Valerik

I have an idea for a custom clutch/shifter. I'm not sure if this has been discussed yet, or if this is the right place for it. Feel free to correct me

The hydraulic clutch in my 1st gen 4runner works fine, but I am rolling around ideas for a cable clutch instead of hydraulic. I think it would be easier maintenance if I did it right; I am sure some wouldn't agree.

Now, here is where it gets interesting. I want to design a trigger on my shifter itself that would actuate this cable. Idk if this has been done before, i've never heard of it.

It would be almost a pistol style grip/feel to it. The shift trigger would be attached to a single guide pin on the lower portion of my shift knob, so it could pivot in and out. Sonewhat like this > \||

It would then pull up on the cable, which would be tied to the bottom of the shift lever just above the transmission. You follow?

Then, run it out the bottom of the truck by the transmission on the passenger side, and build a bracket to hold the cable behind the clutch fork.

Modify the fork a bit to accept the end of my cable, and adjust the cable so that it would pull the fork back just as much as the slave cylinder for the hydro clutch pushes.

Now, I would have my clutch and shifter in the same hand when im on the trail.

I could either remove the floor clutch all-together, or keep it installed with the cable clutch as a safe guard.

One of the only possible benefits I see with this would be less maintenance if I designed it well enough, and possibly allowing my feet to hover over brake and accelerator (not worrying about foot clutch, but still having the benefits of a manual transmission). And, of course, the cable would be sleeved.




Does anyone have any opinions on this idea? If need be I can try to draw up my design if you don't quite grasp the concept.

Valerik

I also just realized that I would have to extend the fork on the outside or I would never get enough leverage with my hand. Longer fork and longer clutch trigger.

Valerik

Cheaper idea: bicycle brake handle mounted to shift lever. Just need to figure out how to achieve proper leverage. I'm not sure what the pressure against the fork is, but at the trigger it needs to be around 5-20psi if I want to use my hand and not get worn out (or have a gigantic right hand)

Valerik

Also a few ideas on how to make an electronic clutch system using the trigger on shifter idea, but that one is harder to type out. That involves a potentiometer rigged to the pivot point on the clutch trigger, and a window regulator motor to mechanically drive a cable attached to the clutch fork. I don't know how "low maintenance" that would be though.

Valerik

I love having conversations by myself.

matt92yota

this idea seems like way more trouble than what its worth imo....

Valerik

Many ideas would seem so in the beginning. It could even be a start to converting a standard for a paraplegic driver, aside from accelerator and brake.

idanity

me thinks an automatic would be easier

wyoming9

iTrader: (1)

If you look at the numbers you would have to extend the clutch fork through the frame to come close to the numbers you need at your hand.

With the arm redesigned to work by cable the hydraulics would no longer work without some redesign also.

The fulcrum would need to move also to give you the leverage you want .

this is all just trying to do the math in my head at the start of my first cup of coffee . It might by pretty far off.

then you would need to make it so the cable was at constant tension as you moved the shifter. Does not seem like much at the base of the shifter but as you move higher up the handle it increases quite a bit.

I do think the idea has merit for someone who has lost the use of there legs.

Less maintenance I don`t know I can source parts at almost any autoparts stores . If need be I can patch things together enough to get home .

I am happy to use my foot I would not want to think about having to use my hand even in a limited off road outing

It scares me to think about some of the busier city streets one would look like a tennis player one huge arm the other looks wasted away.

Lets us know how the first 10 prototypes work out.

Mitchell12

I bet you could use a hydraulic brake lever from a motor cycle to actuate the clutch. Mount it on the shifter and it might work. For someone with use of their legs wanting to drive a standard it might work if you swapped the steering wheel for handle bars with a twist grip for throttle on the left and use a steering quickener to cut down how much the bars would need to turn.

Or you could just rig the whole vehicle up like a motorcycle with a suicide shift.

waskillywabbit

iTrader: (-1)

This thread illustrates the difference between "can" and "should".

