solid axle swap questions

SteveO · 08-20-2003, 03:09 PM

I'm taking the plunge into the solid Axle arena. I have a guy who is willing to part with a Early Ford Bronco D44 housing for cheap. I know the housing is straight and is in good shape, because he is real picky about his parts.

Does anybody know what the axle width is on the 3rd generation 4Runners with the factory E-locker? I know the front axle should be wider than the rear axle to accomodate proper steering and tracking, but I'm not really sure as to what the width is for the 3rd gen rear axle.

I have been told the D44 is around 63" or so, anybody know for sure?

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loosehead · 08-20-2003, 03:38 PM

Just a thought, I had an early Bronco back in the day and it had a five-lug bolt pattern...you'd have to change axle shafts with something else or??? I think the older Jeep Waggy's/D44 had the matching 6-on-5.5 bolt pattern. I'm not 100% sure on this, just something else to think about before you grab it up...

WolfpackTLC · 08-20-2003, 03:45 PM

def try to get the waggy d44 or a 80s toyota axle, save you lots of headaches.

SteveO · 08-20-2003, 04:33 PM

The 80's solid axle will not work due to the drop being on the passenger side. I have a complete one in the garage w/82 Cruiser vented rotors. The Waggy axle has spring perches, and I think I would rather go with the coils can come with the Broncos. Also, the D44 Ford bronco axles can use the Chevy D44 parts, as well as the disc brakes. Plus, the D44 drop is on the driver side, the correct side.

Flygtenstein · 08-20-2003, 05:11 PM

The 80 series cruiser is 63.5" WMS if I am thinking right tonight, but that diff is on the wrong side.

3rd Gen should be in the 60" range for axle width.

As Jason said, Wagoneer's are cheap and plentiful.

Just to throw it out there, someone should really have a Toy axle built off that jig so that when the time comes for Steve, he is not the guinea pig.

5k for a 44 with CTM's and Warn alloy shafts, high pinion, etc. Or you can put Longfields in a Toy...

Good work pushing the envelope. I still think that one more rock could have shifted the weight and unloaded the front end...

sschaefer3 · 08-20-2003, 06:20 PM

http://www.frontrangeoffroadfab.com/projects_tacoma.htm

2nd paragraph down. Keep it all Toyota. Only way I'll do it, but I already have a Solid Axle Toyota.

Future products that are shown:

NEW housings made for an 8" toyota 3rd member, and mini outers. Built to almost any width, driver or pass. side drops. The center is 1/4"! The flange that the 3rd member mounts to is 1/2" thick! And the tubes are 3.5" .375 Wall DOM tubing! Amazingly, the axle shown, at 61" flange to flange width (stock 79-85 is 55.5) weighs in only 25 lbs heavier than a stock housing! Ground clearance is increaced by 1/2" under the diff, oil capacity is over 3 qts, filling and checking fluid level is easy with a fill plug on the front, just where it should be!

sschaefer3 · 08-20-2003, 06:23 PM

It's only money, you'll make more.

SteveO · 08-20-2003, 07:18 PM

yeah, its only money. I wish the wife could understand that concept. How ever I put it, she doesn't buy it.

The early Ford Broncos were pretty heavy beasts, and they had the D44 up front. I have a friend down here in ABQ that has been wheeling a 4700lb Bronco for some time with 35" meats and Warn axles. He has never had an issue. My 4Runner, on the trail, is weighing in at about 5500lbs. I want to make sure that it doesn't break again (well under normal silly circumstances like that last obstacle I broke on). :pat:

Anyhow, I'm going to be taking my time putting this thing together, and when I have all the parts stacked up in the garage, it's gonna get messy. I may have to call on the help of ABQJim and loosehead to give me a hand. Or at least, sit around and drink a few cokes

while they watch me bust a few knuckles.

When I get the thing started, you can bet the IFS parts will be doled out pretty quick.

RTdawgs · 08-20-2003, 07:35 PM

Albuquerque Jim · 08-20-2003, 07:57 PM

SteveO you know I will be there!

I've skinned more than one knuckle wrenchin'

NCSU-4runner · 08-20-2003, 09:35 PM

whoops, missed the fact that the new runners have driver side diffs, i was thinking about the axles im looking at for my 2nd gen.

