io

Aussie Lockers offers their product for my 1996 Tacoma V6 4x4, but only for the front differential.
I take this truck 4-wheeling in Colorado a couple of times a year. the rest of the time it's used for general truck duties and commuting in the winter.

Now using a locker in the winter on snow and ice is not a smart thing to do.

Now for what I was thinking.
Install the Aussie locker in the front diff.
My truck's got ADD, which is vacuum operated. What if I disconnect the automatic vaccum actuation thing during most normal use. That way I'm accomplishing the same thing as if I had manual hubs and only locked one side. If I understand how lockers work I'd essentially get one front wheel drive, then my open diff in the back. This _should_ give me acceptable handling in the snow and ice.
Then when I get to a trailhead, I'll just reattach the vaccuum lines to the diff and have a locked front end. Which should make up for how often I end up with one wheel in the air on the pickup.

Not sure how this would effect front end wear and gas mileage in 2wd mode.

The idea to do it this way is to keep from having to buy front manual hubs because I can't afford it right now, but I am heading down to Colorado for my camping and 4x4ing vacation next month.

Feedback? Oh yeah, and I'll be installing the aussie locker myself...

Oh, and yes I did a search, but didn't find anyone who's done this setup

wimpywade94

sounds like a bad idea,
im sure someone else will chime in about it.

wade

CynicX

he said "If I understand how lockers work I'd essentially get one front wheel drive, then my open diff in the back. This _should_ give me acceptable handling in the snow and ice."

Thats what all 4x4 have unless they are locked in the front. One open in the front and one open in the back. He wants to know how to disable the locker in the front so he has normal 4x4 for snow driving...

CynicX

and to answer the question....i dont THINK this will work. Auto lockers like the aussie are torque senstive....So as long as the drive shaft is spinning the locker will be working.

Unless you can get the wheel to disengage from the axle it wont work. Maybe you have a better understanding of the truck or I'm not understanding what your saying. I believe you can convert to manual hubs though.

Another thing. Lockers are bad in the snow, rear lockers. The problem is the rear wheels are pushing the front and fighting the weight of the vehicle with both tires spinning makes it want to side step. The front is pulling and the back is gonna be following. You shouldnt have too much trouble as long as you are careful.

Also the wheels in the back spin in a p/u alot in the snow cause of no weight over the wheels. In the front you have the weight of the cab and motor. I really dont think it will be all that bad in the snow. You will have more tractions but it might want to wander a little if you are spinning since you wont have one tire holding you still.

jimbo74

cynic is right..... if you defeat the add and get autohubs, the nthe lcoker up front is fine with the hubs disconnected.... but this one wheel drive idea will not work.... it esentially becomes 3 wheel drive and with one front will pulling all the time that would just be bad....

io

The way I understand the ADD to work is there is a solenoid operated shaft to the right of the differential. This shaft slides left and/or right, either locking the drivers side wheel to the drivers side differential output shaft.
So when it's in the open position the drivers side wheel freewheels, and the passenger side wheel is connected to the diff.
So in my theoretical situation it's the same effect as running with manual hubs and only locking one side. A practice that I understand is common for people running lockers.

Well in winter I usually drive in 2wd because it's funner. I only used 4wd when there are other cars around or when I'm straight lining it on the highway.

Speaking of push and pull. With an open diff in the back power will always go to the outside wheel. With the front power always going to the passenger side wheel I'd have the front pulling the rear in right hand turns, but the opposite effect in left hand turns.

Is there any other traction aiding device for us people that drive in snow and ice? ARB Air lockers are noisy and hellishly expensive. E-Lockers would require replacing the entire rear axle, once again hellishly expensive. Any other options? The TRD slutch type limited slip diff wouldn't be too bad in the snow, but I doubt I'd get enough locking action during rock crawling for it to make a difference.

io

Why would that be bad?
With an open differential you always have only one wheel driving. It just changes from left to right depending on which wheel has the least resistance to turning.

