Ported or Sealed?

Greg_Canada · 07-19-2004, 09:38 AM

Alright, got my sub, amp and everything needed to hook it up, now i have to build a box for it.
It says for louder/stronger use ported. It has all the dimensions of how to make a ported or sealed box (came with the sub). When i make the box, would it make it any worse if i angled it with the rear seat, (making a few more cubic inches inside the box) if it was ported? Would it make it sound bad?

BTW, i have a gen1 4runner with a kayline in the summer months, and a hard top in the cold...
I hear ported would be best (i'm only using 1 sub so i want to get the most out of it, storage space isn't a huge issue either but i still want room to put back there).

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MellamoPOUND · 07-19-2004, 09:40 AM

I have a sealed and feel it "hits" harder than ported boxes. No, an angle on the box wont screw up anything.

LBC994runner · 07-19-2004, 09:56 AM

It depends on the type of sound you want to get from your sub. For tighter, clean bass, you should use a sealed box. A sealed box would be good for rock music.

Ported will get louder, thumping bass, which would be good for rap music.

Bumpin' Yota · 07-19-2004, 10:11 AM

Ported. Don't even mess around with sealed.

If you build the box properly it will have equal the sound quality, if not better sound quality than sealed, and it will have double the output...

Use 3/4" MDF or HDF, use Elmers Pro Bond wood glue, and #8 2" Coarse drywall screws to secure everything. After it's all said and done, fiberglass the interior, then play around with some polyfil (yes, polyfill in a ported box)...

Greg_Canada · 07-19-2004, 10:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bumpin' Yota

Ported. Don't even mess around with sealed.

If you build the box properly it will have equal the sound quality, if not better sound quality than sealed, and it will have double the output...

Use 3/4" MDF or HDF, use Elmers Pro Bond wood glue, and #8 2" Coarse drywall screws to secure everything. After it's all said and done, fiberglass the interior, then play around with some polyfil (yes, polyfill in a ported box)...

Sorry, i missed the last two, fiberglass the interior and polyfil? Sorry, still a noob, where do you get this from/how do you use it?
What's the diff between MDF and HDF? (i only know of MDF)...

Thanks,
Greg

Bumpin' Yota · 07-19-2004, 08:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greg_Canada

Sorry, i missed the last two, fiberglass the interior and polyfil? Sorry, still a noob, where do you get this from/how do you use it?
What's the diff between MDF and HDF? (i only know of MDF)...

Thanks,
Greg

Fiberglass, you know the same stuff you patch boats with, or do body work with? Home Depot, Lowes, and scotties all carry it. I comes in 16oz, 24oz, 64oz and 1 gallon tins. You really dont need to put any mat or cloth down over the interior seams, but you can if you want to. Instructions are on the can. All you do is mix the resin with the hardener in the proportions listed, and after the listed time, it will begin to harden.

Polyfil is the trademarked name for fiber used and marketed for audio use. Just go to your local Wal-Mart, go to the linens area, and buy a bag of polyester pillow stuffing. That stuff is poly fill.

MDF = medium density fiberboard. Some places mislabel mdf as HDF as in High Density Fiberboard. The stuff you want will weigh 108lbs for a 4' x 8' x 3/4" sheet. It's fiber is VERY VERY fine and the stuff is ultra dense.

Greg_Canada · 07-20-2004, 09:04 AM

I got some mdf (my local home depot doesn't sell HDF)...
Fiberglass.. or what i call bondo LOL... hell i should have known i have 2 big cans or por15 fiber sitting infront of me... but those are for the body!
Would it be ok to just use latex caulking to fill in the corner gaps?

FUZION · 07-20-2004, 05:15 PM

Dont mean to steal thread, but should i get a basic sealed box for $50 or get a ported box where the subs face each other with a plexiglass 14x14in cover in the front center for $50.
I like Rap and advice?

Bumpin' Yota · 07-20-2004, 07:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FUZION

Dont mean to steal thread, but should i get a basic sealed box for $50 or get a ported box where the subs face each other with a plexiglass 14x14in cover in the front center for $50.
I like Rap and advice?

Thats not a ported box, that is a prefab bandpass. AVOID prefab bandpasses like the plague.

A vented box will have the subs and ports firing into the air, not into a chamber.

I'd say buy the sealed prefab, and fiberglass the inside of it.

