upndair

I need the pros and cons on going full hydro vs hyroassist vs Simple hysteer crossover steering on my soon to be had Dana 60s.

The axles come with an 8" bore double ended RAM, and connections. It just needs the orbital valve and the hoses. It also has the hysteer arms. The seller would like to keep the RAM and the connections - saving me $200, so I don't really know where to go?

I'll tell the rest of the story. The axle's going to have to be shortened. There is a great truss on this that also will have to be removed and altered as would interfere with the leaf springs. The RAM is mounted on the truss. The rig is and will be street driven - yes I know full hydro is illegal, but it basically just goes around town and to the trails. I'll be running 39.50x13.50 IROKs and will need lots of turning power.

I need to decide by Monday, which way I'm going to go - before I send the balance of the money for the axles.

Whaddya all think?

If wish the poll feature was still working on here...

Cebby

Gibby, hydro is way out of my knowledgebase. I can help with the "Poll" though. You have to be a "contributing member" to post a poll now. That's how we can do the great box/bandwidth without pop-up ads and banners.

joez

if you are still wanting mild street manners, just go hydro assist. you will still have plenty of power to turn those near 40" tires, and it wont react to badly on the daily commute.

upndair

Well, I don't have a daily commute since I work from home. My typical truck driving now is taking the kids on errands since the love riding in daddy's truck the best, the post office and bank, and then wheeling.

What are the negative road manners with full hydro? I understand that they now have full hydro steering with feed back where the steering well returns to center and you get pressure on the wheel when you're turning into something - ie a rock.

I'm also looking at the cost/reward ratio. I can save $200 bucks off the setup by letting him keep the hydro stuff and then all I'd need might be a tie rod and drag link if my current ones aren't long enough. I'm not sure if the Toyota steering pump is strong enough to turn the near 40" tires against resistance.

joez

o well then, i was unawair that they had return to center full hydro now. i have driven a bronco that had full hydro, and it was a PITA with the wheel not returning to center. not to mention that it wandered pretty bad, though that may not have been entirely the hydro's fault.

although if you are just driving arround town, im sure that you could get used to driving it. i mean you are going to have to fab up new steering anyway, right?

personally, i would still just go hydro assist, but that is just me. although i am still planning on driving the toyota arround when mine is done.

will the stock toy power steering pump have enough oomph to move the ram when the 40" tire is stuck in a crevace? maybee yours in the runner is larger, but i know on my 83 that pump is pretty small.

scott.475

'Course I'm a little biased, but I vote for the assist version, just because when you are on the road and need that quick steering response, you are really going to need that quick steering response to steer around cars, cows, kids. For me the off-road benefits just aren't worth the on-road risks.

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upndair

It is my understanding that full hydro steering is OVER responsive, not UNDER responsive. Am I mistaken?

joez

the experience i had with it, it was under responsive. it was a little bit slower to react, and the wheels didnt move that fast. in other words, when you cranked hard on the wheel, the tires had to catch up.

Shane

Under/over responsive depends on the pump's flow (ie GPH) and the cylinder's volume, those two factors affect the speed the most. I'd be more worried about failure, there's no backup system like there is with assist-only hydro.


Now Toyota pumps in general are lower flow and/or lower pressure IIRC...

upndair

There's no backup to standard steering either. I've broken studs off the steering arm 3 times and a month ago coming back from Naches, my steering column disconnected from the steering box - that's no steering. Took me right off the road on the Eastern side of Cayuse pass. I missed a huge hole and stopped short of a solid rock wall, by about 3 feet.

It's easier to bring spare fluid and hoses that it is to try to reattached a steering arms that's sheered off the bolts....

Shane

Well ripping off a steering arm is a whole different matter. I'm saying that mechanical linkage from wheel through box to the wheels is the "backup" if you will for the hydro system.

But hey, if you drop your backup 'chute before deploying your main and it tangles.... *splat*

crash

let me put it in simple english

full hydro=VERY HIGH LIABILITY

This is as far as others are concerned. My many many experiances with full hydro (doing another one now) is its a far SUPERIOR steering setup if done right.
BUT, if you are even going to hit the road for ANY length of road then you better keep the full hydro off the rig.

upndair

From the sounds of the input, I should save the $200, put on the Hysteer and then add a RAM assist down the road if I need more push.

My rig will spend some time on the road and although it's rare, my wife will occassionally drive it if I had to take her van somewhere.

Thanks for the input everyone.

Crash, do you think my PS system is strong enough for the new setup?

I order to fit my larger tires on, I'm going to need to move the front axle farther forward - again. I've already moved it as far foward as I can with some major reconstruction in that corner. Do you have any experience with the D60 hysteer and weather or not it should cause any problems with this pitman arm hitting the tire rod on compression?

This is one of the reasons for considering the full hydro steering as it will eliminate that problem. Any further thoughts on this?

I know I could figure it all out when it's here, but I'm shooting for as little down time as possible. I want to have my parts bought, bugeting done etc. Nothing worse that leaving the rig sit for a month waiting for a part.

MNBOY

Gibby,
Just in case you needed reassurance on your decision, I would also vote against full-hydro. I am finishing up the specs for front and rear four-link with full hydro for an LC, but I don't plan on driving it on the streets. Something about all the problems we used to have with the hydro system on the fishing boat in Alaska, and mowing down pedestrians on the sidewalk when it fails in a truck, makes me think other options might be better. Of course, I'm also planning out the suspension and steering for a vehicle I don't even own yet, but the winters in Maine are long and I need something to take up time...
Can't wait to see your truck when this is done.