Remington vs. Browning

algranger · 11-01-2009, 02:09 PM

When i was 12, my grandpa bought me a Remington 870 Ex. Mag. 20 ga. for christmas. I've used the hell out of it over the years and kept it in immaculate shape. Always been ready to go when i want with no issues it still works like brand new.

Now i'm 18 and i'm looking to add to my collection, i want a 12 ga.

After hours of research i've narrowed it down to two options.

1- Remington 870 Ex. Mag. Combo
http://www.remington.com/products/fi...gnum_combo.asp

or

2- Browning BPS Hunter
http://www.browning.com/products/cat...item=012211304

http://www.browning.com/products/cat...12&type_id=211

Based on my experience with the Remington i'm tempted to stay loyal and get the 870. It's basic, it has minimal features which makes it extremely reliable which is my primary concern. It's a well built and well rounded gun.

My dad is the owner of the Browning BPS Hunter with the older model 32" barrel
It's one of the most beautiful guns i've seen and while it's a tad heavier than the Remington it's solid and has many nice features. Features like the bottom ejection and speed unloader.

Sooo... I'm torn.

I dont want to hear that Browning is better than Remington because theyre Browning or vice-versa

Lets have some constructive arguments backed up with real facts.

Pictures for the hell of it

Remington 870
http://astorarms.ca/images/non-restr...ga%20aaaaa.jpg

Browning BPS
http://www.browning.com/products/cat...es/012211l.jpg

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nc994run · 11-01-2009, 02:15 PM

I have an 870 and love it. I have never used a Browning so I can't speak about that. I just like how easy the 870 is to break down and clean.

algranger · 11-01-2009, 02:20 PM

Yeah definitely. Thats what i'm saying, the simplicity of it is great.

spanish-road · 11-01-2009, 02:39 PM

to me a cheap 870 feels like crap, I have used some nice guns in my life and i cannot use anything that doesn't feel solid. For me I have shot a nice 870 and it was smooth, i didn't the speed loader. Then again its all a matter of preference, I like break action single shot 12ga iver johnson arms and cycle works for their beauty and classic feel. Go with what you like cause your using it, someone else has a opinion based on personal reasons and you shouldn't be swayed by it.

tc · 11-01-2009, 03:46 PM

If you want simple, get an over-under.

muddpigg · 11-01-2009, 04:07 PM

Think you can't go wrong with either company, both have been around for a long time. The 870 has a broader selection of aftermarket parts, if you like that sort of thing, and a slug barrel to boot.

I'm an 870 guy so kinda biased.

JonnyBoy · 11-01-2009, 04:16 PM

Bein a lefty, I'd definitely get the Browning. While every 870 I've fired has been ok, the shells have missed my face, it's still annoying. Even if you're a righty, I think the bottom ejection is nice. And as has been stated, both brands are very well known.

gilby4runner · 11-01-2009, 04:34 PM

I have 14 differnent shot guns (semi, pump, overunder) My go to gun is my 870. I have used it as an icebreaker, boat paddle, and a duck / turkey killing machine. When i go out to hunt i always seem to go to the 870. My overunder and semi autos are great shooting skeet or clays but the i dont have to worry about scratching or tearing up the 870. I am actually going to get the new Remington 887. Its a new one for waterfowl.

Both would be a good buy. Go and look at both at the same time. Get a feel for each one. Its your choice. Search for a good used one. I passed up a great 870 Mag (12) for 150 bucks. I just didnt have anymore room for it.

wino$41 · 11-01-2009, 04:43 PM

The BPS and the rem. express are two totally different guns to actually compare. If you want to compare rem. to browning you have to look at the rem. 870 wingmaster. The express is a generic all around gun that I use as a back up to my wingmaster. The wingmaster will last forever while the express has a limited lifetime. Browings are great guns too but I prefer their o/u rather than their pumps. Go with the rem 870 wingmaster and you won't be disappointed.

