IFS ARB Install and E-Lcoker Retrofit Write-up

transalper · 11-05-2003, 05:34 PM

Here's a short write-up of my recent install:
http://www.geocities.com/transalper/lockers.htm
I got to test out the lockers again this week on a trail through a floodplain that's usually under water except during the driest part of the summer or during a drought. It's amazing how quickly it will try to slide sideways down a muddy, off-camber hill when both ends are locked.

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crawler#976 · 11-06-2003, 07:13 AM

doin' the sideways crab walk-

yup, that is typical of dual locked rigs. It will happen in virtually any type of terrain that you spin tires on, or even loose gravel.

Ice is real fun- I've been on pavement with zero forward speed and just kinda slid right down the crown of the road to the curb w/ all four spinning very slowly. it's kind of a helpless feeling. I generally just stay in 2x4 and air down.

HAVE FUN!

transalper · 11-06-2003, 08:20 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by crawler#976
doin' the sideways crab walk-

yup, that is typical of dual locked rigs. It will happen in virtually any type of terrain that you spin tires on, or even loose gravel.

Ice is real fun- I've been on pavement with zero forward speed and just kinda slid right down the crown of the road to the curb w/ all four spinning very slowly. it's kind of a helpless feeling. I generally just stay in 2x4 and air down.

HAVE FUN!

Yeah! It's all about having fun. I was doing it on purpose to see how quickly the front end would start to slide. I do a fair amount of snow wheeling here in MN (not always by choice) and that's why I had to have selectable lockers. I've seen way too many rigs with automatic lockers slide sideways down hills when open rigs were able to just walk along.

yellowspeedracer · 11-06-2003, 11:51 AM

do you really have your winch hooked into the mirror switch? that's awesome!

edit: nevermind...just read about it on your website. cool idea

ravencr · 11-20-2003, 03:20 AM

Where'd you get the ARB setup for the front? I'm trying to find the easiest and most cost effective way to get one for the front of my 4runner too, but most of the companies I've emailed never return them. I'm sure a phone call would work, but I'm in the research phase right now. I'd like a complete third or assembly(whicheve it is), so all I'd have to do is install the compressor, run the lines, and replace the assembly with the new ARB equipped one. Any recommendations?

Chris

transalper · 11-20-2003, 08:20 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by ravencr
Where'd you get the ARB setup for the front? I'd like a complete third or assembly(whicheve it is), so all I'd have to do is install the compressor, run the lines, and replace the assembly with the new ARB equipped one. Any recommendations?
Chris

I got the ARB from Mike at ExtremeOffroad and bought the IFS diff used. I was originally planning to install the ARB into the diff myself with some help, but wised up and decided to pay a shop to drop the ARB into the diff. The entire ARB IFS diff, ready to swap in, cost me around $1000, not including the compressor and fittings. If you want to go with a used IFS diff, try car-parts.com or check your local junk yards. Any shop that works on diffs should be able to do the work. Ask a lot of questions to make sure they do lockers and have done ARB setups before.

Using the ARB compressor is the easiest and cheapest option, but it is a weak unit. There are better compressors out there for not that much more moola.

ravencr · 11-20-2003, 04:10 PM

So, you buy the diff housing used so they can install the ARB into it, right? And, once you install it in your 4runner, they refund you a core charge on your existing diff housing, right? I'd really like to buy a complete third if it's the easiest way to attack this, but if there's a cheaper and not much harder, I'm all ears.

Chris

transalper · 11-20-2003, 07:33 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ravencr
So, you buy the diff housing used so they can install the ARB into it, right? And, once you install it in your 4runner, they refund you a core charge on your existing diff housing, right? I'd really like to buy a complete third if it's the easiest way to attack this, but if there's a cheaper and not much harder, I'm all ears.
Chris

No core charge from a junk yard. I'm still holding on to my original IFS diff with 4.10s. Using a used diff and getting the IFS ARB installed by a shop saves a few hundred bucks compared to buying one already set up. The only added hassle is buying all the seals, one bearing (one comes with the ARB), and dropoing it off at the shop.

ravencr · 11-21-2003, 03:25 AM

So is the reason you bought the used diff so you wouldn't have as much downtime? Could I save that money too, if I removed everything from the truck, bought the ARB separate from Mike, and then had a shop install the ARB in the housing along with the gears, and then install the diff back into the truck?