Bumpin' Yota · 07-20-2004, 07:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greg_Canada

I got some mdf (my local home depot doesn't sell HDF)...
Fiberglass.. or what i call bondo LOL... hell i should have known i have 2 big cans or por15 fiber sitting infront of me... but those are for the body!
Would it be ok to just use latex caulking to fill in the corner gaps?

Ideally there should be no voids in your box if you cut correctly. If there are, I'd use a LOT of fiberglass to fill it in...

Greg_Canada · 07-20-2004, 08:07 PM

Naw, no big gaps, the caulking "just to make sure"... sound good?

FUZION · 07-20-2004, 08:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bumpin' Yota

Thats not a ported box, that is a prefab bandpass. AVOID prefab bandpasses like the plague.

A vented box will have the subs and ports firing into the air, not into a chamber.

I'd say buy the sealed prefab, and fiberglass the inside of it.

edit: what role does the fiberglass play inside the box?

WolfpackTLC · 07-21-2004, 06:21 PM

I'm gonna disagree w/ Bumpin' Yota. All the SQ and SQ + systems I've ever built/heard/tuned/scored used SEALED boxes. By nature, a sealed box has a better sound curve. You can't fight the efficiency of a ported box. That's why they're used a lot for lower watt systems and such. Bandpasses amplify this... but they also narrow the frequency response that much more.

I have no idea what size sub or type of sub this guy is using, so I can't recommend either way, but...

If it's an 8 or a 10 inch sub and you're running at least a TRUE 150 watts per sub, then go sealed. You'll get better low frequency extension and better transient response.

If it's a 12 or a 15 and you want to bump with 300 watts or less, go ported. If you're playing w/ the big boys and have high RMS subs w/ 1000 watts or more, then the world is your oyster. Sealed or ported, it depends on what you want. Transient response w/ tight, crisp bass, or BOOM? For the latter, go ported. For the former, go sealed.

I will agree with him about the box construction and such. Measure once, cut twice. I use drywall screws instead of brads, and I use liquid nail on the seams and silicone on the interior. Fiberglass always, and polyfill only for sealed.

Rock on!

WolfpackTLC · 07-21-2004, 06:25 PM

Bumpin-

Kinda OT, but I see you hit your highest numbers at or around 42 hz... I thought I was the only one... I did a 147.8 w/ 2 Stroker 18's and 2 MMATT's D2's. The enclosures were tuned to 40hz... Woo hoo! Gotta love the LOW bass!

J

Greg_Canada · 07-21-2004, 08:06 PM

Alright, i've got a 12" 300RMS sub at 4 ohms, (200rms amp at 4ohm's)... running 4 gauge power cable... 4v preouts on the deck...
I'm trying out the ported box cause i'm gonna need more BOOM cause of the soft/no top... if it was a newer truck i'd probably go sealed...
Anyways, thanks guys,
Greg

Bumpin' Yota · 07-25-2004, 07:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WolfpackTLC

I'm gonna disagree w/ Bumpin' Yota. All the SQ and SQ + systems I've ever built/heard/tuned/scored used SEALED boxes. By nature, a sealed box has a better sound curve. You can't fight the efficiency of a ported box. That's why they're used a lot for lower watt systems and such. Bandpasses amplify this... but they also narrow the frequency response that much more.

I have no idea what size sub or type of sub this guy is using, so I can't recommend either way, but...

If it's an 8 or a 10 inch sub and you're running at least a TRUE 150 watts per sub, then go sealed. You'll get better low frequency extension and better transient response.

If it's a 12 or a 15 and you want to bump with 300 watts or less, go ported. If you're playing w/ the big boys and have high RMS subs w/ 1000 watts or more, then the world is your oyster. Sealed or ported, it depends on what you want. Transient response w/ tight, crisp bass, or BOOM? For the latter, go ported. For the former, go sealed.

I will agree with him about the box construction and such. Measure once, cut twice. I use drywall screws instead of brads, and I use liquid nail on the seams and silicone on the interior. Fiberglass always, and polyfill only for sealed.

Rock on!

You mean measure twice cut once

BTW - ported can actually sound better than sealed if it is setup properly. Hence why B&K home audio towers that run 10,000+ usd are all ported. You also have to realise that any setup that utilizes passive radiators is also essentially ported. The mms of the passive = the weight of the air slug in the port so you tune the passive accordingly.

The reason I mention this is because almost all of the home audio subs ive ever seen have passives used or are ported.

