Diesel owners speak your peace

Tacoma Dude · 05-07-2006, 01:39 AM

Okay so let's keep this from being a pissing contest.
If you guys have an issue then state it. If you've *heard* of an issue then make sure you say that you've *heard* of it. If you've seen it for yourself please state that you've seen it for yourself.

Disclaimer aside... I'm thinking about picking up a full-size diesel. I'm minimally concerned about MPG because I plan on doing the veg-oil conversion. I want to know what you guys like and don't like - what your personal experiences are.

Vote on your manufacturer of choice. If it's not there then click on Other and state what it is.

I'm debating possibly using it as a towing rig for my 1st gen so towing experience is good information to have too!

Thanks for the info everyone!

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joez · 05-07-2006, 09:02 AM

Ive personally owned and towed with two different GM diesels, both an '85 with a 6.2 with 250K miles, and my '95 6.5TD with 170K miles. I have experience towing with a '94 dodge 3/4 ton gasser, 2000 Tundra, 2005 tundra Double cab, and a bombed '97 F-350 powerstroke.

I bought my '95 for one simple reason, its IMHO the best bang for the buck truck out there. The fit and finish on our old dodge was a joke, and since people think that the Cummins is the greatest thing since sliced bread they want an arm and a leg for them, so i passed on dodge. Ford, they make a pretty decent truck, but i didnt want to deal with TTB. Not to mention finding ones arround here that havent been abused their whole life isn't exactly easy. A duramax was what i really wanted, but was just a bit out of my price range. I had great luck with my 6.2 despite everybody telling me about how they "heard" it was a terrible motor, not a real diesel, wouldn't tow anything, etc, so i decided to pick up a 6.5. I get the same crap with my 6.5, but its been pretty trouble free. Because of its ill-deserved bad reputation, ever since the D-max was introduced these trucks have been swep under the rug. This has driven prices down on nice trucks. Yes, they do have their quirks, but most of the problems come from misdiagnosis at the stealership and incompetant owners, and are generally simple to fix and remedy. No, they are not in the same league as the powerstroke and cummins, but they were never meant to be. Mine tows great, and towed fairly well when it was stock. It currently has an intake, 4" exhaust, 3" downpipe, BD chip, and a ton of computer fooling. It still gets 13-14mpg with the trailer behind it as well, and thats at 70mph.

I may trade my current truck in when i get my raise for a used D-max, i havnet decided yet. Im happy with my truck, but with all my mods i am just about at the limits of what the motor can handle reliably without internal mods and a custom intercooler, and as with anybody i still want more.

I will give you the same suggestion i gave in the last thread. Go out, test drive everything, and buy what YOU like, not what a bunch of people on the internet like. Everybody has stories they "heard", and will share them as if they are fact. Everybody has an opinion on what they think is best, but it really just boils down to personal preference. The big 3 all make a nice truck, whether anybody here on yotatech wants to admit it or not. Both our tundras have been to the dealership more than my 6.5 has been down, that doesnt make them bad trucks. Same goes for the domestics, bad ones get out there. I won't comment on the early 6.0's though, those truly are a bad idea.

Get out there, start test driving, buy what you prefer.

Ironmike4x4 · 05-07-2006, 11:02 AM

Someone please help me with this, but you might want to check with either last month's 4Wheeler or 4Wheel and Offroad magazine. They had an article about the Ford's Powerstroke diesel having several TSBs and Dodge Cummins with the least if any TSBs for them. I vote for the Chevy since the Duramax is a pretty torquey engine and ride comfort is very high. I've ridden with my buddy who's parents own a mulch company and he prefers the Duramax over their Cummins engine trucks when he's hauling.

turboale · 05-07-2006, 12:24 PM

It all comes down to wear and tear IMHO... Each truck no matter the brand, no matter the year will have its weak points from the factory. There are so many of these things on the road that there has been plenty of time to fix them. If you are in the market for a new truck then I guess this wouldn't apply especially since you would have a warranty, but there are safeguards that you can add that greatly help each weak-point of these trucks. Go drive each of them and see what you like the best. The quirks can be worked out as they arrive.

Churnd · 05-07-2006, 06:53 PM

The 6.0 is no slouch. It had to go in for a recall concerning the tranny, but has been problem free since. The first year it came out is when it had the problems. Since, they've ironed them out.

arjan · 05-07-2006, 10:09 PM

Or get a small Hino flatdeck, stay in the Toyota family.

At the greenhouse we have a 5ton 6Cyl hino, and it gets pretty decent fuel milage, the small hinos will even get better milage.
Not the most beautifull thing, but is practical and hauls a lot.