Flygtenstein · 08-21-2003, 08:38 AM

Did you notice the Nissan in the parking lot at Chinamen's?

Some of the fab work looked a little suspect, but it was a pretty well set-up, low-lift coil-ver front end. Something that I could really see in the front of your runner.

FRORF makes some pretty neat stuff, if it were my rig I would not hesitate going with his axle. Custom width, custom diff side...

crash · 08-21-2003, 08:43 AM

i SAY, use a d44, you won't be sorry..

wimpywade94 · 08-21-2003, 01:20 PM

hey know
when you start this sas dont forget to buy the beers, i mean pepsi's first...i did that the other day and had to make a beer run dirty!!

boy that sucks to....

later
wade

ps

get enough for 3 days at least!

crawler#976 · 08-21-2003, 02:21 PM

K-Tons page has info on the D44 waggy swap-

K-Tons Double Cab

Personally, I'd stick w/ leaf spring- it's cheap and easy to get great flex vs. high buck coilovers.

PoBoy · 08-21-2003, 08:54 PM

This...well its what I picked up last week atleast.

Im following 44Runner: You need a D44 off a 80+ grand wagoneer - driver side drop preferably w/o vaccuum disconnect.

OZtaco · 08-21-2003, 09:05 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by SteveO
yeah, its only money. I wish the wife could understand that concept. How ever I put it, she doesn't buy it.

The early Ford Broncos were pretty heavy beasts, and they had the D44 up front. I have a friend down here in ABQ that has been wheeling a 4700lb Bronco for some time with 35" meats and Warn axles. He has never had an issue. My 4Runner, on the trail, is weighing in at about 5500lbs. I want to make sure that it doesn't break again (well under normal silly circumstances like that last obstacle I broke on). :pat:

Anyhow, I'm going to be taking my time putting this thing together, and when I have all the parts stacked up in the garage, it's gonna get messy. I may have to call on the help of ABQJim and loosehead to give me a hand. Or at least, sit around and drink a few beers while they watch me bust a few knuckles.

When I get the thing started, you can bet the IFS parts will be doled out pretty quick.

There is a guy on the tacoma board selling his almost ready to bolt on D44, i think his nickname is NASTYOTA or something like that,
good luck and i tell you you'll love your truck even more after you SAS'd her.
Oz.

OZtaco · 08-21-2003, 09:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by RTdawgs

hey man that is a sick 4runner, got any more pics?? of the sas?
wheeling???
I just finish sasing my taco too =)
later,
Oz.

SteveO · 08-22-2003, 06:27 AM

Quote:

from NASTYOTA
Ok due to reason's beyond my control I am selling a '86 D44 from Grand Waggy that I have partially rebuilt. IT HAS, new 4.88's with all new bearings and seals ready to roll. New Spicer u-joints in the axles, New spicer ball joints in drivers side knuckle, Housing painted black with spring pad and shock mounts cut off. New rotors, New studs with TOY thread pitch, new wheel bearings, Painted caliper brackets. It does not have flat top knuckles because I wasn't going with histeer so you either need to buy them or just buy the passenger side knuckle with an arm for regular crossover. call parts Mike he's got it already set up to go on this set-up. $900

Indeed, he is selling it. However, driving to Jackson, MS is quite a drive...about 1100 miles. I shot him an email to see if he still has it for sale, and if he will negotiate. I dunno...

, I think the wife might have a coronary about this one. Maybe I could pull out all the stops and

and play the bleeding heart thing "Don't you live me babe".

PoBoy · 08-22-2003, 08:34 AM

Got mine for $150 after some low balling. Took 2 months to find one within driving distance (3 hour drive). Look around on http://www.jeepsunlimited.com/forums/

OZtaco · 08-22-2003, 09:01 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by SteveO
Indeed, he is selling it. However, driving to Jackson, MS is quite a drive...about 1100 miles. I shot him an email to see if he still has it for sale, and if he will negotiate. I dunno..., I think the wife might have a coronary about this one. Maybe I could pull out all the stops and and play the bleeding heart thing "Don't you live me babe".

I drove from chicago to NY to get my axle, just don't tell your wife you are getting it, just tell her you guys are going on a road trip

then when you get there just act surprise

that should do it!!!