As to tight crips bass, that is more of a function of the driver to reproduce a higher frequency (lower midbass,) and most subs have too high of an inductance to easily do this, particularly any high power handling subs. There are some high power handling subs that can play rather high due to their low inductance courtesy of shortening rings used on the pole piece....w7 uses the shortening rings.

You are correct that a vented alignment is far more effiecient, but it also has far more output at low frequencys than a comparable sealed provided the ported is tuned low enough.

ps - I used poly fil to for some great results with some ported 8s of mine....

SPL wise they did a 145.1 legal on the dash from waaaaaaaaaaay back in my cargo area on the classic termlab meter.

NIIIIIIIIIIIIIICE setup btw.

What meter was that on and how did they meter it?

The 158 and change was legal when I had my wall and on the classic termlab (which is a soft mic.) The new termlab is about 8 dB down from that classic mic so it would have done a 150.x or so on the new TL. My last current setup was all from the cargo area and did a 151.6 @ 47hz on the new mic.

But yeah, these trucks LOVE low notes. My very first spl oriented install peaked at 38hz! :eek: It did 153.8 @ 38 on the old soft mic. Today it would have hardly hit a 146 on the new termlab, but my God that thing was FUN in parking garages. And boy howdy did it make everything FLEX...lol

Right now I'm still organizing my amp rack, then have to wire up the 4 zapco 9.0s and extra battery, then I start testing with these L7s....poor pooor subs...lol Thank god for warrentys cuz these little 2" coils aren't going to like 2200 watts each, even if only for burps...LOL

Bumpin' Yota · 07-25-2004, 07:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greg_Canada

Alright, i've got a 12" 300RMS sub at 4 ohms, (200rms amp at 4ohm's)... running 4 gauge power cable... 4v preouts on the deck...
I'm trying out the ported box cause i'm gonna need more BOOM cause of the soft/no top... if it was a newer truck i'd probably go sealed...
Anyways, thanks guys,
Greg

What sub are you using? I can help you out on that part if you need it. I'll be AFC till august 3rd, unless my motel room in London has ethernet....

Bumpin' Yota · 07-25-2004, 07:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FUZION

edit: what role does the fiberglass play inside the box?

To seal it up and strengthen it.

Ideally you want a box that you can quite literally use as a jack stand for your truck and not have the box fail - getting them that overbuilt is kinda hard though.

dbikeman · 07-25-2004, 11:53 PM

My best frequency was also 42Hz in my 3rd gen.

stoutshady · 07-26-2004, 12:44 PM

Hey dbikeman... do you ever get minor dimming with that HO alt? I have the same one btw in a 97' Limited.

dbikeman · 07-26-2004, 03:25 PM

Every now and then yes. Personally I hate it. It produces good power, but ive had nothing but trouble out of it. It was supposed to fit right. I spent 8 hours making custom things to get it to fit. Im to the point now where if I have more trouble out of it, im gonna trash it and try and get one from mr alt.

stoutshady · 09-10-2004, 08:08 AM

Hey dbikeman... I think my excessive amperage alt is being excessively annoying... My damn battery light keeps coming on... now it won't go away. I measured the voltage from the battery with the car on and off and both readings show 12.5v.. This morning it measured 11.75. I'm freaking out. Any thoughts?

dbikeman · 09-10-2004, 08:23 AM

Same thing happened to me to tell you the truth. My alt died about 3.5 months after I got it. Mine did the exact same thing yours is doing. I have to send it back to him and he was going to fix it and send it back. He charged me 90 bucks to fix it even though it was 3.5 months old. He then sent it to the wrong guy and eventually sent me another new one. It took me over 3 weeks to get it back from him so I was without a car for that long. It only took him 2 days to get my alt back, the rest of that time was him screwing around not being a good business man.

stoutshady · 09-10-2004, 09:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dbikeman

Same thing happened to me to tell you the truth. My alt died about 3.5 months after I got it. Mine did the exact same thing yours is doing. I have to send it back to him and he was going to fix it and send it back. He charged me 90 bucks to fix it even though it was 3.5 months old. He then sent it to the wrong guy and eventually sent me another new one. It took me over 3 weeks to get it back from him so I was without a car for that long. It only took him 2 days to get my alt back, the rest of that time was him screwing around not being a good business man.

Aw damn... that sucks man. I'm gonna have to contact the guy. But you eventually got a new alt right? How is that working out? You think it would be better to go somewhere else to get a new one or send it back to him? Thanks for the quick reply man.

dbikeman · 09-10-2004, 02:16 PM

Yea I did get a new one eventually. The new one is working perfect so far. His contact number is 334-791-6272.