Chris

transalper · 11-21-2003, 04:10 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by ravencr
So is the reason you bought the used diff so you wouldn't have as much downtime? Could I save that money too, if I removed everything from the truck, bought the ARB separate from Mike, and then had a shop install the ARB in the housing along with the gears, and then install the diff back into the truck?
Chris

Reduced downtime and 4.30 gears were why I got the replacement diff. Yes, you could pull your IFS diff and have a shop install the ARB. That could reduce your costs by the cost of the used diff - assuming you are reusing the same gears.

ravencr · 11-21-2003, 04:25 PM

Hoe'd you determine what gears you had, and what gears you found on the used diff? I want to go with 4.88's

Chris

transalper · 11-22-2003, 08:04 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by ravencr
Hoe'd you determine what gears you had, and what gears you found on the used diff? I want to go with 4.88's
Chris

My SR5 came with 16" rims and no e-locker, so it was safe to assume it had 4.10s - that was confirmed after the swap. I confirmed the used rear 3rd had 4.30s after ordering it by counting the teeth and reading the 43 stamped on the ring gear. I confirmed the used front diff had 4.30s by measuring the number of revolutions it took to turn the axle one complete revolution.

I do not know how much the gears cost or how much that adds to the install cost. My guess is that if you are going with 4.88s then you may as well get a built complete diff. IMHO, if you are really concerned about saving some money, then I would look into finding a used front IFS diff with 4.56s and then just swapping 4.56s into your rear 3rd (you have a limited, so already have the e-locker, right?). You might actually be able to save money for the rear gear swap by getting a used e-locker 3rd that already has the 4.56s. That way you could do all the labor for the rear yourself and then sell your current e-locker 3rd. Finding decent front and rear diffs wtih 4.56s will be a feat though. For me, 4.30s are great with my 265/75R16s and are a good on/off road compromise.

AznSky · 11-22-2003, 08:09 AM

Chris if you plan on going 4.88's up front, you're going to have to regear the rear also.

If I plan on building up my rig more, I'm going with 4.88's and arbs fr/rr. But most likely I'll have to buy everything new or put together already, and pay a shop to do it (which will cost a fortune) which is why I'm holding off to see what the future holds and if I wanna build up more or not.

ravencr · 11-22-2003, 06:46 PM

I'm going to probably get 4.88's front and rear, and get a fully built ARB'd third up front. I know today out on the difficult trails at Windrock, I could have definitely used on up front a couple of times. Plus, I hate where the gas tank is located on our vehicles, and that's something else I'm going to change in the near future too.

Chris

Breezey · 12-02-2003, 03:21 PM

hehe hey you put your buttons like mine

http://www.toy4runner.com/lift_Install/new/DSC00180.JPG

runnerboy97 · 12-02-2003, 03:52 PM

Do you have manual hubs. Isnt it recomended that you have them with a front locker, even an ARB. Or am i mistaken on this. I am looking at installing my lockers installed over christmas, tryin to figure this whole thing out.

transalper · 12-02-2003, 07:41 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by runnerboy97
Do you have manual hubs. Isnt it recomended that you have them with a front locker, even an ARB. Or am i mistaken on this. I am looking at installing my lockers installed over christmas, tryin to figure this whole thing out.

I do not have manual hubs. Manual hubs would be nice, but are not required if you install a selectable front locker. Manual hubs reduce CV wear, allow for a bit more lift in the front, and sometimes improve fuel economy. ARB does suggest using manual hubs with the ADD system because if the front locker is accidentally engaged in 2wd the driveshaft will go from zero to your current speed and potentially blow up your front diff. I just make sure to only engage the front locker in 4wd.

I suppose front auto lockers like lockrights would force the driveshaft to spin all the time unless manual hubs are installed.

11-06-2003, 11:51 AM	#4 (permalink)
yellowspeedracer Registered User Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Littleton, CO Posts: 291	do you really have your winch hooked into the mirror switch? that's awesome! edit: nevermind...just read about it on your website. cool idea Last edited by yellowspeedracer; 11-06-2003 at 05:43 PM.