I personally wouldn't mind that if I had a trailer queen, of flatdeck queen.

SlightlyModified · 05-08-2006, 04:51 AM

Own and drive an f250 7.3 TD, Love it to death, Pulls extremely well. However, (can't believe I'm saying this, but I like the cummins. I've never owned one, but My next truck will be one. Let us know how your veggie convertion goes. I'm planning to do it on a vw rabbit, as soon as I finish several other projects.

MTL_4runner · 05-08-2006, 05:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SlightlyModified

Own and drive an f250 7.3 TD, Love it to death, Pulls extremely well. However, (can't believe I'm saying this, but I like the cummins. I've never owned one, but My next truck will be one. Let us know how your veggie convertion goes. I'm planning to do it on a vw rabbit, as soon as I finish several other projects.

I agree on the Cummins as well, that would be my diesel of choice.

iGGz · 05-08-2006, 12:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTL_4runner

I agree on the Cummins as well, that would be my diesel of choice.

Ditto!

Epic Ed · 05-08-2006, 04:03 PM

Why the Cummins?

joez · 05-08-2006, 04:10 PM

Just out of curiosity, do those of you recomending the Cummins have any actual experience with them?

Randomness · 05-08-2006, 06:45 PM

The only experience I have is with a good friend's 2004 Dodge 2500 with the Cummins. He gets ~21mpg on average, with a fair amount of engine mods, and 35" BFG's. The thing has some serious, serious power.

Another friend has some Dodge duallie diesel (not common rail, sounds like the typical loud diesel), and it's been really reliable for him, as a work truck. His dad had a Chevy with the Duramax...until it blew up. Sorry, don't know any details other than that. He has a Dodge+Cummins now, too.

Jimmeh · 05-08-2006, 07:16 PM

When my dad was trying to find a truck (he wanted a F-150 in the 85-95 range with a manual tranny) he took me along, and he test drove the Duramax, Cummins, and Powerstroke. My dad said he liked the powerstroke the best. He said it had lots of power, great ride height, and fairly comfortable. Well, since I was first mate, I decided to try out all the seats, and personally, I liked the Cummins the best. It felt like a beast, and it was the most comfortable truck. They used to have 1500 Rams down at Dollar Rent-a-Car (where my family used to work [dad, mom, sister, grandma, and I]) and when we took one over to washington, we got about 25 MPG, and the back seat was incredibly comfortable, while my mom and sister about died of back aches from my sisters old 87 Honda Accord. I vote Powerstroke because I will always be a loyal Ford fan, but when it comes to comfort, I would go Dodge any day (especially if I had to live in my truck one day

)

iGGz · 05-08-2006, 08:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joez

Just out of curiosity, do those of you recomending the Cummins have any actual experience with them?

My grandpa uses his as a work truck on his farm... using it to check the cows, pivots, shops, etc...

Drives it all over the place... in the pastures... on the highway... tows with it all the time... uses it to pull out vehicles when they get stuck...

He use to buy Fords but then decided to try a Cummins... said its the best truck he has ever had... great powers and awesome mileage... he trade them in every few years and gets a brand new one... but thats just his style ha...

Also my buddy has one and he loves it... hasnt had a problem with it yet...

turboale · 05-10-2006, 08:22 AM

As I said in another diesel thread about 3-4 days ago...

Go to any horse show and go look at all the rigs and see what is dominant. Last one I went to there was 1 chevy 3 dodges and 12 fords... Don't take it from me though, go check it out yourself

MTL_4runner · 05-10-2006, 09:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joez

Just out of curiosity, do those of you recomending the Cummins have any actual experience with them?

Yes, via family (I borrow the truck quite a bit). As I mentioned before I can't speak for Chevy or Ford diesels (although I do have a few neighbors with Ford Diesels and they are niosy as heck) because I have no direct experience with them, but I prefer the look on the Dodges and the cummins engine seems to be a very good design for history of reliability and torque (it makes over 600+ ft-lbs in a VERY low RPM). I believe the fuel economy is the best with the Cummins but I am not positive on that.

Here's a fairly recent (although not current) shootout among big 3 diesel trucks:
http://www.fourwheeler.com/roadtests...sel/index.html

.....so I would not be surprised if Austin's point about horse shows was true.