Newbie_93 · 11-01-2009, 05:52 PM

mossburg 500 is the Toyota of shotguns

...juss sayin

**aviator** · 11-01-2009, 05:55 PM

I don't shoot much {yet} and currently am gunless... but I am familiar enough to know they are both excellent brands...
looking at the basic features it would seem that the second BPS would be the better choice since {if I am reading the ad copy right} it comes equipped to chamber and fire any of the shotgun shells from 12 through .410.
depending on the choke installed... it also seems to have a nice unload feature that bypasses the chamber which could be useful and safer...
On the other hand the 870 comes with two barrels which could be good also...
I guess it really depends on what you are hunting with it...

The Ruckus · 11-01-2009, 06:31 PM

I got my first deer with a borrowed 870 wingmaster with a swapped-out slug barrel. It belonged to my friend's grampa, who had owned it for decades. I have a soft spot in my heart for that gun. Great gun.

Then, there's this: BPS Hunter, full choke.

Clean, right?

This is the only thing about it that really shows it's age.

The gun is over 32 years old. I just took the pictures a minute ago specifically for this post. My dad bought it when he was 34, and as a testament to this gun's heartiness and superb construction (as well as my dad's lack of firearm awareness), I found out not too long ago that he bought it as a deer gun and had been shooting slugs out of it for years- again, I say it's a full choke. It's still on the same original barrel, it is absolutely my favorite go-to gun- EVER. Never required a trip to the gunsmith, never jammed on me, never given me or him an ounce of trouble.

The 870 express is an icon of utility guns, and it's worth it's cost. The BPS, in my eyes, is on another level. The 870 is the "Good Enough" gun, it will be there when you need it- but the BPS is kind of a "Good Enough, but with Leather Seats" gun.

muddpigg · 11-01-2009, 07:53 PM

At the risk of sounding ignorant what's difference between the wingmaster and the express? Yes I could search but....

a4runnerfreak · 11-01-2009, 08:41 PM

SKB O/U model 500 (if you can find 1) or the 505. And if you can't hit what your shooting at with 2 or less shots.....maybe shooting isn't the ideal thing for you.

**rocket** · 11-01-2009, 08:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by algranger

i want a 12 ga.

For hunting or defense?

nc994run · 11-01-2009, 09:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by a4runnerfreak

And if you can hit what your shooting at with 2 or less shots.....maybe shooting isn't the ideal thing for you.

I think you meant can't in the previous statement.

Besides, if someone is breaking into my house, I'll take 5 shells over 2 any day.

The Ruckus · 11-01-2009, 09:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by muddpigg

At the risk of sounding ignorant what's difference between the wingmaster and the express? Yes I could search but....

From thefiringline . com forum:

The Express:
A rougher, unpolished finish inside and out. More burrs.
A rough black finish.
A hardwood or synthetic stock.
Cheaper, impressed checkering.
A black bolt.
A plastic trigger group.
The lockable safety button.
"Possible" a two piece barrel.
The new style magazine assembly with plastic parts and the "dimples".
A rougher bore in the barrel.
Uses some MIM, (moulded steel parts) in critical areas, like the extractor.

The Wingmaster:
A much smoother, polished finish inside and out. No burrs.
A polished blue finish.
Walnut or synthetic stocks with choice of gloss or satin finish.
Better quality checkering.
A chrome plated bolt.
An aluminum trigger group.
The Lockable safety button.
A one piece barrel.
The old style steel magazine assembly, no dimples.
A much smoother bore.
No MIM parts are used in any critical area.

Not sure how accurate or comprehensive it is, but it's a start.

a4runnerfreak · 11-02-2009, 12:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nc994run

I think you meant can't in the previous statement.

Besides, if someone is breaking into my house, I'll take 5 shells over 2 any day.

Nice catch, nc.....I edited it!

for the home? 5 shells is over kill. If your any good, 1 shot is all your gunna need....now take that 1 shot....say a #6 shot, thru a full choke....and it's goodnight.