Perhaps I should phrase the question differently.
Anyone have a locker in the front and manual hubs? Do you run with just one front wheel in ice and snow?

midiwall

Oh crap.

I read it as "one front wheel drive, then open my diff in the back..." as in "open" being a verb, saying that he was going to leave the rear diff undriven and run it FWD.

I deleted the message to avoid people going "wtf is Mark saying now?".

my bad. carry on.

4Crawler

iTrader: (3)

An open diff does not mean one wheel drive, it means you have equal torque sent to each wheel. If both wheels have equal traction, you'll have both wheels driving. If one tire has low traction, then you will only have that same low torque to each wheel and likely you will have one tire spinning and one standing still.

Never run one front wheel drive with mine, but have used with and without the front ARB locked. I find I often lock the front axle and leave the rear open for deep snow. I know folks who have done 3WD on trails for easier steering. So it has been done.

io

Well I just ordered the front Aussie today. I located the wiring at the transfer case that switches the front ADD from on to off, and I'll just tap into that wiring to have manual control of my front axle.
It should be fine for the rest of the summer. This winter I'll update everyone and let them know about the benefits/drawbacks of running an Aussie front and an open rear.

Oh, and if anyone's got ane-locker in minnesota that wants to trade.... I'll do all of the work....

EWAYota

why not just switch to manual hubs??

crawler#976

first off, I'm locked - hard locked w/ a spool. Had a front Detroit tho, it was no better...

So, no I don't run with one hub locked, I run 2x4 until it's absolutely required. One hub locked makes my rig squirley as he!! in any condition, let alone on ice. The torque steer is nutty - pulls hard one way under with power on, the other when it's off...

Secondly, you've added a ton (pun intended - it's probably way more) more load to only one half of the axle. Not the best idea...

io

Money and time.
As far as I understand it, not only would I have to buy the $150 kit from Warn, but I'd also have to convert the hubs or just get some hubs from a boneyard. Unfortuantealy I've tried calling junkyards around here and I can't seem to find late-model Toyota trucks.

So that makes for a whole lotta money and effort to replace something that I don't think needs replacing. Why fix it if it isn't broken? Gas mileage? Spending $500 to get 1 or 2 more mpg isn't gong to pay off for quite awhile, even with todays gasoline prices. At 10,000 miles per year I'd save $50 to $100 per year. Not really worth it.

io

Maybe it'll all backfire on me. Maybe not. Seems like most people don't bother doing a front locker and an open rear. I want to keep the open rear because my truck is so fun to drive in snow in 2wd. Then I'll use the 4wd only when needed in winter. Most of the time I'm pretty stable in 2wd in winter, though some highway cruising I've had to run 4wd to keep the front from trying to pass me. So in those instances I'll run eith 3wd or 4wd. I'll have a switch inside the cab to select one or the other.

And if it sucks completely in the snow I'll just remove it and sell it.

As far as on the trail. Usually I end up with one front wheel in the air, while the live axle has enough articulation to keep both rear wheels on the ground. So it should help there, and help in those rare occasions when I've got two wheels in the air. I'm sure I'll like it's response to the truck on the trail.

In 4-low I'll have to be soft on the gas pedal to keep from overstressing one axle, but I already am so that won't be a totally new thing for me.

Seemed like everyone hates Locker in the snow. And the ones that hate them usually have them in the rear. Doing some thinking about thrust angles and different distances traveled by each axle a rear locker will try to push an open front diff. Which should give a loose feeling to the rear end. A locker in the front (with the front axle locked) should pull the rear end. This should keep the rear in line and not trying to pass the front, even if it'll try to steer straight or understeer under power. Understeer should be more controllable than oversteer.
Currently I try to oversteer with the throttle in 2wd all of the time, in a controlled manner, with 31" snow tires. Then is there is traffic around I swap into 4wd and deal with the factory understeer. Shouldn't be too different with a locker in front, just more understeer in 4wd.
What exactly the 3wd will do I'm not entirely sure, but I'll have the opportunity to easily compare since I can switch between 3wd and 4wd on the fly from an electrical switch in the cab of the truck. Or in 3wd the front should freewheel when I'm not on the gas.