:wabbit2:

blake.nemitz

i like the motorcycle brake idea. it takes a lot of force to actuate the clutch, even with gorilla hands thats a lot of tension on that cable. hydraulic would be easiest in my opinion. i have tossed the idea around in my head for the same thing. how about a rheostat switch and electric actuator or some type of servo. that way its effortless but you still have that fine clutch control

Valerik

Yeah that's what I was thinking for the disabled version. On the steering column, the throttle would be on the left and brake on the right. I know a guy who is paraplegic yet he still races at the track in pueblo.

And Yeah, sure, I will let you know how all TEN prototypes go.

Just because something is complicated doesn't mean don't try it. Why did they make an automatic coffee pot? Boiling it wasnt hard.

MudHippy

It's been done...in many different ways.

Here's a few...

Manual clutch conversion


Operate a manual transmission vehicle with fingertip clutch control


Right hand clutch

Valerik

The top one isn't actually on the shifter

the second one is probably electrically driven

the third one is still not on the shifter

So no, it has not been done with the same concept that I have.

Now, the second one may be something I would probably design if I can't do it mechanically with simple machines such as leverage and pulleys. I already have a few ideas for that one, but I am by no means an electrician so we will see how that pans out.

Now yes, I do understand the physics of mechanical advantage using pulleys and leverage. Every time you double your leverage, you double the amount of cable that needs to be pulled.

For instance, you have to pull your cable say 1" originally. If I were to double the leverage on the fork by extending it, then I would have to pull 2" of cable.

As I said, I am going to work things out and see what I can do without causing too much of a mess. If I can't figure out how to cable drive it with my trigger design, then I will try the electrical design I have in mind.

One way or another, I will get this to work. If no one else likes it when I'm done it won't matter too much, because I will still have something I enjoy and I can take some pride in.

Valerik

That is an interesting idea. I would think the handlebars in a truck would be a bit dangerous though. Hydraulic brake lever? I will have to look into that one.

Oh and a twist grip for throttle seems kinda cool too, but I know I would probably be one that would have a hard time driving like that in a truck.

Thanks for the opinion

Valerik

You have had that idea, too? Did you have any differing thoughts from what I explained?

Now with the switch and actuator idea, I was thinking about something like that. Many new cars have fly by wiring for the accelerator, then that controls a servo for the actual throttle. Something like that would be neat, because that obviously does have fine control. Now if i could do something like that but with a stronger motor, say a hardcore window regulator, it could work. As far as the return though so it didn't slam in the clutch, I'm still trying to fathom.

Valerik

The first and most basic idea I have; Something like this but in my truck.

85gijunk4x4

i like the idea because i am a left foot amputee, and cruising on some backroads i could just use my hand...even though i just rev-match shift anyway hehe..

cons, my foot is usually tied to the clutch while off road. I feel like it'd be too confusing to teach my hand how to be a clutch and teach my lefty how to be a brake.

thirdly, like stated before, it would be a heavy amount to pull, and i feel like a cable bearing that much load wouldnt last too long. I like the idea of a motocycle brake lever, where you could just tie the hydrolics into the existing hydrolics.

now i would very much so like the idea of this clutch if it didnt always return to the "clutch engaged" position. say i could just pull a lever and leave it there. Of course, it wouldnt be a good idea to leave a clutch in the "partially engaged" position for very long, but it seems like a good idea to use it like that to "ease into something" using a very low gear ratio

Valerik

I am seeking ideas on reducing the amount of pounds the trigger would have to pull; I'll figure it out.

The lever wouldn't have a way to leave the clutch disengaged unless I made some sort of locking mechanism that could be easily unlocked with the right hand. But anything is possible. But you could slowly let off the trigger to engage the clutch smoothly whilst in low range.

In your case of re-teaching your left leg for brake instead of clutch would be a hassle, I'm sure. But after I figure out this clutch design I'm still going to push further into making a trail rig (or a standard truck in general) more friendly for disabled people.

Could go right the first time, or I could have 100 failures before I get it right. Either way I'll get it if I keep trying.

If you would like though, I can keep you updated with this project if you're interested. Even if it's not the thing for you, I would appreciate your points of view on the overall application.