11-20-2003, 03:20 AM	#5 (permalink)
ravencr Registered User Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Severance, CO Posts: 4,728	Where'd you get the ARB setup for the front? I'm trying to find the easiest and most cost effective way to get one for the front of my 4runner too, but most of the companies I've emailed never return them. I'm sure a phone call would work, but I'm in the research phase right now. I'd like a complete third or assembly(whicheve it is), so all I'd have to do is install the compressor, run the lines, and replace the assembly with the new ARB equipped one. Any recommendations? Chris __________________ http://www.utvrally.com http://www.utvevents.com http://www.cartwheelin.com

11-20-2003, 04:10 PM	#7 (permalink)
ravencr Registered User Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Severance, CO Posts: 4,728	So, you buy the diff housing used so they can install the ARB into it, right? And, once you install it in your 4runner, they refund you a core charge on your existing diff housing, right? I'd really like to buy a complete third if it's the easiest way to attack this, but if there's a cheaper and not much harder, I'm all ears. Chris __________________ http://www.utvrally.com http://www.utvevents.com http://www.cartwheelin.com

11-21-2003, 03:25 AM	#9 (permalink)
ravencr Registered User Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Severance, CO Posts: 4,728	So is the reason you bought the used diff so you wouldn't have as much downtime? Could I save that money too, if I removed everything from the truck, bought the ARB separate from Mike, and then had a shop install the ARB in the housing along with the gears, and then install the diff back into the truck? Chris __________________ http://www.utvrally.com http://www.utvevents.com http://www.cartwheelin.com

11-21-2003, 04:25 PM	#11 (permalink)
ravencr Registered User Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Severance, CO Posts: 4,728	Hoe'd you determine what gears you had, and what gears you found on the used diff? I want to go with 4.88's Chris __________________ http://www.utvrally.com http://www.utvevents.com http://www.cartwheelin.com

11-06-2003, 07:13 AM	#2 (permalink)
crawler#976 Registered User Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Chino Valley, Az. Posts: 938	doin' the sideways crab walk- yup, that is typical of dual locked rigs. It will happen in virtually any type of terrain that you spin tires on, or even loose gravel. Ice is real fun- I've been on pavement with zero forward speed and just kinda slid right down the crown of the road to the curb w/ all four spinning very slowly. it's kind of a helpless feeling. I generally just stay in 2x4 and air down. HAVE FUN!

11-22-2003, 08:09 AM	#13 (permalink)
AznSky Registered User Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 2,796	Chris if you plan on going 4.88's up front, you're going to have to regear the rear also. If I plan on building up my rig more, I'm going with 4.88's and arbs fr/rr. But most likely I'll have to buy everything new or put together already, and pay a shop to do it (which will cost a fortune) which is why I'm holding off to see what the future holds and if I wanna build up more or not. __________________ Rob

11-22-2003, 06:46 PM	#14 (permalink)
ravencr Registered User Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Severance, CO Posts: 4,728	I'm going to probably get 4.88's front and rear, and get a fully built ARB'd third up front. I know today out on the difficult trails at Windrock, I could have definitely used on up front a couple of times. Plus, I hate where the gas tank is located on our vehicles, and that's something else I'm going to change in the near future too. Chris __________________ http://www.utvrally.com http://www.utvevents.com http://www.cartwheelin.com

12-02-2003, 03:21 PM	#15 (permalink)
Breezey Guest Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Roseville, CA Posts: 536	hehe hey you put your buttons like mine http://www.toy4runner.com/lift_Install/new/DSC00180.JPG

12-02-2003, 03:52 PM	#16 (permalink)
runnerboy97 Registered User Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Roanoke, VA Posts: 1,017	Do you have manual hubs. Isnt it recomended that you have them with a front locker, even an ARB. Or am i mistaken on this. I am looking at installing my lockers installed over christmas, tryin to figure this whole thing out. __________________ 1997 4runner,lifted, locked, dash and grille mounted red LED lights, its my DD 1988 4runner, SAS, dual lockers, dual cases, longfields, 36's, and lots more.

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