Mark in Az · 08-23-2003, 08:27 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by sschaefer3
http://www.frontrangeoffroadfab.com/projects_tacoma.htm

2nd paragraph down. Keep it all Toyota. Only way I'll do it, but I already have a Solid Axle Toyota.

Future products that are shown:

NEW housings made for an 8" toyota 3rd member, and mini outers. Built to almost any width, driver or pass. side drops. The center is 1/4"! The flange that the 3rd member mounts to is 1/2" thick! And the tubes are 3.5" .375 Wall DOM tubing! Amazingly, the axle shown, at 61" flange to flange width (stock 79-85 is 55.5) weighs in only 25 lbs heavier than a stock housing! Ground clearance is increaced by 1/2" under the diff, oil capacity is over 3 qts, filling and checking fluid level is easy with a fill plug on the front, just where it should be!

Last I heard, he plans on brining this to Moab in October. Can't wait to see it up close & on the trails!

Flygtenstein · 08-23-2003, 11:00 AM

That is really a good find from Front Range. I had only heard of those axles being made for Taco's, but the prospect of having a 60" wide front end to swap my runner so that I can avoid wheel spacers and have a newer, stronger axle really is a good one.

Anyone heard prices?

44Runner · 09-09-2003, 08:10 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by PoBoy
Got mine for $150 after some low balling. Took 2 months to find one within driving distance (3 hour drive). Look around on http://www.jeepsunlimited.com/forums/

150 is pretty much the going rate for Waggy front 44s from a yard. Anything more than 200 and you are getting ripped off. They are strong, perfect width, and cheap, with a whole lot of aftermarket support which make them a great choice.

I think the custom 8" housing is sweet, but you have to shell out the money for it. Then more money for the custom length alloy inners to go with it which will make for expensive spares if you ever grenade them with the longfields you will undoubtably run. Once you have shelled out all this bread for your super trick 8" front, you still have an axle that you spent tons of money on that is still probably weaker than a boneyard 44 with Warns and CTMs (think warranty)

Flygtenstein · 09-09-2003, 01:22 PM

Custom Toy front housing, ballpark guesses/estimates only:
-housing $1,200
-Longfields $330
-Third, high-pinion ARB $1,500

For a touch over 3k, you are smoking.

What does it cost for Warn's and CTM's? What do high-pinion axles cost in the 44 flavor?

I personally like drop out thirds and completely matching gears, but that is just from the cheese point of view.

My understanding after reading assorted things is that the above Toy set-up would be pretty bombproof on 37's or smaller barring obscene beatings.

Having a 44 would allow tighter turning, but I am used to not turning anyway.

08-20-2003, 03:38 PM	#2 (permalink)
loosehead Contributing Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Los Alamos, NM Posts: 1,107	Just a thought, I had an early Bronco back in the day and it had a five-lug bolt pattern...you'd have to change axle shafts with something else or??? I think the older Jeep Waggy's/D44 had the matching 6-on-5.5 bolt pattern. I'm not 100% sure on this, just something else to think about before you grab it up... __________________ Jayson 1998 4Runner SR5 4WD V-6, auto, E-locker

08-20-2003, 03:45 PM	#3 (permalink)
WolfpackTLC Registered User Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Raleigh, NC Posts: 828	def try to get the waggy d44 or a 80s toyota axle, save you lots of headaches. __________________ 1995 Land Cruiser -ARB'd, OME'D, Slee'd, Warn'd, lifted, locked, dented, WHEELED.

08-20-2003, 04:33 PM	#4 (permalink)
SteveO Contributing Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: NM Posts: 1,848	The 80's solid axle will not work due to the drop being on the passenger side. I have a complete one in the garage w/82 Cruiser vented rotors. The Waggy axle has spring perches, and I think I would rather go with the coils can come with the Broncos. Also, the D44 Ford bronco axles can use the Chevy D44 parts, as well as the disc brakes. Plus, the D44 drop is on the driver side, the correct side. __________________ http://www.Hunt4Steve.com In the span of time, life is short. Our life is like a wave on the ocean, a flower in the field, here today and gone tomorrow. Know yourself, know where you will spend eternity, for NOTHING else will matter when you die.