07-19-2004, 09:40 AM	#2 (permalink)
MellamoPOUND Registered User Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: New Orleans Posts: 568	I have a sealed and feel it "hits" harder than ported boxes. No, an angle on the box wont screw up anything. __________________ Larry '97 4runner limited 4x4 w/ Rear Locker Tcase skid - Frankenstein Front End Suspension - OME Rear Suspension - Lars Discos - ARB Taco Bumper - Stubbs Standard Sliders - Cobra 18 WXSTII Cb w/ 4' Firestick II Antenna - 285/75/16 MT/Rs on 16x8 Rockcrawler 97 series wheels - 1" Roger Brown body lift - Bud Built Front Skidplate and more Project Beast II Webpage Denver Univeristy Off-Road Club

07-19-2004, 10:11 AM	#4 (permalink)
Bumpin' Yota Registered User Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Sarasota, FL Posts: 3,639	Ported. Don't even mess around with sealed. If you build the box properly it will have equal the sound quality, if not better sound quality than sealed, and it will have double the output... Use 3/4" MDF or HDF, use Elmers Pro Bond wood glue, and #8 2" Coarse drywall screws to secure everything. After it's all said and done, fiberglass the interior, then play around with some polyfil (yes, polyfill in a ported box)... __________________ 3vze, 4x4, sr5, 90, auto, LSD 2x dB Drag World Finalist 2003 Nopi Nat. Street B champ 2004 SBN Street C champ 2004 SBN Advncd NW Champ 2004 Former WR Holder in NW. SPL: 159.8db @ 42hz In loving memory of Jamie Riggs 5/15/85 - 10/8/04

07-21-2004, 06:21 PM	#13 (permalink)
WolfpackTLC Registered User Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Raleigh, NC Posts: 828	I'm gonna disagree w/ Bumpin' Yota. All the SQ and SQ + systems I've ever built/heard/tuned/scored used SEALED boxes. By nature, a sealed box has a better sound curve. You can't fight the efficiency of a ported box. That's why they're used a lot for lower watt systems and such. Bandpasses amplify this... but they also narrow the frequency response that much more. I have no idea what size sub or type of sub this guy is using, so I can't recommend either way, but... If it's an 8 or a 10 inch sub and you're running at least a TRUE 150 watts per sub, then go sealed. You'll get better low frequency extension and better transient response. If it's a 12 or a 15 and you want to bump with 300 watts or less, go ported. If you're playing w/ the big boys and have high RMS subs w/ 1000 watts or more, then the world is your oyster. Sealed or ported, it depends on what you want. Transient response w/ tight, crisp bass, or BOOM? For the latter, go ported. For the former, go sealed. I will agree with him about the box construction and such. Measure once, cut twice. I use drywall screws instead of brads, and I use liquid nail on the seams and silicone on the interior. Fiberglass always, and polyfill only for sealed. Rock on! __________________ 1995 Land Cruiser -ARB'd, OME'D, Slee'd, Warn'd, lifted, locked, dented, WHEELED.

07-21-2004, 06:25 PM	#14 (permalink)
WolfpackTLC Registered User Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Raleigh, NC Posts: 828	Bumpin- Kinda OT, but I see you hit your highest numbers at or around 42 hz... I thought I was the only one... I did a 147.8 w/ 2 Stroker 18's and 2 MMATT's D2's. The enclosures were tuned to 40hz... Woo hoo! Gotta love the LOW bass! J __________________ 1995 Land Cruiser -ARB'd, OME'D, Slee'd, Warn'd, lifted, locked, dented, WHEELED.

07-25-2004, 11:53 PM	#19 (permalink)
dbikeman Contributing Member Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Cleveland, TN Posts: 565	My best frequency was also 42Hz in my 3rd gen. __________________ David Anderson Hit me up on AIM at Dbikeman85(im always on) 98 4runner SR5 w/99bumper 99 scoop hood and 99 headlights Clarion VRX935VD 7" flip out, Excessive Amperage 200amp alt. Kicker Kx1200.1 amp, Eclipse Titanium 12 Stinger 0 gauge and stinger cap. Xstatic Batcap Jaos Aero Billet grille Jason B clears in the corners and bumpers Clear Tailights Magnaflow 18" with 3" Magnaflow tip

07-19-2004, 09:56 AM	#3 (permalink)
LBC994runner Registered User Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Southern California Posts: 149	It depends on the type of sound you want to get from your sub. For tighter, clean bass, you should use a sealed box. A sealed box would be good for rock music. Ported will get louder, thumping bass, which would be good for rap music.