GA22RE · 11-02-2009, 12:43 AM

The 870's just so versatile is what tips the scales for me. Just look at how many accessories are made for the weapon and how many law enforcement agencies employ them. I will admit as far as build quality I cannot contribute much as a comparison as I've only owned a 12 gauge 870.

Middo · 11-02-2009, 01:29 AM

only in america would a 12 year old get a gun for his birthday hahaha. seriously. u guys make me chuckle haha.

nc994run · 11-02-2009, 07:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by a4runnerfreak

Nice catch, nc.....I edited it!

for the home? 5 shells is over kill. If your any good, 1 shot is all your gunna need....now take that 1 shot....say a #6 shot, thru a full choke....and it's goodnight.

You are assuming there is only 1 person ...

leebee · 11-02-2009, 11:05 AM

after that first shot there will be, if there were others, they be a scatterin'!

lee

**aviator** · 11-02-2009, 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rocket

For hunting or defense?

I think his primary purpose is hunting...

If it's between the two I'd go for the BPS [I prefer good enough w/leather seats but that's just me lol]
plus looking at the loa the 12ga deer barrel is longer on the bps and should be more accurate.

Then again I'd prefer to hunt deer with a full on sniper rifle w/silencer/infra red/night sight... if I want to plink away at bambi's family there's no reason the whole world should know about it LOL... IK that kind of hunting gear is illegal but it's nice to dream...

tc · 11-02-2009, 11:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Ruckus

Uses some MIM, (moulded steel parts) in critical areas, like the extractor.

No MIM parts are used in any critical area.

As the maker of said MIM parts, I can assure you that MIM is equivalent or superior to any other method of manufacture for these complex parts. We have parts in the Bushmaster ACR that were tested to prove this. At full auto, >10000 rounds were fired before they gave up. Several other non-MIM parts broke (or caught fire) before getting there.

Manufacturers have slung mud at MIM because it generally means a large layoff for their workforce since the parts are made at net shape and you don't have to do a gazillion machining operations any more.

algranger · 11-02-2009, 08:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rocket

For hunting or defense?

Yes.

Quote:

Originally Posted by aviator

I don't shoot much {yet} and currently am gunless... but I am familiar enough to know they are both excellent brands...
looking at the basic features it would seem that the second BPS would be the better choice since {if I am reading the ad copy right} it comes equipped to chamber and fire any of the shotgun shells from 12 through .410.
depending on the choke installed... it also seems to have a nice unload feature that bypasses the chamber which could be useful and safer...
On the other hand the 870 comes with two barrels which could be good also...
I guess it really depends on what you are hunting with it...

The 12 ga. will be for larger birds. The 20 ga. is great for field grouse and whatnot.

Quote:

Originally Posted by a4runnerfreak

Nice catch, nc.....I edited it!

for the home? 5 shells is over kill. If your any good, 1 shot is all your gunna need....now take that 1 shot....say a #6 shot, thru a full choke....and it's goodnight.

Theres no such thing as overkill when it comes to self defense

And 6 shot? I sleep with hollow point slugs.

11-01-2009, 02:15 PM	#2 (permalink)
nc994run Contributing Member Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: blacksburg,va for school chapel hill, nc for home Posts: 992	I have an 870 and love it. I have never used a Browning so I can't speak about that. I just like how easy the 870 is to break down and clean. __________________ Rob 1999 4Runner Limited 4x4, retrofitted e-locker/ ARB front locker with 4.88 Precision Gears, Tundra/LC lift, 2" 4Crawler BL, Nitto Mud Grappler 35's on 16x8, Marlin sliders, TJM T-15, Warn M8000 w/ synthetic line, Mad Mike's custom rear Bumper, deckplate and ISR mods, Vortex Muffler, custom made tube doors pictures here I support Banned Neliconcept

11-01-2009, 02:20 PM	#3 (permalink)
algranger Registered User Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Here in the PNW Posts: 3,265	Yeah definitely. Thats what i'm saying, the simplicity of it is great. __________________ . . . I said lie, for me lying under a process tree . . . .

