HighLux

I was doing some reading. (yes I can read some...lol)
I found out that copper lines run in the shop for air supply condense the water from the air quicker than rubber hoses. So I want to make a run from my compressor to my blasting set up...and one to the garage as well.

Need some ideas...pictures...of how you have stuff hooked up. Also maybe a recommendation for a reasonably priced inline water seperator.

I can sweat pipe...so the actual install isnt the issue...just set ups on how you plumbed drains etc. Heck could even be the setup you have at work or something. My basement isnt finished. I got pretty wide open runs. compressor is in basement...mounted on studs epoxied in the concrete with rubber isolators. Ran on 220 with a relay swith in garage.

Thanks in advance.

lobukbuild

water in compressors is caused by heat at the pump head. keep your pump running as cool as you can, fresh air, regular oil changes etc. make the connection between the pump and tank long by coiling the tube a few times, this allows air to cool on its way to the tank, ive also seen people buy copper pipe w/ cooling fins (like whats used in home heating) and add it in. this will help get the water condensing in the tank. from there out to shop use what ever piping that will cool the fastest, aluminum or copper is better than steel, rubber or pvc , use finned pipe if you can this will condense the water even more. at the end of your supply line is where you want to add yor water seperater , get it as far away from the source as possible. the object is to get the water to condense before you try to remove it. alot of people put the water trap to close to the compressor and have a hard time trying to remove the moisture from hot air. with that said , i use 3/4 copper (3/4 adds volume to air supply like a larger tank would, bonus) its routed the long way around my shop then into a home made seperator and then to my outlets where id actually connect my hoses to. my seperator is nothing more than a semi prefferated 1/2 inch 3 foot tube inside a larger 4-6 inch 4 foot tube with drain at the bottom. i used pvc. air in top of small tube blows thru and water collects on prefferations and drips into bottom of large tube and air is recovered at top of large tube. its simple if really think about whats causing the problem in the first place (heat) and you need to cool it to before you can realy seperate it and you need to seperate it before you can really remove it from the system.

HighLux

Geat info!! I never paid attention to this stuff....and had seperator right off compressor before. Contant moisture in air. Then I started reading on painting cars and stuff. They talked about getting seprator away from compressor with 50ft of line then addingseperator etc. To give it tme to cool.

Been wanting to redo my air setup for awhile now. Had it ran to retractable reel in garage. Ill probably just hard line into garage and run a outlet or 2.

That reel was very dangerous...you think you had it pulled out and clicked in....then it would shoot across the garage taking out anything in its way.

lobukbuild

did the same thing with my first compressor. tank seperator regulator all in 8". hmmm wheres all this water coming from? lol!

thebeeler

Thats the standard shop layout I give to people so they can get an idea of what will work best. Air compressor and rotary air screw repair/installation is something I specialize in and do on a weekly basis. Water separators are designed to work at a minimum of 25ft away, 50ft for full efficiency. 3/4" pipe is a minimum 1 1/4" is best but not all air compressors can support that much extra air space. You might also might not be able to fit 50' in your shop. You have to build the system around your space and the amount of air you will be actually using. And remember the smaller or cheaper the air tool, the more air it will consumes.

lobukbuild

you could double back your piping to gain distance. whats your thoughts on finned piping like whats used in home heating apps? ive seen it done a couple times and seems to work.

thebeeler

Many air compressors come with it from the factory. I have it in giant rolls and will swap pumps over to it if I know the compressor will be shoved in a closet, ei optical or dental office, or if it's going to be outside of a shop in an area with limited air flow. We commonly see temps of 120-150 in a shed in the summer. Some of the really nice Air Compressors will have a radiator between the tank and the pump. And then of course you have Air Screws that will have a refrigerated after dryer on the unit.

lobukbuild

have you used it in the out going line between the tank and seperater/regulator outlet at the end of thhe line? or just at the pump to tank connection?

HighLux

That drawing actually made it pretty simple for me. Keep going though....gears are spinning up in my head now. Rusty gears with chipped teeth, but they are spinning.

So I'm thinking copper. Type L. Silverstar #8 solder. Shut offs above and below each drop.

What kind of water seperator/regulator combos you like for end of each run?
Within reason on price of course.

Also...anyone have an autodrain setup on compressor?

thebeeler

I have not used it for that, just for the pump to tank connection.


