobe adapters on your multimeter test leads, or if you don't have them, push a needle into the connector and press the positive lead against that and the neg lead to any good ground).

If you see power on both #10 & #20 when ignition is on, it means that there is a path between the ignition switch and ecu, BUT, because three injectors are wired in parallel, you would see power at the ecu even if only one of the three injectors had a good connection. So, if you're trying to verify injectors, you still have to check each one for continuity.

http://www.ncttora.com/fsm/1990-1995...emci/eng3r.pdf (wiring diagram)

http://www.ncttora.com/fsm/1993/engine/86troubles.pdf (ecu terminal map & injector troubleshooting tips - the tips are on page EG2-194)

Ericj359

im sure i have good compression because the power is there just shakes when i put it drive and the motor shakes some at idle once you hit the gas the problem goes away. I might add that my brake booster is faulty as well so i think i cold have a leak there but when i pull the booster line and put my thumb on it nothing changes so im sort of stumped. I also replaced all vacuum lines and bypassed the bimetal valve as it was broken and did new valve cover gaskets this really improved the rough idle alot but im very meticulous and would like to have this issue solved. I checked the grounds for the injectors also cleaned them up checked all connectors and all the splices in the harness. I have a hole in my exhaust to i thought that could be it to so i un hooked it and nothing changed im at a loss

sb5walker

You stated in your opening post that the motor "has a bad miss pulled the wire off cylinder 3 nothing changed theres my problem same as number 4". If you pull a plug wire and nothing changes, then indeed it is likely the cylinder is not firing. However much power the motor has, it no doubt will have more if all cylinders are firing. Plus, running a motor with a dead cylinder will eventually damage it.

There are are three things that can cause a miss: no spark, no fuel, or no compression (and of course the timing of those events). If you have a good spark (and the wires are properly routed), and if the injector is firing and is not clogged, then it's reasonable to check the compression. That has to be done with a gauge - there's no way I know of of determining the compression in each cylinder without one. And it's possible for one or a few cylinders to be low while the others are fine. The motor might still develop decent power that way, but it won't last.

Ericj359

yeah that would make sense that those two cylinders could be low and dragging at low rpms then when i hit the gas they could gain enough compression to fire im assuming because as soon as i hit the gas the motor stops vibrating. The plugs are new as well as the cap and rotor and wires and the injectors on those two cylinders are new as well because i thought the injectors were bad. is it possible for the motor to run decent if the distributor is of by a tooth? when i turn the cap counter clock wise the idle goes super high when i turn it clock wise it goes to a slow rumble and almost stalls while shacking badly runs best with the washer in the middle of the adjustment slot. sorry for rambling im just super lost on this issue

sb5walker

Well, the motor will run over a range of advance settings, but I would set it between 10 and 12 degrees with a TE1 to E1 jumper set in the check connector and hot idle at 800. I think Autozone lends timing lights for free or very cheap if you don't have one. Watch the fan and belts while using it, of course. And they should have a compression gauge also.

Ericj359

yeah i will go borrow a timing light and a compression gauge and get back to you on what i find thank you for your help

Ericj359

i set the timing with a light around 10 deg have yet to get a compression check i might add as well that my brake booster is bad and i can hear a faint hissing on that side of the engine at idle i can just barely hear it but its there gosh its frustrating do you think that a dirty throttle body could cause the rough idle i cleaned out already but it was full of dirt like sand almost not sure how it got that dirty

vital22re

iTrader: (2)

Hurry up and do a compression check to rule out internal problems. If you are hearing hissing that very well could be your problem. The intake boots are well known to dry,crack, and leak. Take a can of carb cleaner and spray around the injectors and any area that you think you hear hissing. If the idle fluctuates when you spray an area it very well could be where your leak is.

Ericj359

my buddy is bringing over his compression gauge on friday so i will know then

Ericj359

checked the compression on the 2 non firing cylinders today and i got 40 psi out of both so im thinking i need to adjust my valves

sb5walker

Bummer dude - sorry to hear that. Most often with this motor it's the exhaust valves, that have stretched over time to the point where they start leaking. Unfortunately, what happens next is that the valves and seats burn. It takes some time for that, but not much. Odds are, unfortunately, that you may need to have a couple seats and valves replaced - not an easy or cheap matter. You can try adjusting the valves, but that in itself is a challenging job as, first, you have to remove the plenum and a bunch of stuff attached to it, and second, adjusting the valves on an overhead cam motor is not easy - the special tool needed to depress the lifter (so you can replace the shim) doesn't work very well. It helps to have another set of hands helping, and even then the neighbor's kids are going to learn some new words...

Another option is to buy a rebuilt motor. You don't give your location, but if you're on the east coast, there is a reportedly good rebuilder in Maryland who sells motors using MLS gaskets and ARP studs for $2200. Multi-layer Steel gaskets are a great idea for this motor, given the problems with the block/head design. If installed correctly, MLS gaskets should be bombproof. And they use ARP head studs, which pretty much guarantees bombproofability, haha. I think they prefer to rebuild your own motor. If you can afford 2 grand out of pocket, that might be the way to go. They give a $200 credit for a good core and give a freight credit up to $150. And they offer a 3 year/36k mile warranty, so they stand behind their work. Here are the links on that:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=150754905291
http://www.dennysautomachineinc.com/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ynBnOxLpKkw

If you want to try adjusting the valves, this post may be helpful:
http://www.toyotanation.com/forum/80...ml#post3137919

Good luck, dude, let us know what happens. Give your location - there might be a forum member near you who would be willing to lend a hand.

And let Eric's unfortunate experience be a warning to other 3VZE owners - the exhaust valves on this motor stretch over time, and must be checked every 80-90k or so. Otherwise they stop sealing, and then they burn, and then you're out a bunch of time, effort and money.

Ericj359

thank you for the advice im going to check the clearances on those two cylinders i feel that i might get lucky because the compression guage was holding pretty good and not falling i will let you know how the adjustment goes im ordering the valve compression tool on ebay 20 bucks im very experianced with shimming valves as i am a dirt bike mechanic you may laugh if you want but these new fourstroke bikes are nothing but miniture single cylinder formula one engines. if worst come to worst the heads are coming off my 91 4runner and going on this one like i said thank you for the advice

Ericj359

i ended up selling it didnt feel like dealing with it anymore just letting you guys know