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All,

After my truck reaches operating temperature the water pump has this cyclical ticking and chirping sound coming from it. It goes: tick tick tick tick tick... chirp chirp chirp chirp chirp... tick tick tick tick tick... etc.

I used the stethoscope trick with a piece of heater hose. And the mechanic that just did my alignment and wheel balance agreed it's coming from the water pump.

My question is: do the water pumps have any notoriety for failure or something similar?

Next diagnosis steps?

Thanks.

rworegon

Water pumps can wear out the bearing. Are you sure it's the water pump and not the false water pump i.e. the fan bracket bearing that mounts the fan clutch?

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rworegon,

What bearing are you talking about? Is there a bearing in the water pump proper or is it attached to the "false water pump" you referenced?

I guess I need to look into the engine bay and become more aware of where each of these components is located.

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All,

So today I grabbed the fan clutch and wiggled it back and forth. It has the tiniest amount of play in it. I'm assuming that leads one to think the bearing is bad and that is what the sound is coming from. The fan clutch doesn't have a bearing, right? So the wiggle would have to be coming from the water pump, right?

Any thoughts or experience on this from anyone?

Thanks a ton.

vasinvictor

iTrader: (3)

After you do your timing belt job once you'll be "in the know" about how everything lays out. There is a bearing in the water pump that could be getting squeaky. There is also a bearing in the "false water pump". This is just in front (toward bumper) of the water pump and the fan clutch and pulleys attach to. It also has a bearing that could squeak and chirp. Of course it could be your idlers too. When was the last timing belt change? Might be time to get "in the know" and do it all.

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vasinvictor,

Sorry for the confusion. I drive a 2RZ. I know most people in here are V6 folks. I wish I had a V6 but don't. I still get amazing info from this forum though.

For the 2RZ I don't think it has the false water pump. The fan clutch connects directly to the water pump.

This morning when it was cold (45 F) I gave the radiator fan a spin. It resisted the first three spins and after that I could free spin it. It had no resistance. I waited about three minutes and spun it again. The same thing happened. It had resistance for three spins and then I could free spin it. I can't hear any noise from the bearing but that doesn't mean anything unless you ear is right on it.

Also while cold I can move the fan clutch side to side just a bit. It moves just enough to notice. So maybe the fan clutch bearing is going bad. Can you replace just the bearing or the whole thing?

Any other thoughts would be great.

Thank you.

TheDurk

I don't know if an FC can make that kind of noise. I've had two die (on different cars) and both failed in silence. I do know you can't tell much from spinning unless it is completely without resistance. You cannot just replace the bearing, AFAIK. Here is how to test (from a BMW board, but applies perfectly to ours):

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TheDurk,

Thanks for the word. I'll give that a test.

So last night I pulled off the PS belt first and listened. It was still there.
Then I pulled off the AC belt and re-installed the PS belt and listened. It was still there.

So the noise is from the alt/WP belt.

I'm thinking I'll just wait until the noise is loud enough to hear in the cab. I can only hear it when the hood is up or if I'm in a drive-through and the sound has a chance to bounce off of car in front and wall on my L.

Stethoscope in the mail next week. That will help pinpoint the spot for sure.

Any other thoughts from folks?

Thank you.

Up&Down

So the ticking/chirping was my harmonic balancer or crankshaft pulley. The rubber had broken loose. The outer metal lip would slide in and out. The ticking was when it slid out toward the radiator and chirping was when it slid in toward the engine. It would chirp as it hit the oil pump housing. It wasn't bad, just a slight shiny spot in the metal.

So now I get the pleasure of replacing my HB. I've managed to get it off. Now I have to replace the seal and figure out how to hold the pulley in place while I torque it to 195 foot pounds.

Maybe this will fix the vibration that I've had for years (see "vibration while stopped in drive").

I'll report back after installation and test drive.

Thanks all.

vasinvictor

iTrader: (3)

Wow nice job finding the problem. If you've got room, and impact gun makes quick work of tightening it down. Otherwise you can make a crankshaft holding tool using some ingenuity. There are a few good examples floating around here if you search for it. Probably $10 in materials.

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vasinvictor,

Thanks for the words of encouragement. I ran the engine with no belts on and the HB was wobbling like crazy. Dead give-a-way. I got it off with the breaker bar/bump the engine over trick. Worked perfect. I don't have time to make the tool- though I wish I could. I need to get this thing back on the road so I dropped $67 on the Schley tool to make it a snap to get it back on. Tool, HB, seal, and bolt should be in tomorrow.

Is there something else I should be looking to replace while I'm doing this job? Someone mentioned an oil pump o-ring but I think this was specific to a non 2rz engine.

Thanks.

vasinvictor

iTrader: (3)

I'll let someone else comment. I know nothing of the 2rz.

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I just pulled the seal out with a seal puller. The edges of the seal puller were rough and nicked two places in the bore. Is the best practice to sand them down smooth then put the seal in? It's not bad but I can feel them with my finger.

Is there a better way to remove seals?

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The rain quit for a couple of hours after work yesterday and allowed me to sand the small burr on the oil pump housing. It wasn't inside the bore so it shouldn't cause a problem for the oil seal.

I was able to get the new seal in with a tool I made using a scientific Nalgene bottle cap (large). I drilled a whole that was just big enough for the crank pulley bolt. The diameter of the bottle cap was about 2 mm smaller than the diameter of the oil seal (good fit). I just threaded the bolt through the cap lined the outer edge of the cap with the seal and slowly tightened it down until it was seated. I'd pulled it off in between several tightenings to make sure it was seating evenly and smoothly. When I crank it up we'll see if it works.

I put the new HB on as well. It comes with a sort of tacky black coating of some sort. I'm guessing it's for metal protection. I opted to remove it with acetone on the part that will be spinning in the oil seal. I lubed the HB with some motor oil and pushed it on, rotated it until the key slot lined up and pressed it the rest of the way in.

Then I threaded the crank pulley bolt and used the Schley special tool to hold the pulley in place. I wanted to build some of the tools that you guys have posted here (cool). I just don't have the time. The Schley is only $64 and my time is easily worth that. If it were $200 then I'd take the time to build a pulley stabilizing tool. The Schley tool worked perfect. I just rested the breaker bar inserted in the Schley tool on the truck frame, clicked the torque wrench to 195 and tightened her down. Then it got dark.

Next I'll check the torque on that new bolt one more time and rotate the engine by hand through two full revolutions to make sure all is still organized inside (it should be). Then I'll turn it over with the coil unplugged through a few revolutions. Then I'll connect the drive belt for the alt, WP, and rad fan and crank it up proper.

Then drive it around the parking lot a bit until she warms up and look for leaks. If none, then put the PS and AC belts on.

Thanks all for your input and listening to my rants.

And I finally have a hefty torque wrench for the collection.

One last word of caution for others who have had their HBs go out. On mine the rubber separated and the outer metal rim may have actually rotated around the rubber on the inside. This means the TDC mark on the pulley doesn't line up with TDC. Not good. Thinking back I checked my valve clearances using this and it may have been off though the cam lobes looked like they were supposed to. Hopefully the HB separation is relatively new and doesn't go back far enough to affect my valve clearance measurements (they were all in spec).

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All is well. No oil leaks. Smooth operation with the new HB.