Seems like it'll work fine to me. Maybe I'll have to adjust my driving style, but not in a way that I won't be able to handle. For either 3wd or 4wd situations. If this works out well it'll probably open up alot of possibilities to snow people. If not, I'll have tried and learned something from it.

Ideally I would've liked to have a trutrac in the front, and an elocker in the rear. That way I could run 2wd open in the snow for fun. 4wd lsd in the snow when I need it, and locked rear on the gnarly trails. But they don't make a true-trac for the front diff on the tacomas. Just the rear. And I like my open rear for how it handles (fun and controlled slides, she slides when I'm on the gas, and recovers the second I come off of the gas) in snow. With an LSD rear it's spin both rear tires and slide alot farther and less controllable.

I'd still like a rear e-locker. But since my truck has the 8.4" rear differential I'd have to find an entire axle to swap out. I can't seem to find those except with a rather dear price attached to it.

My main concern now is installing it Since I've never installed a diff before.
And being as the truck's now seen three salty winters I might have trouble getting some of the bolts undone. Especially to get the CV axles out. But it'll be good practice in case I end up breaking on on the trail.
Anyone in Minneapolis area wanna give me a hand or some advice? I'll buy the beer...

dlbrunner

I think you will be ok in 2wd because the front drive shaft is not spinning with power from the t-case, thus no power to the front wheels; however, if you forget to engage the ADD and put it in 4wd that may cause problems, but probably not. I have seen a scenario where a vehicle had hubs on all 4 wheels, it was stuck in mud and the camber of the hill was such that it was being pulled downhill, the dude unlocked the downhill side front and rear, and pulled back up onto the road. I vote for giving it a shot

oly884

Honestly, I had a locker in the snow, and not once had a problem. Hell, the times where it was patchy, I placed on tire on the dry side and one on the ice, and had no problem, try that with an open diff and it won't work. It's just getting used to it. I was in it for almost 5 months and another month off and on. A rear locker is a MUCH better route IMHO. I was paranoid as well when I first got it, but I think that people tend to hype up the worry about a locker in the snow.

joez

You must not be doing a lot of research on people who actually own them. Do some people not like them, yes, but to say everybody hates it is horribly far from the truth. I love my lockright, this past winter i drove arround in 2wd the entire time, and that was on TSL's. It drove better in 2wd with a rear locker than it does in 4wd open in the snow. Change you driving habits and drive smart and you wont have any issues at all. Most people i hear complain about them are the same types that complain that their tires are to loud on the road, or havent owned one. I know tons of people who love their rear auto-lockers, and very few people who dont like them.

As it was already said, the torque steer you will get from having only one hub locked will be bad. Worse than any ill effects of a rear locker. Your gonna have some weird handling traits with that setup on the road.

One other thing you are forgetting about when off road is weight transfer. Think about it for a bit and you may realize what i mean by that. You would be much better off with a rear locker than a front, IMHO.

Blizzard

I've a Detroit Soft Locker in the rear and an Aussie Locker in front. I love them! Specially the Aussie!

Little hijack: crawler, with a front Detroit is hard to steer? With my Aussie I don't have any problem to steer, powering or not the wheels. I noticed the Soft Locker tends to do the wheels chirp a lot more than my Aussie.

David

crawler#976

[hijack = on]

Blizzard-

Never really knew how often the Detroit was unlocked while turning on tight trails- until I went with the spool up front. Steering effort w/ a front Detroit was bad, but with the spool it's horrible. My next major mod - if I keep the truck, will be a hydro-assist ram. [hijack = off]

_______________

Given a choice, I'll take a rear locked rig over an unlocked rig in any condition, anytime, anywhere...