Here's the 2006 Motor Specs for each:

Dodge/Cummins:
325 hp/610 lb-ft - manual and automatic

Chevy-GMC/Duramax:
360 hp/650 lb-ft - automatic
300 hp/520 lb-ft - manual

Ford/Powerstroke
325 hp/570 lb-ft - manual and automatic

I don't think you'd go wrong with any of them as a choice to get the job done and then it just comes down to are you a Chevy, Ford or Dodge guy? Reliability could be a factor but again I doubt you'll get much in the way of unbiased reliability reporting as well (everyone will say what they own runs great and is never in the shop).

Here's a thread that hashes it out between owners and flaws for each brand:
http://townhall-talk.edmunds.com/direct/view/.efe5ee1/0

I still have to go with the cummins as being the best diesel motor for now.

justinh · 05-10-2006, 09:30 AM

My dad has a 1996 CTD 2wd Automatic Extended Cab Longbed. He uses it mainly for towing his tractor back and forth to his hunting property as well as various towing of cars on a dolly and his 20' Cabin Cruiser boat. He loves it! He and my mom also use it as their roadtrip vehicle, he routinely gets 22mpg on the highway unloaded at 70-75 miles per hour. His is approaching 175k miles and he doesn't have any problems except for the stupid solenoid that activates something at start-up. It is more of an annoyance than anything as it is very inconsistent. There is actually a manul conversion for it but it doesn't bother him enough to fix it.

dz · 05-11-2006, 02:08 AM

I'd love to shove a Cat C7 in a Tundra somehow...

(full disclosure: I work for the Cat dealer here)

MTL_4runner · 05-11-2006, 05:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dz

I'd love to shove a Cat C7 in a Tundra somehow...

(full disclosure: I work for the Cat dealer here)

Ditto......find a way and I'm sure you'd have a market for it.

4x4Lamm · 05-11-2006, 05:04 PM

I drive Ford diesels at work and am very impressed. Dodge is a close second, Chevy. no thanks.

As far as raw power and modability, Dodge all the way, Just go to a truck and tractor pull and you will see what I mean.

Lamm

rearviewmirror · 07-01-2006, 09:57 PM

I'd have to go w/ the Dodge Sprinter van which is just a rebadged Mercedes panel van from Europe. Even the engine still says MB on it. This would be the ultimate motorcycle/bicycle hauler and even has the ability to tow up to 5,000 lbs.

rearviewmirror · 07-01-2006, 10:04 PM

You can also get the Ford E-350 Econoline van w/ the 6.0 Powerstroke.. Hella cheaper than the Excursion and looks mean as hell w/ an FX4 package and a lift kit!

I wish I had some pics of one of my race teammates E250 w/ diesel and lift kit. I was hooked from that point and it's so versatile.

Ironmike4x4 · 07-02-2006, 07:58 AM

I wonder what he finally decided on? It's almost a 2month old thread.

Tacoma Dude · 07-03-2006, 10:17 AM

No money at the moment... I am looking for pre-search information

View Poll Results: In your opinion, what is the best manufacturer for a diesel powered full-size?
CHEVY	6	13.95%
DODGE	18	41.86%
FORD	16	37.21%
OTHER	3	6.98%
Voters: 43. You may not vote on this poll

