Way to advance timing on 5VZ-FE?
07-01-2011, 11:34 AM
#1
Registered User
Thread Starter
Way to advance timing on 5VZ-FE?
Hi guys,
I recently bought a '97 4Runner 4x4 with the 3.4 v6. Coming from the GM scene, I'm used to flashing the PCM to bascily make it do whatever you want. After several hours of research it seems the Toyota ECU doesn't operate this way.
My question is, is there a way to advance the ignition timing? I'm hoping there's an easy way to advance the timing for when I'm traveling down the highway and the engine is around 2k RPMs to pick up a few MPGs.
I recently bought a '97 4Runner 4x4 with the 3.4 v6. Coming from the GM scene, I'm used to flashing the PCM to bascily make it do whatever you want. After several hours of research it seems the Toyota ECU doesn't operate this way.
My question is, is there a way to advance the ignition timing? I'm hoping there's an easy way to advance the timing for when I'm traveling down the highway and the engine is around 2k RPMs to pick up a few MPGs.
07-01-2011, 04:15 PM
#3
Registered User
Thread Starter
Yes, I know that it's all controlled by the ECU. But is there not a why to fool the computer into running a bit more timing? I know people have advanced the timing on their motors, and I'm trying to figure out what the easiest (read: least expensive) way is.
07-01-2011, 04:49 PM
#4
Oh, there's ways. For enough $$$.
http://www.urdusa.com/Electronics-Pe..._72/index.html
http://www.gadgetonline.com/U-Tune.pdf
http://www.urdusa.com/Electronics-Pe..._72/index.html
Delaying a Signal:
By intercepting a signal and delaying when it gets to the ECU we can alter time
critical signals. The most typical way this technique is used is to control ignition
timing.
Normally on modern vehicles there is a magnetic sensor that sits close to a ring
that is attached to the crankshaft and this ring has notches on it. As each of
these notches passes the magnetic sensor it will induce a pulse into the sensor
wire. These notched rings may have a notch or two missing at one point or will
not have any notches until a certain point. It is this difference in notches and the
signal it generates that tells the ECU what position the crankshaft is in. The ECU
needs this information to decide when to fire the spark plugs and fuel injectors.
Now if this pulsed signal is intercepted and delayed before it is allowed to
continue to the ECU we can change when the spark plugs are fired. If we delay
it a little we can retard the ignition timing. If we delay it a whole bunch, say 350
degrees, we can end up making the spark plugs fire 10 degrees sooner, making
it advance the ignition timing.
By intercepting a signal and delaying when it gets to the ECU we can alter time
critical signals. The most typical way this technique is used is to control ignition
timing.
Normally on modern vehicles there is a magnetic sensor that sits close to a ring
that is attached to the crankshaft and this ring has notches on it. As each of
these notches passes the magnetic sensor it will induce a pulse into the sensor
wire. These notched rings may have a notch or two missing at one point or will
not have any notches until a certain point. It is this difference in notches and the
signal it generates that tells the ECU what position the crankshaft is in. The ECU
needs this information to decide when to fire the spark plugs and fuel injectors.
Now if this pulsed signal is intercepted and delayed before it is allowed to
continue to the ECU we can change when the spark plugs are fired. If we delay
it a little we can retard the ignition timing. If we delay it a whole bunch, say 350
degrees, we can end up making the spark plugs fire 10 degrees sooner, making
it advance the ignition timing.
Last edited by MudHippy; 07-02-2011 at 10:29 AM.
07-02-2011, 09:07 AM
#5
Contributing Member
There are really expensive ways to do it but no simple ways. Sadly our ECU's are NOHING like GM ECU's. You can retard the timing without too much trouble but advancing it needs a VERY high end piggy back or a full stand alone.
07-03-2011, 10:05 AM
#6
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You also need to be careful about detonation with the 5vz engine even in stock tune. With that being said, I know that some GM ECU's could be fooled into a more aggresive timing map by inducing a fake lower IAT (Intake Air Temp). Not sure if the Toyota ECU would do the same, just saying.
07-03-2011, 10:35 AM
#7
Contributing Member
You also need to be careful about detonation with the 5vz engine even in stock tune. With that being said, I know that some GM ECU's could be fooled into a more aggresive timing map by inducing a fake lower IAT (Intake Air Temp). Not sure if the Toyota ECU would do the same, just saying.
Yeah, under 3k the knock sensor is not active and on 87oct it is possible to knock it on a hot day under load.
The GM ECU are actually fully tunable unless you are talking about the old school ones.
There is areal old thread with details on how to trick the 4runner ECU by adjusting the temp sensor signal though. It had it limits and had some downsides IIRC but it worked to an extent.
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07-05-2011, 07:30 AM
#8
Registered User
Thread Starter
Yeah, under 3k the knock sensor is not active and on 87oct it is possible to knock it on a hot day under load.
The GM ECU are actually fully tunable unless you are talking about the old school ones.
There is areal old thread with details on how to trick the 4runner ECU by adjusting the temp sensor signal though. It had it limits and had some downsides IIRC but it worked to an extent.
The GM ECU are actually fully tunable unless you are talking about the old school ones.
There is areal old thread with details on how to trick the 4runner ECU by adjusting the temp sensor signal though. It had it limits and had some downsides IIRC but it worked to an extent.
And why on earth would Toyota have the ECU not monitor the knock sensors under 3k RPMs? That seems like a terrible design...
07-05-2011, 10:02 AM
#9
Contributing Member
Yep, thats why we have to use piggybacks when we go for more power. Sucks really.
I think the reason it doesn't monitor the knock sensor under that is because there is too much noise down there and it could not get an accurate reading of knock.
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