Yes, most of the units I install will have an auto drain function built into them, it is tied into the head unloader and will drain water every time the pump cycles. They also make simple 115v auto drains that you put onto the drain on your tank. They will have 2 dials on them, 1 for the amount of time the valve opens and another for the time in-between drains. They also make low oil shut offs. Heck some of the big rotary screws have a giant touch screen on the side of them to monitor it's "vitals", and will send me out an email when they need servicing, but those units cost upwards of $28k..
An example of an auto drain valve


As far as a water separator cost is the main factor, I sell a lot of RTI 6900's they are very easy to service, Devillbiss HAR-602's, the smaller HAR-680 or the QC3 if you want a desiccant also. Then for smaller and cheaper units, hobbyist DIY person, I sell Midwest Control products they are generally USA made and are of excellent quality. Just not big enough for a body shop environment. I would love to tell you that the Copies of the Devillbiss units that Harbor Freight sells are not of the same quality, but Devillbiss units now come out of China and Taiwan too.

crazypaint

My buddie fid his in pvc piping works awsome no hot or cold pipe to make water

HighLux

PVC is really dangerous and illegal in commercial shops in a lot of states.

Your friend didn't do his research or is an idiot.

Google PVC airline explosion.

Oils in compressed air degrade the PVC.

iron or copper Pipe doesn't make water....it takes it from the compressed air....which is what you want.

wyoming9

iTrader: (1)

Running a Plasma unit and Sand blaster I run Motor Guard Filters right at each piece of equipment .

Even though I have a water filter at the compressor outlet .

Different compressor MFG suggest different piping suggestions

thebeeler

Ya when i go into a shop with PVC I generally just leave. I can be picky about what I work on. At my shop I run the Motor Guard M-60 units at each piece of equipment as well, on top of each hose reel having it's own water/oil separator. The M-60/M-30's are a great little unit, but are a little over the top for most weekend warriors. But a must have for tools such as a plasma.

combatcarl

I make pvc pipe for a living. Water pressure pipe is rated and tested to withstand WATER pressure, not air pressure. Very different. I've had several people tell me that they run pvc for air. Dumb. Period. We pressure test water pipe to over a thousand pounds, hydraulic tester. If you screw up, and don't bleed the air out before pressurizing, it explodes. Violently. And if you use pvc conduit for pressurized air, you're up for a Darwin Award. Along with people who don't use jack stands.

Sent from my NSA screened iPhone

aztoyman

That Sharpe diagram says it all. I'm in Arizona with VERY little humidity but I still get some. Especially during monsoon season.


I put my 80 gal vertical tank Ingersoll-Rand compressor in a shed outside my garage so I don't have to listen to it. The outlet is halfway up the tank and a drain on bottom that I drain daily at least. I ran 3/4" copper from the compressor about 30' on a down slope to another drain.


I then had it turn 90 degrees into the wall of my garage and 90 degrees up the inside wall and at an upward angle towards the ceiling. It loops around the ceiling and then down to drains at the bottom of several down legs.


Each leg has an outlet for regulators or dryers several feet from the bottom away from settling moisture.


It's tempting to make a nice looking horizontal piping system but, I made all my horizontal sections with a slope with a drain at the end. I ALWAYS get water out of the bottom of my tank and SOMETIMES get a little water out of the drain at the end of the long run from the tank to the garage. I have never yet got any moisture out of the drains at the bottom of the supply legs inside the garage.


You guys in humid climates will have more moisture to deal with than I do but putting drains at the ends of sloped runs will help a lot.

aztoyman

Looking back at the diagram, my set up is very similar. But where you see the tee's in the top line facing down......I put my Tee's pointing up and then loop back down.


The moisture tends to run at the bottom of the pipe and down into your down legs if the Tee's face down.

HighLux

That is what you want....that's why you put a ball valve at the end of every down run. To drain it.

aztoyman

Highlux, I realize that. I get more moisture at the end of the run and less in my down legs. Where the tools are.


Less work for my moisture traps. Desiccant lasts longer. I've actually never had anything to drain in my down legs because I caught it all before it got there.

wyoming9

iTrader: (1)

Truth be told I have my Air Compressor about 30' from my bed I fall asleep I never hear it run.

I have to keep it in the warm other wise the cold causes contraction and just about all the fittings leak.

Keep it worn no problem go figure.