05-07-2006, 09:02 AM	#2 (permalink)
joez Contributing Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Elwood, Il Posts: 1,253	Ive personally owned and towed with two different GM diesels, both an '85 with a 6.2 with 250K miles, and my '95 6.5TD with 170K miles. I have experience towing with a '94 dodge 3/4 ton gasser, 2000 Tundra, 2005 tundra Double cab, and a bombed '97 F-350 powerstroke. I bought my '95 for one simple reason, its IMHO the best bang for the buck truck out there. The fit and finish on our old dodge was a joke, and since people think that the Cummins is the greatest thing since sliced bread they want an arm and a leg for them, so i passed on dodge. Ford, they make a pretty decent truck, but i didnt want to deal with TTB. Not to mention finding ones arround here that havent been abused their whole life isn't exactly easy. A duramax was what i really wanted, but was just a bit out of my price range. I had great luck with my 6.2 despite everybody telling me about how they "heard" it was a terrible motor, not a real diesel, wouldn't tow anything, etc, so i decided to pick up a 6.5. I get the same crap with my 6.5, but its been pretty trouble free. Because of its ill-deserved bad reputation, ever since the D-max was introduced these trucks have been swep under the rug. This has driven prices down on nice trucks. Yes, they do have their quirks, but most of the problems come from misdiagnosis at the stealership and incompetant owners, and are generally simple to fix and remedy. No, they are not in the same league as the powerstroke and cummins, but they were never meant to be. Mine tows great, and towed fairly well when it was stock. It currently has an intake, 4" exhaust, 3" downpipe, BD chip, and a ton of computer fooling. It still gets 13-14mpg with the trailer behind it as well, and thats at 70mph. I may trade my current truck in when i get my raise for a used D-max, i havnet decided yet. Im happy with my truck, but with all my mods i am just about at the limits of what the motor can handle reliably without internal mods and a custom intercooler, and as with anybody i still want more. I will give you the same suggestion i gave in the last thread. Go out, test drive everything, and buy what YOU like, not what a bunch of people on the internet like. Everybody has stories they "heard", and will share them as if they are fact. Everybody has an opinion on what they think is best, but it really just boils down to personal preference. The big 3 all make a nice truck, whether anybody here on yotatech wants to admit it or not. Both our tundras have been to the dealership more than my 6.5 has been down, that doesnt make them bad trucks. Same goes for the domestics, bad ones get out there. I won't comment on the early 6.0's though, those truly are a bad idea. Get out there, start test driving, buy what you prefer. __________________ -Joe Z Chicago 4x4 My Webshots 1985 Toyota 4Runner, 3" Trail Gear rear/ All-Pro front springs, 42x14 IROK's, Allied Rockathons, spool rear/detroit front, 30 spline longs, Dual cases w/4.7, Marlin High steer, lots of other stuff.. 1997 Dodge 2500 4x4, 12valve CTD, not stock. Last edited by joez; 05-07-2006 at 09:06 AM.

05-07-2006, 12:24 PM	#4 (permalink)
turboale Contributing Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Brooklyn, NY Posts: 4,836	It all comes down to wear and tear IMHO... Each truck no matter the brand, no matter the year will have its weak points from the factory. There are so many of these things on the road that there has been plenty of time to fix them. If you are in the market for a new truck then I guess this wouldn't apply especially since you would have a warranty, but there are safeguards that you can add that greatly help each weak-point of these trucks. Go drive each of them and see what you like the best. The quirks can be worked out as they arrive. __________________ --Austin RHaus NYC 06 M45 Sport - Beauty 96 4Runner - The Beast

05-07-2006, 06:53 PM	#5 (permalink)
Churnd Registered User Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Hattiesburg, MS Posts: 4,093	The 6.0 is no slouch. It had to go in for a recall concerning the tranny, but has been problem free since. The first year it came out is when it had the problems. Since, they've ironed them out. __________________ -Chris If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough. Click here to search! My Website

05-07-2006, 10:09 PM	#6 (permalink)
arjan Contributing Member Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Mission, British Columbia Posts: 1,558	Or get a small Hino flatdeck, stay in the Toyota family. At the greenhouse we have a 5ton 6Cyl hino, and it gets pretty decent fuel milage, the small hinos will even get better milage. Not the most beautifull thing, but is practical and hauls a lot. I personally wouldn't mind that if I had a trailer queen, of flatdeck queen. __________________ 2006 4Runner V8 Sports Edition Red 1997 4Runner 3.4L Bushwacker Flares, 5spd, E locker

05-08-2006, 04:51 AM	#7 (permalink)
SlightlyModified Registered User Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Hamilton, Oh Posts: 217	Own and drive an f250 7.3 TD, Love it to death, Pulls extremely well. However, (can't believe I'm saying this, but I like the cummins. I've never owned one, but My next truck will be one. Let us know how your veggie convertion goes. I'm planning to do it on a vw rabbit, as soon as I finish several other projects. __________________ 81 pickup, 33's, 3" drivetrain lift, 5 speed, see buildup here http://www.yotatech.com/showthread.p...1#post50392798 94 f250 4x4, 285 BFG a/t's, 7.3 turbo diesel 05' Honda Rincon 4x4 atv, procircuit t4 exhaust, 26" ITP mudlite's. 78' VW Rabbit, Veggie fuel conversion (in the future) 74' VW Beetle, all original (for sale) Alot of Toy parts for sale, PM for info and prices.

05-08-2006, 04:03 PM	#10 (permalink)
Epic Ed Registered User Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 654	Why the Cummins? __________________ '95 4Runner\|32x11.5 BFG TA KOs\|Hi-flow Cat\|Dynomax muffler; 2.25" exhaust\| Downey Headers\|4.88 gears \|Detroit EZ locker \|Detroit TruTrack\|BJ spacers\|Downey HD coils\|2" rear spring spacers\|Rancho RS9000X/RS5000s\|WARN hubs\|TJM T15

05-08-2006, 04:10 PM	#11 (permalink)
joez Contributing Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Elwood, Il Posts: 1,253	Just out of curiosity, do those of you recomending the Cummins have any actual experience with them? __________________ -Joe Z Chicago 4x4 My Webshots 1985 Toyota 4Runner, 3" Trail Gear rear/ All-Pro front springs, 42x14 IROK's, Allied Rockathons, spool rear/detroit front, 30 spline longs, Dual cases w/4.7, Marlin High steer, lots of other stuff.. 1997 Dodge 2500 4x4, 12valve CTD, not stock.