08-20-2003, 06:20 PM	#6 (permalink)
sschaefer3 Contributing Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: Tempe, Arizona Posts: 5,494	http://www.frontrangeoffroadfab.com/projects_tacoma.htm 2nd paragraph down. Keep it all Toyota. Only way I'll do it, but I already have a Solid Axle Toyota. Future products that are shown: NEW housings made for an 8" toyota 3rd member, and mini outers. Built to almost any width, driver or pass. side drops. The center is 1/4"! The flange that the 3rd member mounts to is 1/2" thick! And the tubes are 3.5" .375 Wall DOM tubing! Amazingly, the axle shown, at 61" flange to flange width (stock 79-85 is 55.5) weighs in only 25 lbs heavier than a stock housing! Ground clearance is increaced by 1/2" under the diff, oil capacity is over 3 qts, filling and checking fluid level is easy with a fill plug on the front, just where it should be! __________________ Steve Schaefer *WWW.SonoranSteel.Com* Suspension Lift Kits * Rock Sliders * Straight Axle Conversions * 4Runner/FJC Rubicon Express Lower Links * Accessories * Daystar Products Dealer * TJM Bull Bar Dealer * Deaver Leaf Spring Dealer * Tokico & Bilstein Shock Dealer * ViAir Dealer * Total Chaos Dealer * TOYTEC Dealer * and like everyone else a Trail Gear Dealer

08-20-2003, 06:23 PM	#7 (permalink)
sschaefer3 Contributing Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: Tempe, Arizona Posts: 5,494	It's only money, you'll make more. __________________ Steve Schaefer *WWW.SonoranSteel.Com* Suspension Lift Kits * Rock Sliders * Straight Axle Conversions * 4Runner/FJC Rubicon Express Lower Links * Accessories * Daystar Products Dealer * TJM Bull Bar Dealer * Deaver Leaf Spring Dealer * Tokico & Bilstein Shock Dealer * ViAir Dealer * Total Chaos Dealer * TOYTEC Dealer * and like everyone else a Trail Gear Dealer

08-20-2003, 05:11 PM	#5 (permalink)
Flygtenstein Registered User Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Fort Collins, CO Posts: 4,246	The 80 series cruiser is 63.5" WMS if I am thinking right tonight, but that diff is on the wrong side. 3rd Gen should be in the 60" range for axle width. As Jason said, Wagoneer's are cheap and plentiful. Just to throw it out there, someone should really have a Toy axle built off that jig so that when the time comes for Steve, he is not the guinea pig. 5k for a 44 with CTM's and Warn alloy shafts, high pinion, etc. Or you can put Longfields in a Toy... Good work pushing the envelope. I still think that one more rock could have shifted the weight and unloaded the front end...

08-20-2003, 07:18 PM	#8 (permalink)
SteveO Contributing Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: NM Posts: 1,848	yeah, its only money. I wish the wife could understand that concept. How ever I put it, she doesn't buy it. The early Ford Broncos were pretty heavy beasts, and they had the D44 up front. I have a friend down here in ABQ that has been wheeling a 4700lb Bronco for some time with 35" meats and Warn axles. He has never had an issue. My 4Runner, on the trail, is weighing in at about 5500lbs. I want to make sure that it doesn't break again (well under normal silly circumstances like that last obstacle I broke on). :pat: Anyhow, I'm going to be taking my time putting this thing together, and when I have all the parts stacked up in the garage, it's gonna get messy. I may have to call on the help of ABQJim and loosehead to give me a hand. Or at least, sit around and drink a few cokes while they watch me bust a few knuckles. When I get the thing started, you can bet the IFS parts will be doled out pretty quick. __________________ http://www.Hunt4Steve.com In the span of time, life is short. Our life is like a wave on the ocean, a flower in the field, here today and gone tomorrow. Know yourself, know where you will spend eternity, for NOTHING else will matter when you die. Last edited by SteveO; 03-26-2007 at 11:27 AM.

08-20-2003, 07:35 PM	#9 (permalink)
RTdawgs Contributing Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: Georgia Posts: 2,066

08-20-2003, 07:57 PM	#10 (permalink)
Albuquerque Jim Contributing Member Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Albuquerque, NM Posts: 2,570	SteveO you know I will be there! I've skinned more than one knuckle wrenchin' __________________ '00 SR5, "Highlander" Dual Cases, Aisin Hubs, E-Lock'd, Cryo'd, Chromo'd, ARB'd, 315's, Sonoran Steel Bumper, Lift & UCA's, 4 Crawl 1" BL, Armored...etc. F-Toy #081 in progress Dual Cases, 30 Splines, 5.71's, E-lockers, Hydro-Assist, 37's, DOM Hendrix Chassis, 80Proof, ORS, Sonoran Steel...etc.