11-01-2009, 02:39 PM	#4 (permalink)
spanish-road Registered User Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Fairbanks Ak Posts: 1,099	to me a cheap 870 feels like crap, I have used some nice guns in my life and i cannot use anything that doesn't feel solid. For me I have shot a nice 870 and it was smooth, i didn't the speed loader. Then again its all a matter of preference, I like break action single shot 12ga iver johnson arms and cycle works for their beauty and classic feel. Go with what you like cause your using it, someone else has a opinion based on personal reasons and you shouldn't be swayed by it. __________________ What I don't get is why pay someone to work on your vehicle? 1991 toyota pickup extcab- 22re 31x10.5x15 bone stock except for the RV cam and tires.

11-01-2009, 03:46 PM	#5 (permalink)
tc Contributing Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Longmont, CO Posts: 8,377	If you want simple, get an over-under. __________________ Check out www.coTTORA.org to hook up with great Toyota 'wheelin' folks! Current - 93 4Runner: 3VZ 33"x10.50" no lift ARB F/R 96 Impala SS: My own personal cop car Previous - 89 2WD Pickup 22R, Fabtech "Ivan Dan" lift, 31x10.50, IASCA World Finals 4th Place Stop with the mods and get on the trail! Pix at www.4wheelingoh.shutterfly.com/action

11-01-2009, 04:07 PM	#6 (permalink)
muddpigg Registered User Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: injured and stateside :( Posts: 1,395	Think you can't go wrong with either company, both have been around for a long time. The 870 has a broader selection of aftermarket parts, if you like that sort of thing, and a slug barrel to boot. I'm an 870 guy so kinda biased. __________________ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rqtr_RvR3sY Balljoints for sale. Open to trades and offers. http://www.yotatech.com/f11/ball-joi.../#post51278784

11-01-2009, 04:16 PM	#7 (permalink)
JonnyBoy Registered User Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Lone Pine, CA Posts: 411	Bein a lefty, I'd definitely get the Browning. While every 870 I've fired has been ok, the shells have missed my face, it's still annoying. Even if you're a righty, I think the bottom ejection is nice. And as has been stated, both brands are very well known. __________________ Jonny 1990 3.4 5spd 4Runner, 33" BFG KM2's 1983 5spd Shortbed, 35" BFG M/T's with no lift! Soon to be...who knows, but the 35's ain't stayin! "If at first you don't succeed, skydiving's not for you." -Unknown

11-01-2009, 04:43 PM	#9 (permalink)
wino$41 Registered User Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: spokane, wa (then), mesa, az(now) Posts: 60	The BPS and the rem. express are two totally different guns to actually compare. If you want to compare rem. to browning you have to look at the rem. 870 wingmaster. The express is a generic all around gun that I use as a back up to my wingmaster. The wingmaster will last forever while the express has a limited lifetime. Browings are great guns too but I prefer their o/u rather than their pumps. Go with the rem 870 wingmaster and you won't be disappointed. __________________ 96 4runner, V6 SR5, Rubicon rock sliders, SS 1.1 lift, SS bumper, TJM front bumper, Hella lights, CBI tire carrier, 285/75/16 Nitto Terra Grappler, coco mats, katzkin interior.

11-01-2009, 05:52 PM	#10 (permalink)
Newbie_93 Registered User Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: South Carolina Posts: 38	mossburg 500 is the Toyota of shotguns ...juss sayin __________________ '93 4x4 Ext. Cab Pick-Up, 22r, 5spd., 293XXX, 33x12.50xR16, and some other stuff... Will trade for any bone-stock Toyota 1980-1994. Just lurking and soaking-up knowledge for now.