05-08-2006, 06:45 PM	#12 (permalink)
Randomness Registered User Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Sammamish, WA Posts: 1,385	The only experience I have is with a good friend's 2004 Dodge 2500 with the Cummins. He gets ~21mpg on average, with a fair amount of engine mods, and 35" BFG's. The thing has some serious, serious power. Another friend has some Dodge duallie diesel (not common rail, sounds like the typical loud diesel), and it's been really reliable for him, as a work truck. His dad had a Chevy with the Duramax...until it blew up. Sorry, don't know any details other than that. He has a Dodge+Cummins now, too. __________________ 95 3.slow SR5 4runner 160K miles \| 32's \| OME \| Optima \| Husky \| dechromed \| ryan \| My Photography Blog

05-10-2006, 08:22 AM	#15 (permalink)
turboale Contributing Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Brooklyn, NY Posts: 4,836	As I said in another diesel thread about 3-4 days ago... Go to any horse show and go look at all the rigs and see what is dominant. Last one I went to there was 1 chevy 3 dodges and 12 fords... Don't take it from me though, go check it out yourself __________________ --Austin RHaus NYC 06 M45 Sport - Beauty 96 4Runner - The Beast

05-10-2006, 09:30 AM	#17 (permalink)
justinh Registered User Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: woodstock, ga Posts: 1,505	My dad has a 1996 CTD 2wd Automatic Extended Cab Longbed. He uses it mainly for towing his tractor back and forth to his hunting property as well as various towing of cars on a dolly and his 20' Cabin Cruiser boat. He loves it! He and my mom also use it as their roadtrip vehicle, he routinely gets 22mpg on the highway unloaded at 70-75 miles per hour. His is approaching 175k miles and he doesn't have any problems except for the stupid solenoid that activates something at start-up. It is more of an annoyance than anything as it is very inconsistent. There is actually a manul conversion for it but it doesn't bother him enough to fix it.

05-11-2006, 02:08 AM	#18 (permalink)
dz Registered User Join Date: May 2006 Location: Maryland Posts: 30	I'd love to shove a Cat C7 in a Tundra somehow... (full disclosure: I work for the Cat dealer here)

05-11-2006, 05:04 PM	#20 (permalink)
4x4Lamm Registered User Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Canton, Ohio Posts: 2,573	I drive Ford diesels at work and am very impressed. Dodge is a close second, Chevy. no thanks. As far as raw power and modability, Dodge all the way, Just go to a truck and tractor pull and you will see what I mean. Lamm __________________ -1992 4Runner SR5, Destroyed by fire. Lots of mods. I will miss it. -1995 4Runner SR5 Limited, Also known as the money pit. Becoming a trail rig now. -2004 Tacoma SR5 TRD, My new daily driver. I love this truck!

07-01-2006, 09:57 PM	#21 (permalink)
rearviewmirror Registered User Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: AUSTEX fiveonetwo Posts: 725	I'd have to go w/ the Dodge Sprinter van which is just a rebadged Mercedes panel van from Europe. Even the engine still says MB on it. This would be the ultimate motorcycle/bicycle hauler and even has the ability to tow up to 5,000 lbs. __________________ 2000 4Runner Limited 4WD Millennium Silver Toyota OEM NAV OME springs/shocks F/R VZN185L-GKPZKA 4.300 With P265/70R16

07-01-2006, 10:04 PM	#22 (permalink)
rearviewmirror Registered User Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: AUSTEX fiveonetwo Posts: 725	You can also get the Ford E-350 Econoline van w/ the 6.0 Powerstroke.. Hella cheaper than the Excursion and looks mean as hell w/ an FX4 package and a lift kit! I wish I had some pics of one of my race teammates E250 w/ diesel and lift kit. I was hooked from that point and it's so versatile.

07-03-2006, 10:17 AM	#24 (permalink)
Tacoma Dude Contributing Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Orange County, CA Posts: 8,360	No money at the moment... I am looking for pre-search information __________________ Peter! 2002 Tacoma 1986 4Runner

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