07-20-2004, 09:04 AM	#7 (permalink)
Greg_Canada Registered User Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Toronto Posts: 812	I got some mdf (my local home depot doesn't sell HDF)... Fiberglass.. or what i call bondo LOL... hell i should have known i have 2 big cans or por15 fiber sitting infront of me... but those are for the body! Would it be ok to just use latex caulking to fill in the corner gaps?

07-20-2004, 08:07 PM	#11 (permalink)
Greg_Canada Registered User Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Toronto Posts: 812	Naw, no big gaps, the caulking "just to make sure"... sound good?

07-21-2004, 08:06 PM	#15 (permalink)
Greg_Canada Registered User Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Toronto Posts: 812	Alright, i've got a 12" 300RMS sub at 4 ohms, (200rms amp at 4ohm's)... running 4 gauge power cable... 4v preouts on the deck... I'm trying out the ported box cause i'm gonna need more BOOM cause of the soft/no top... if it was a newer truck i'd probably go sealed... Anyways, thanks guys, Greg

07-26-2004, 12:44 PM	#20 (permalink)
stoutshady Registered User Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: atlanta Posts: 166	Hey dbikeman... do you ever get minor dimming with that HO alt? I have the same one btw in a 97' Limited.

07-26-2004, 03:25 PM	#21 (permalink)
dbikeman Contributing Member Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Cleveland, TN Posts: 565	Every now and then yes. Personally I hate it. It produces good power, but ive had nothing but trouble out of it. It was supposed to fit right. I spent 8 hours making custom things to get it to fit. Im to the point now where if I have more trouble out of it, im gonna trash it and try and get one from mr alt. __________________ David Anderson Hit me up on AIM at Dbikeman85(im always on) 98 4runner SR5 w/99bumper 99 scoop hood and 99 headlights Clarion VRX935VD 7" flip out, Excessive Amperage 200amp alt. Kicker Kx1200.1 amp, Eclipse Titanium 12 Stinger 0 gauge and stinger cap. Xstatic Batcap Jaos Aero Billet grille Jason B clears in the corners and bumpers Clear Tailights Magnaflow 18" with 3" Magnaflow tip

09-10-2004, 08:08 AM	#22 (permalink)
stoutshady Registered User Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: atlanta Posts: 166	Hey dbikeman... I think my excessive amperage alt is being excessively annoying... My damn battery light keeps coming on... now it won't go away. I measured the voltage from the battery with the car on and off and both readings show 12.5v.. This morning it measured 11.75. I'm freaking out. Any thoughts?

09-10-2004, 08:23 AM	#23 (permalink)
dbikeman Contributing Member Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Cleveland, TN Posts: 565	Same thing happened to me to tell you the truth. My alt died about 3.5 months after I got it. Mine did the exact same thing yours is doing. I have to send it back to him and he was going to fix it and send it back. He charged me 90 bucks to fix it even though it was 3.5 months old. He then sent it to the wrong guy and eventually sent me another new one. It took me over 3 weeks to get it back from him so I was without a car for that long. It only took him 2 days to get my alt back, the rest of that time was him screwing around not being a good business man. __________________ David Anderson Hit me up on AIM at Dbikeman85(im always on) 98 4runner SR5 w/99bumper 99 scoop hood and 99 headlights Clarion VRX935VD 7" flip out, Excessive Amperage 200amp alt. Kicker Kx1200.1 amp, Eclipse Titanium 12 Stinger 0 gauge and stinger cap. Xstatic Batcap Jaos Aero Billet grille Jason B clears in the corners and bumpers Clear Tailights Magnaflow 18" with 3" Magnaflow tip

09-10-2004, 02:16 PM	#25 (permalink)
dbikeman Contributing Member Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Cleveland, TN Posts: 565	Yea I did get a new one eventually. The new one is working perfect so far. His contact number is 334-791-6272. __________________ David Anderson Hit me up on AIM at Dbikeman85(im always on) 98 4runner SR5 w/99bumper 99 scoop hood and 99 headlights Clarion VRX935VD 7" flip out, Excessive Amperage 200amp alt. Kicker Kx1200.1 amp, Eclipse Titanium 12 Stinger 0 gauge and stinger cap. Xstatic Batcap Jaos Aero Billet grille Jason B clears in the corners and bumpers Clear Tailights Magnaflow 18" with 3" Magnaflow tip

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