11-01-2009, 05:55 PM	#11 (permalink)
aviator Super Moderator Staff Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: COTKU,Ontario,Canada Posts: 7,473	I don't shoot much {yet} and currently am gunless... but I am familiar enough to know they are both excellent brands... looking at the basic features it would seem that the second BPS would be the better choice since {if I am reading the ad copy right} it comes equipped to chamber and fire any of the shotgun shells from 12 through .410. depending on the choke installed... it also seems to have a nice unload feature that bypasses the chamber which could be useful and safer... On the other hand the 870 comes with two barrels which could be good also... I guess it really depends on what you are hunting with it... __________________ Silver 1994 Hilux Xtra cab 4x4 3.0 K&N cone filter, ported MAF, advanced timing, oversize exhaust, free flow cat, "rumble" muffler custom covered SR5 seats, map lights, factory AC tv4184 style black interior conversion started mods to come... header, custom centre console, stereo upgrade tinted windows Founding member 1972TLC fan club - Get well soon Mary Toyota Hilux... Get in or Get out of the way. Last edited by aviator; 11-01-2009 at 06:04 PM.

11-01-2009, 06:31 PM	#12 (permalink)
The Ruckus Registered User Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: West Michigan Posts: 113	I got my first deer with a borrowed 870 wingmaster with a swapped-out slug barrel. It belonged to my friend's grampa, who had owned it for decades. I have a soft spot in my heart for that gun. Great gun. Then, there's this: BPS Hunter, full choke. Clean, right? This is the only thing about it that really shows it's age. The gun is over 32 years old. I just took the pictures a minute ago specifically for this post. My dad bought it when he was 34, and as a testament to this gun's heartiness and superb construction (as well as my dad's lack of firearm awareness), I found out not too long ago that he bought it as a deer gun and had been shooting slugs out of it for years- again, I say it's a full choke. It's still on the same original barrel, it is absolutely my favorite go-to gun- EVER. Never required a trip to the gunsmith, never jammed on me, never given me or him an ounce of trouble. The 870 express is an icon of utility guns, and it's worth it's cost. The BPS, in my eyes, is on another level. The 870 is the "Good Enough" gun, it will be there when you need it- but the BPS is kind of a "Good Enough, but with Leather Seats" gun. __________________ 2000 4Runner Ltd - 150k on body, 100k on motor ISR/Deckplate mods sans-running boards Stillen/magnaflow exhaust otherwise stock

11-01-2009, 07:53 PM	#13 (permalink)
muddpigg Registered User Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: injured and stateside :( Posts: 1,395	At the risk of sounding ignorant what's difference between the wingmaster and the express? Yes I could search but.... __________________ http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rqtr_RvR3sY Balljoints for sale. Open to trades and offers. http://www.yotatech.com/f11/ball-joi.../#post51278784

11-02-2009, 12:43 AM	#19 (permalink)
GA22RE Registered User Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: Augusta, GA Posts: 135	The 870's just so versatile is what tips the scales for me. Just look at how many accessories are made for the weapon and how many law enforcement agencies employ them. I will admit as far as build quality I cannot contribute much as a comparison as I've only owned a 12 gauge 870. __________________ Current: 93 Truck / DLX / 22R-E / MT / 4x4 Bolt-on's: LCE Pro Air Intake Tube Kit, Gutted Air Box Ignition: NGK Plugs, NGK Wires Interior: SR5 Interior Swap Exterior: Toyota Brush-guard, Blacked-out Steelies Previous: 91 Truck / SR5 / 3VZ-E / AT / 4x4

11-02-2009, 01:29 AM	#20 (permalink)
Middo Registered User Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Sunny coast, QLD, Australia Posts: 10	only in america would a 12 year old get a gun for his birthday hahaha. seriously. u guys make me chuckle haha. __________________ Get more lift, Fat chicks can't climb

11-02-2009, 11:05 AM	#22 (permalink)
leebee Contributing Member Join Date: May 2004 Location: marlbank, canada Posts: 2,450	after that first shot there will be, if there were others, they be a scatterin'! lee __________________ 93 sr5 v6 auto, 4x4 Photos http://s866.photobucket.com/albums/a...albumview=grid there are quite some attractive ladies on here with Toys. (compliments of ironmike) ifsc 3(.0) http://tlca.org www.of4wd.com www.sontt.com

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