Johnsoline

So I'm building a synthesized (wood) gas rig, and I am also to rebuild the engine. I know that synthesized gas is roughly 104 octane, so the 20/22R hybrid would get more power out of it than the straight 22R. However, I also need to be able to run it on highway, because this gas I plan to use will only take me up to about 40 miles an hour.

So I need to be able to run it on gasoline as well, and the more variability of fuel I have, the better.

I need to know the compression ratio to expect on a 20/22 hybrid, and what types of gasoline to use. I hear that I can run as low as 87 octane, as long as the "edges of the combustion chamber are smoothed to prevent hot spots."

The thread I found this information: http://board.marlincrawler.com/index.php?topic=50868.0

Is this correct? The reactor will also be able to produce steam to mix into the intake if the motor is pinging or otherwise has problems with octane being too low, however this uses energy and water, which I have a limited supply of. So I'd like to be able to run straight gas without using that system unless I have no other options.

I intend to use a stock Aisin carburetor. Modifications will be above it, with the gas/air mixture piped in through the side of the air filter pan.

Any ideas or recommendations?

rowdy235

Can't really provide much help since I have never heard of what you are proposing, but I have never seen a 20/22r or any combination of the two that couldn't run on regular (87 octane) pump gas, assuming you don't add any additional performance adders. Reading that post looks like some people have had issues, I see your in a warmer climate so may need to run 89 or 93 octane.

I wouldn't do the steam idea. I can't imagine an engine lasting very long if every time its driven the insides are being steam cleaned.

Johnsoline

I'm not proposing steam in the sense of a cloud of hot atomized water, but more as a vapor, i.e. invisible/true vapor. But I'll have to look into the effects of this on both cast iron and aluminum. Thank you for minding me of this.

I've been told that the motor will "ping" if it's not run off of the highest octane. However, I do live at 5,000 ft.

bootscootboogie

iTrader: (1)

I met a guy that has a Ford van with a 460 yesterday and he runs his fuel line through a port in a radiator that heats up the fuel before it hits the carb and increases mileage. I love reading about this stuff and hearing about but I don't know much about it. Don't meet many people that do this stuff. What are you trying to achieve?

Johnsoline

Want to have a system that allows me to run the vehicle without paying for gas, and also makes me able to obtain fuel almost anywhere at any time.

Also it could be good for when gasoline begins to disappear/gets more expensive.

But this Ford van you speak of; what mileage did he get? I am familiar with this system, it pretty much exists to hear gasoline (often to a vapor) to increase its volume. That system makes the gasoline burn more wholly, (and more cleanly) but reduces power quite a bit.

bootscootboogie

iTrader: (1)

He said it got 30mpg. Which I find hard to believe honestly.

Johnsoline

What kind of van was it?

bootscootboogie

iTrader: (1)

One of those big work vans. I think it's called an Econoline or something

farrier

How about a diesel swap, then run veggie oil?

I ran used fryer oil in a VW Rabbit. Had a two tank system. Pretty simple.

Johnsoline

I've considered a diesel swap, and in fact am planning to do so, on my 87.

My 83 is the one that is reserved for syngas.

83danimal

That sounds awesome, Ive heard of somebody w a wood burning car, love to hear how that turns out. Im also starting to do an om617 turbo diesel swap into one of my 83's!

Johnsoline

Om617?

83danimal

its a mecedies 5 cylinder turbo diesel. theres a coupla threads on swappin em to solid axle toy 4x4's. A few places make motor mounts, tranny adapters, notched oil pans n other stuff for the swap

farrier

Also check out VW 1.9L TD or TDI
Would be more room in the engine bay then Mercedes I believe.

TurboDieselRunner

I have a 94 4runner and a 79 pickup w/the om617 conversions. They are great. Mileage is real good,if you run 2 fuel tanks you can run waste motor oil (off road only) for legal reasons. I like a 60/40 mix of diesel/atf and filtered wmo. The wood gasification is OK for a carbureted gas motor. Piping heated gas from wood and grass to the carb. Works well on stationary generators too. I don't have any experience w/synthetic gas though. Please give a little more background on it if you don't mind. I did my own conversions on my trucks. I may post more elsewhere, don't want to get off topic.

Johnsoline

Wood gas is also called synthesized gas.

I'm thinking about doing the 20/22 hybrid in order to increase compression. I've heard about milling and polishing the head to "prevent hotspots" in order to retain the use of 87 octane, but I'm not to clear on the subject.

Could you further elaborate on om617?

Go ahead and post as much as you want here, all conversions have valuable information, it's on topic.

I have invented some processes to use in the gasifier unit, ones that I hope will increase hydrogen yield.

With a Fischer-Tropsch design hopefully in the future beyond this, I will produce an actual gasoline substitute. But I have to develop the gasifier and make it work optimally first.

TurboDieselRunner

The om617 is really just another example of a gas motor converted to use diesel. I believe it is about 60% efficient. Obviously there are better motors available currently. I tend to be a fan of simple mechanical design. In my opinion it equals reliability. I lost my alternator belt on a trip to northern Wisconsin. It wasn't a problem, as long as the motor has fuel it keeps running. The om617 has minimal electric needs, is easy and inexpensive to acquire. Once you study them they are relatively easy to work on. I have only spent 200$ or less for the Mercedes tools needed to work on them. Once you get past the fear of its a Mercedes they really are a nice motor. Parts are cheap and readily available. Stock it puts out somewhere around 190ft lbs of torque. A hot rod motor its not. For the $ to get big power from the om617 you are better off w/something else. If you are looking for reliability and economy w/better than 3.0 performance its a real winner. You can't beat the waste motor oil capability. I haven't used veggie but I have a friend who makes bio diesel. Veggie oil works on these too. Diesel stores so much longer than gasoline. I have run 10year old diesel in my 4runner. No problems at all. I love gasification for generators and compressors. Even propane is nice for gas motors. I have yet to see in person a good mobile gasification setup that can be a daily driver. Needless to say, I am I interested to see the end results of synth gas.

skypilot

iTrader: (1)

Forget it. You are doing an engineering exercise and I suggest strongly you build this on a dummy table till you get all the bugs worked out.

I would not use a 22r; I would use an SBC at 9.5 : 1 CR so you can use pump gas. Readily available 5.7l SBC so much less hassle than a 20/22R hybrid. Also you chassis choice is too small, there is a reason the other fellow choose a van.

Johnsoline

SBC?

Pump gas? A 20/22 can use pump gas. I don't understand what you mean?

Chassis choice?

TurboDieselRunner

Skypilot has a point, I built a motor cart on casters so I could experiment w/the om617. Its easier to isolate variables and problems if you were to set up an inexpensive "lab" on wheels, a table, etc. Meaning a controlled motor and your proposed fuel set up. Similar to a motor cart or a bare frame w/motor and fuel system. Once you have it working you can transplant.