08-20-2003, 09:35 PM	#11 (permalink)
NCSU-4runner Contributing Member Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Raleigh NC Posts: 1,597	whoops, missed the fact that the new runners have driver side diffs, i was thinking about the axles im looking at for my 2nd gen. __________________ Jeremy, 94 4Runner Turbo Leaf Spring SAS front - Coilover 4link rear (starts December) / Supra Swap My Truck is featured on Supracharged.com - Home of the original Supra swap and Forum One of two things will happen, I will die, or the truck will be finished. I'm not sure which will be first.

08-21-2003, 08:38 AM	#12 (permalink)
Flygtenstein Registered User Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Fort Collins, CO Posts: 4,246	Did you notice the Nissan in the parking lot at Chinamen's? Some of the fab work looked a little suspect, but it was a pretty well set-up, low-lift coil-ver front end. Something that I could really see in the front of your runner. FRORF makes some pretty neat stuff, if it were my rig I would not hesitate going with his axle. Custom width, custom diff side...

08-21-2003, 08:43 AM	#13 (permalink)
crash Registered User Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: GOLDBAR BABY!!! Posts: 907	i SAY, use a d44, you won't be sorry.. __________________ *STUFF for SALE*

08-21-2003, 01:20 PM	#14 (permalink)
wimpywade94 Registered User Join Date: May 2003 Location: benton city wa Posts: 1,320	hey know when you start this sas dont forget to buy the beers, i mean pepsi's first...i did that the other day and had to make a beer run dirty!! boy that sucks to.... later wade ps get enough for 3 days at least! __________________ 86 runner, rebuilt motor, egr block off, headman header, 3"bl, 33x12.5 m/t's. Lots of work wanted to do. limited skills, funds, time and drive. If you dont know where your going, anyplace will do.....

08-21-2003, 02:21 PM	#15 (permalink)
crawler#976 Registered User Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Chino Valley, Az. Posts: 938	K-Tons page has info on the D44 waggy swap- K-Tons Double Cab Personally, I'd stick w/ leaf spring- it's cheap and easy to get great flex vs. high buck coilovers.

08-21-2003, 08:54 PM	#16 (permalink)
PoBoy Contributing Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 2,000	This...well its what I picked up last week atleast. Im following 44Runner: You need a D44 off a 80+ grand wagoneer - driver side drop preferably w/o vaccuum disconnect. __________________ So I sold my '96 4Runner to get married...I was sad. BUT NOT ANY MORE! Check out my 1985 4Runner with 32,xxx miles! PoBoyTech.Net

08-22-2003, 08:34 AM	#20 (permalink)
PoBoy Contributing Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 2,000	Got mine for $150 after some low balling. Took 2 months to find one within driving distance (3 hour drive). Look around on http://www.jeepsunlimited.com/forums/ __________________ So I sold my '96 4Runner to get married...I was sad. BUT NOT ANY MORE! Check out my 1985 4Runner with 32,xxx miles! PoBoyTech.Net

08-23-2003, 11:00 AM	#23 (permalink)
Flygtenstein Registered User Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Fort Collins, CO Posts: 4,246	That is really a good find from Front Range. I had only heard of those axles being made for Taco's, but the prospect of having a 60" wide front end to swap my runner so that I can avoid wheel spacers and have a newer, stronger axle really is a good one. Anyone heard prices?

09-09-2003, 01:22 PM	#25 (permalink)
Flygtenstein Registered User Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Fort Collins, CO Posts: 4,246	Custom Toy front housing, ballpark guesses/estimates only: -housing $1,200 -Longfields $330 -Third, high-pinion ARB $1,500 For a touch over 3k, you are smoking. What does it cost for Warn's and CTM's? What do high-pinion axles cost in the 44 flavor? I personally like drop out thirds and completely matching gears, but that is just from the cheese point of view. My understanding after reading assorted things is that the above Toy set-up would be pretty bombproof on 37's or smaller barring obscene beatings. Having a 44 would allow tighter turning, but I am used to not turning anyway.

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